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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rev9 View Post
    My main gripe is well let me get the obvious caveat out of the way first maybe Amenth needs to first be beaten in a battle of will by its wearer to weaken it ,with that I'm cool but Sat9 actually moulding a full on godlike entity from its 'visage' into a fancy fly swatter(I know it's a royal fan but still) is ridiculous.If Saturnyne had that kind of power why even engage a tournament..it beats logic.With her power she could negate Amenth from breaching outworld from the get go.I feel it would be more logical if she locked away the mask or magically exorcised the entity to say Blightspoke ,but not do what she did.That was a silly gimmick by the writers ,but yeah that and weak post Stasis issues up till the final 3 means it's not as epic as it could have been but pretty decent conclusion
    On first issue was clear that she was powerful, now it is clearer that she is mega powerful and was playing games to get what she wanted. Yeah she could do it all by herself.

    Quote Originally Posted by ericng View Post
    I think the last issue was too rushed, they should have given us more panels to explain in detail.
    Sometimes things aren't explained because it doesn't make a lot of sense or to give more freedom to future stories
    Last edited by baxer; 11-26-2020 at 08:04 AM.

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by BishopsJuice91 View Post
    After Gorgon died started speed reading just to get through it. Really wanted to see something done with Gorgon so I’m not pleased and now I guess Apocalypse is off the board too. Hopefully Exodus gets some shine and action in the future. I’m gonna have to read destruction again...
    Exodus is the oldest guy on the council now (barring Selene joining) ,and they better recognise. He's consistently been the wise ,thoughtful guy on there.Agree the man needs his time in the sun, first order of business suss out Sinister 2.0 and eviscerate him for the treachery.Also he seems the only one worthy of deputising or should I say taking over the Crucible showpiece

  3. #243
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooFlyToFail View Post
    I actually love the depth given to Apocalypse, in the build up to, and within, this event.

    I still think this event was bloated and a waste of characters. Apocalypse and Cypher (for one issue) are the only characters that got any kind of fleshing out or progression to their character. Everyone else was wasted.

    The QC and X-Men developments were NEVER hinted at prior as being important to this event, but are suddenly dropped in midway through Chapter 19
    It was bloated, but so are all crossovers. Crossovers are needed to bring money, but are otherwise pretty pointless. I only picked up Hickman's X-Men issues and Creation/Stasis/Destruction and I honestly felt like I didn't miss anything too substantial until I get the hardcover. The trilogy of one-shots were especially great. I honestly think the line would be better streamlined down to 1-2 books with Hickman doing all the writing, it's this weird franchise need to disburse it among several books that not everyone will be interested in that leads to bloated writing. Yeah, people would complain their favorites weren't getting enough panel time, but too bad it would make for a more focused independent comic.

    I was mainly interested in the Apocalypse stuff and all the other cool new characters and concepts being introduced. And I would say "never" is a strong word for the QC stuff. Apocalypse was in conflict with the QC in Creation, which also did establish Cable bringing Scott and Jean into things.

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    It was bloated, but so are all crossovers. Crossovers are needed to bring money, but are otherwise pretty pointless. I only picked up Hickman's X-Men issues and Creation/Stasis/Destruction and I honestly felt like I didn't miss anything too substantial until I get the hardcover. The trilogy of one-shots were especially great. I honestly think the line would be better streamlined down to 1-2 books with Hickman doing all the writing, it's this weird franchise need to disburse it among several books that not everyone will be interested in that leads to bloated writing. Yeah, people would complain their favorites weren't getting enough panel time, but too bad it would make for a more focused independent comic.

    I was mainly interested in the Apocalypse stuff and all the other cool new characters and concepts being introduced. And I would say "never" is a strong word for the QC stuff. Apocalypse was in conflict with the QC in Creation, which also did establish Cable bringing Scott and Jean into things.

    People are already complaining about their faves, it is fair.

    Just let some chaarcters out of Krakoa, putting everyone there just got the line very poor.

  5. #245
    Astonishing Member TooFlyToFail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xiyon View Post
    Because even the best mangaka can have their series axed if their sales drop. For better or for worse, the manga industry is far more cutthroat than the comic industry.
    It's also far more lucrative, because they have such high standards. Much higher standards than the comic book industry.

  6. #246
    Astonishing Member TooFlyToFail's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rev9 View Post
    Btw since White Sword is such an autonomous badass, do you guys think he stayed in his spire in Arrako or Amenth wherever it is ,or is he going to join the multitudes of Arraki on Krakoa? At this point his gripe could be with Genesis for even considering selling her soul to Amenth, but will he be bitter at Apoc for overcoming the helmet despite donning it? Surely not unless he is a principled purist
    The data page about the swords indicates that WS went back to Amenth, since that's Purity's last known location.

  7. #247
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifighter View Post
    I think this event has actually raised some really good concerns or at least some thoughts about Krako’s leadership. Xavier is its founder and father figure, Magneto might be their folklore like figure if you believe exodus, but Cyclops is a leader.

    Against the will and express orders of their entire government he just lead a literal large army of mutants who all had to understand that if they die they will die permanently this time, but they followed with no hesitation. If I was the quite council right now I’d be a bit afraid of Scott Summers and the authority he holds.
    He only took X-Men tho.

  8. #248

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    Quote Originally Posted by ericng View Post
    I'm also confused about that scene. I think they tried to cramp too many things in one issue which they should have spread into the last few issues.
    they could physically see she switched sides because her black hair turned gold and the red parts on her suit turned gold while the gold parts turned red.
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  9. #249

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    also correct me if i'm wrong but saturyne was more powerful by the end of the story than she was at the beginning. The fish looking lady flat out said Saturyne did all of this so that her own sword could be rebuilt meaning she may have been powerful but she was definitely in a weaker state before getting to the point where the corps was brought back.
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  10. #250
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    Saturnyne is more powerful, because she got new things. But at the beggining of the story she wasn't weak at all, she stopped a whole fight going on

  11. #251
    Extraordinary Member CGAR's Avatar
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    Has anyone read anything else Hickman does? Serious question.

    Doesn't he always have like an all powerful or omnipotent individual in his stories?

    This could have been 12 issues. 3 issues each week for a month. But damn did they decide to make some money.

    Also I guess with the the extra issues they added. That what supposed to be like character depth and insight. Or world building.Extra lore.

    But most of you don't give a damn about Otherworld. I do. But most of you do not.

    Also Wolverine did not need two issues.

    And I'm still bummed out that OUR Betsy didn't really do much in this event. We got 15 issues and we still haven't really gotten the Betsy we deserve.

  12. #252
    Astonishing Member Kingdom X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGAR View Post
    Has anyone read anything else Hickman does? Serious question.

    Doesn't he always have like an all powerful or omnipotent individual in his stories?

    This could have been 12 issues. 3 issues each week for a month. But damn did they decide to make some money.

    Also I guess with the the extra issues they added. That what supposed to be like character depth and insight. Or world building.Extra lore.

    But most of you don't give a damn about Otherworld. I do. But most of you do not.

    Also Wolverine did not need two issues.

    And I'm still bummed out that OUR Betsy didn't really do much in this event. We got 15 issues and we still haven't really gotten the Betsy we deserve.
    Yeah... an easy fix would be for 616 Betsy to be the one leading the charge at the end of the event. Weird choice to delay her development even more.

  13. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGAR View Post
    Has anyone read anything else Hickman does? Serious question.

    Doesn't he always have like an all powerful or omnipotent individual in his stories?

    This could have been 12 issues. 3 issues each week for a month. But damn did they decide to make some money.

    Also I guess with the the extra issues they added. That what supposed to be like character depth and insight. Or world building.Extra lore.

    But most of you don't give a damn about Otherworld. I do. But most of you do not.

    Also Wolverine did not need two issues.

    And I'm still bummed out that OUR Betsy didn't really do much in this event. We got 15 issues and we still haven't really gotten the Betsy we deserve.
    I read a lot of Hickman not just his Marvel stuff and he doesn’t always have a all powerful individual but he really likes extremely powerful groups/collectives. He LOVES world building and I love reading that so I generally enjoy what he does. In terms of character development he usually focuses in on a small group but there are usually a lot of players in the story so not everyone gets a moment to shine but the really protagonists and antagonists get their due.

    I didn’t give a damn about Otherworld but now I want more.

    I’m agree, Wolverine didn’t need two issues he deserved at least 3.
    You brought back Wolverine

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  14. #254
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolverine12 View Post
    I read a lot of Hickman not just his Marvel stuff and he doesn’t always have a all powerful individual but he really likes extremely powerful groups/collectives. He LOVES world building and I love reading that so I generally enjoy what he does. In terms of character development he usually focuses in on a small group but there are usually a lot of players in the story so not everyone gets a moment to shine but the really protagonists and antagonists get their due.

    I didn’t give a damn about Otherworld but now I want more.

    I’m agree, Wolverine didn’t need two issues he deserved at least 3.
    Pretty much where I'm at. I was attached to the characters in the Clarmeont era, but that was a long ass time ago with a lot of convoluted nonsense since then. Now I'm just here for the world building and Hickman using the big names along with his own concepts. A lot of "character development" has been done with the big names so I don't mind them being more plot-driven than character driven, as long as their voices seem on point (which most of them do). And no way is every single c and d lister going to get significant panel time in this run.

    "Character development" or lack thereof is kind of a...vague complaint. Big 2 superheroes don't generally develop any more, or if they do, its' extremely slowly. And when we fans complain about the lack of it, I honestly think it means "these static characters aren't behaving how I want them to." Because when characters do change, people are always resistant to it (I'm guilty of this too).

    I also like the Otherworld stuff as long as Hickman has a hand in it. Kind of bummed most of it will likely be in Excalibur now.

  15. #255
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    Another naïve question, but what was the point of the tournament if Genesis/Annihilation could just pull a Trump and not accept the results and have her army continue what they started before Saturnyne called time out?

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