The Game Is Afoot: For all things Sherlockian

[foxley]

Spinning out of the Who is more iconic: Sherlock Holmes, or Batman? thread, I thought I wold create a thread to discuss the world's greatest detective.

So jump on in. Any incarnation of the Great Detective is fair game: books, films, TV shows, comics, video games...

So there is nothing more to say except:

The Game Is Afoot!

[foxley]

Does “very physical” mean “built like a WWE wrestler” like Henry Cavill who played Sherlock in the recent Netflix film Enola Holmes? Has anyone seen that?

I haven't seen Enola Holmes yet, but of the actors I've seen portray Holmes, I think Christopher Lee had the right level of physicality. He had Holmes' imposing height and a fencer's build, which implies strength without being musclebound like a wrestler. (Lee, like many actors of his generation, was a trained fencer. Count Dooku's lightsaber style was designed to take advantage of Lee's fencing skills.)

[The no face guy]

[achilles]

I haven't seen Enola Holmes yet, but of the actors I've seen portray Holmes, I think Christopher Lee had the right level of physicality. He had Holmes' imposing height and a fencer's build, which implies strength without being musclebound like a wrestler. (Lee, like many actors of his generation, was a trained fencer. Count Dooku's lightsaber style was designed to take advantage of Lee's fencing skills.)

There was a story where a huge, villianous doctor bent his fireplace poker into a U shape as a show of strength and intimidation. Holmes just unbent it with a single effort. He was not described as muscle bound IIRC, but rather lean but very strong.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

There was a story where a huge, villianous doctor bent his fireplace poker into a U shape as a show of strength and intimidation. Holmes just unbent it with a single effort. He was not described as muscle bound IIRC, but rather lean but very strong.

That scene was displayed in "The Speckled Band", and it was Jeremy Brett who pulled off that surprising feat of strength.

[achilles]

That scene was displayed in "The Speckled Band", and it was Jeremy Brett who pulled off that surprising feat of strength.

Well, on TV. I was recalling the actual Conan Doyle story. But it was characteristic of Holmes, who did indeed indulge in the occasional boxing match, RDJ's Wing Chun notwithstanding. Baritsu too, which seems to have been a real martial art and apparently still is, (though rare). He was much stronger than he appeared, a theme Conan Doyle returned to a few times. Enough so that you believed it whenever he had a moment like that, or with Moriarty.

[Greg Hatcher]

Well, on TV. I was recalling the actual Conan Doyle story. But it was characteristic of Holmes, who did indeed indulge in the occasional boxing match, RDJ's Wing Chun notwithstanding. Baritsu too, which seems to have been a real martial art and apparently still is, (though rare). He was much stronger than he appeared, a theme Conan Doyle returned to a few times. Enough so that you believed it whenever he had a moment like that, or with Moriarty.

Andrew Salmon has done a couple of Sherlocks for the FIGHT CARD series of pulp adventures, about Holmes' adventures in the London boxing scene in the 1890s. Gathered in this collection.

Peter David had a cool theory about the final struggle between the Professor and Holmes at Reichenbach-- he thinks Moriarty was committing suicide-by-cop. Holmes was way younger, an expert boxer and singlestick champion, and the Professor was an old guy with what sounds like Parkinson's from Doyle's description (the 'reptilian oscillation' of the head.) And yet he arranged matters so his final confrontation with Holmes would be alone, along a path at the edge of a cliff. Such a master manipulator must have known fisticuffs were inevitable and he had no chance against Sherlock Holmes in a fair fight. Ergo, he WANTED Holmes to kill him. QED.

In my own small contributions to Sherlockian lore I've speculated that Holmes picked up some Asian martial arts moves during the Great Hiatus, when he was traveling through Nepal. In the new one there's a bit where I had him take our a gunman that way and Rob Davis did such a great job with the illustration of Holmes massaging his karate hand afterward that I bought the original off him.



Incidentally, if you are a Holmes person, i think you'd enjoy the Consulting Detective series, and I don't say that just because stories of mine are in them. There are all sorts of pastiches featuring Holmes and Watson updated, gender-flipped, meeting famous folks of the time both fictional and real like Dracula or Oscar Wilde... but hardly anyone just does straight Holmes stories any more. Well, that's what we do in Consulting Detective... just straight-up Holmes and Watson fighting crime in Victorian London. I've done six of them so far and it's always fun.

[Riv86672]

I haven't seen Enola Holmes yet, but of the actors I've seen portray Holmes, I think Christopher Lee had the right level of physicality. He had Holmes' imposing height and a fencer's build, which implies strength without being musclebound like a wrestler. (Lee, like many actors of his generation, was a trained fencer. Count Dooku's lightsaber style was designed to take advantage of Lee's fencing skills.)

Basil Rathbone was a fencer as well; British Army Fencing Champion twice!
Rathbone was 6’2” 170lbs compared to Lee’s 6’5” 176.

I’m willing to overlook physical resemblance, but heck yeah, those two guys nailed Holmes’ height and lean physicality!

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Basil Rathbone was a fencer as well; British Army Fencing Champion twice!
Rathbone was 6’2” 170lbs compared to Lee’s 6’5” 176.

I’m willing to overlook physical resemblance, but heck yeah, those two guys nailed Holmes’ height and lean physicality!

Jeremy Brett was 6 foot 1 and also had the lean physique most attributed to Holmes.

[foxley]

Jeremy Brett was 6 foot 1 and also had the lean physique most attributed to Holmes.

This might be another reason why I found Edward Woodward miscast. He was 5"9' and a very solid build.

[achilles]

This might be another reason why I found Edward Woodward miscast. He was 5"9' and a very solid build.

Though that very feature sold the basic point of The Equalizer. That he was a middle age man who seemed entirely harmless...and totally wasn't. Sorry Denzel, but after one million movies where you are an action type or at least believable threat to the bad guys...no one is ever going to buy that about you. He just didn't have the look as Woodward did. And the character was always more a threat from his knowledge rather than his muscles. His son OTOH...

Suddenly remembering that probably fewer people know anything about Peter Woodward than do his dad...Peter, (Babylon Five Crusade), taught stage combat, and hosted some show back in the day about martial arts; he's evidently a martial artist of some sort. Good actor too.

Back to Holmes though; I can't imagine Edward as that character. Even as good an actor as he was, he just didn't have the look.

[Powerboy]

In the mid 1990s, I went on a Sherlock Holmes kick and read every Holmes story written by Doyle and was sorry when it ended.

I read the Beekeeper's Apprentice which I thought was quite good though some accuse it of being glorified fan fiction.

Alas, I burned out on trying to sustain it with other people's versions of Holmes.

I saw Murder by Decree and Young Sherlock Holmes (which, of course, contradicts the premise that they met as adults). Alas, I've never seen any of the Rathbone movies. I like RDJ but I didn't like him as Holmes specifically because I had read the books and the RDJ movie's portrayal of Victorian London just leaves me cold it is so completely false.

I rather liked the Cumberbatch version with it's modern take on the stories.

Ironically, I've met people who tell me they are big fans who have read the books. Then they start telling me what an awesome gadgeteer and technological genius Moriarty was.

[Jim Kelly]

I finished my reading of all the Conan Doyle earlier this year. As I was reading those I was watching the Basil Rathbone and the Jeremy Brett versions, plus a few others.

I haven't found all the Peter Cushing episodes, but I did watch "The Blue Carbuncle." That's one of my favourite stories. I think someone could make a really great Christmas movie with that story and a few others blended in. Holmes in Dickensian England at Christmas--why hasn't this been done?

I really like MURDER BY DECREE, featuring the Canadian Christopher Plummer, along with other Canadians Donald Sutherland, Susan Clark and Genevieve Bujold.

I mean to make a list of when each story happens in the life of Sherlock Holmes, for when I'm in a mood to read all the stories again, but this time in the order of Sherlock's life--rather than publishing chronology as I did this time.

[Deathstroke]

In the mid 1990s, I went on a Sherlock Holmes kick and read every Holmes story written by Doyle and was sorry when it ended.

I read the Beekeeper's Apprentice which I thought was quite good though some accuse it of being glorified fan fiction.

Alas, I burned out on trying to sustain it with other people's versions of Holmes.

I saw Murder by Decree and Young Sherlock Holmes (which, of course, contradicts the premise that they met as adults). Alas, I've never seen any of the Rathbone movies. I like RDJ but I didn't like him as Holmes specifically because I had read the books and the RDJ movie's portrayal of Victorian London just leaves me cold it is so completely false.

I rather liked the Cumberbatch version with it's modern take on the stories.

Ironically, I've met people who tell me they are big fans who have read the books. Then they start telling me what an awesome gadgeteer and technological genius Moriarty was.

The Laurie R. King series that started with The Beekeeper's Apprentice is superb. I also read series like The Sherlock Holmes Bookshop series by Vicki Delany and The Baker Street Letters series by Michael Robertson. I've also started picking up books that James Lovegrove wrote featuring Holmes.

I've loved the Sherlock series, the Enola Holmes movie and I'm looking forward to checking out The Irregulars on Netflix. I wasn't crazy about the first Robert Downey Jr movie but I haven't seen the second one yet.

I am an unabashed fan of the Jeremy Brett series and own the complete series on DVD. Oh, and if I ever get the chance to go to London, my main goal would be to visit The Sherlock Holmes Museum. I recently purchased the first literary themed T-shirt I've ever owned and it was for The Hound of the Baskervilles with the artwork from one of the original publication installments when it was serialized. And Elementary is probably my 2nd favorite Holmes related programming.

I loved Young Sherlock Holmes as a kid but haven't seen it in years.

Trying to think of what else Sherlock plays a role in my life.

[foxley]

I just watched The Case of the Whiechapel Vampire; a 2002 TV movie [made by The Hallmark(!)] starring Matt Frewer as Holmes and Kenneth Welsh as Watson.

The story is an original one (although drawing on some elements from "The Sussex Vampire") where Holmes is called in to investigate a murder (later murders) in an abbey in Whitechapel, where a vampiric curse seems to have followed the order back from a mission in Guyana. Naturally, Holmes is skeptical and suspects a far more human hand is behind the killings.

This was the fourth and final of Hallmark's Sherlock Holmes films. It is a decent enough effort, although the low budget of the TV production shows through (including a splendid collection of ludicrous false moustaches on the extras and bit players). The mystery is well put together, with the logic holding together internally, and Holmes deductions are solid, with most of the clues he used having been visible to the viewer.

Matt Frewer plays a highly intellectual Holmes, although he is a tad too supercilious for my taste. He is also somewhat aggressively atheistic; a trait not shared by book Holmes. Kenneth Welsh is really too old to be playing Watson, but is otherwise solid, and is definitely not a buffoon. The script avoids Inspector Lestrade, and instead opts for Inspector Jones: played in a suitably antagonist fashion by Michel Perron (although the Quebec born Perron struggles with a Welsh accent).

Overall well worth a watch.