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  1. #76

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    Btw I just want to make it clear that I respect everyone’s opinion.

    If you want my opinion, although probably nobody does...Krakoa’s culture, In My Opinion, is the fact that you can be what you want to be without aorrying about having to face persecution from humans. Cause remember, Mutants have been persecuted by humans(humans in general not every human who has does and will ever exist) since the beginning of their existence? You can embrace you race, religion, culture, sexuality, accept/notbepereseucuted, for your disability, gender, or anything else that can be eqquited to discrimation.(I am sorry if I missed some). You do pretty much and be pretty much whatever you choose to, but that you’re united in the fact that they’re all mutants who have the experiences of mutants...have the difficulties in life that presents...and just in general that fact that ‘oh! I have a power and or a mutation that may or may not be very useful’...or ‘oh I hate my powers...but I can’t really change that so I’m going to be around people like me so I can try to accept me for me’...among other things.

    That, to me, I Krakoa’s culture. And yes, some may not really consider that a culture...but that mostly because for most of our lives we’ve been told ‘in order for something to be a culture it has to have these qualities, if it doesn’t it’s not a real culture’—Honestly the same can go for if something is a religion or not. If something is a race or not. If you’re actually apart of the LGBTQ+ or not? And etc...but that’s not really the point of this thread.

    As for the inconsistency in how some comics say NO HUMANS ALLOWED and others literally show humans in Krakoa. This is what I have to say about that: No humans allowed is more of a general thing, IMHO, as in there ar exceptions. Shogo, for example, is a baby...particularly Jubilee’s(who is a mutant) son. Why would they go and be like ‘oh you’re child who is a baby and obviously not really going to harm us is not allowed, but oh you can come on Krakoa and leave him behind somewhere’. This his mom so of course they will make an exception for him. Besides, even if they were to forbid that, Jubilee would probably choose her son and decide to stay off Krakoa and be a mother to Shogo, but because Shogo is still a child of a mutant...when he got older he would likely be discriminated against because of that once people found that out about him. So yes, he isn’t a mutant, but he has some of the ‘mutant experience’ if you want to put it that way. and he’ll grow up on Krakoa, basically recognizing himself as someone who may not be a mutant but has VERY CLOSE ties to them and considers them his family. Then in the case of Northstar that’s his husband...and Kyle(is that Northstar’s husband’s name...I think it is sorry if I am mistaken)yes he’s not a baby and won’t necessarily be the same as Shogo but at the end of the day his HUSBAND is a mutant and he would never intentionally do anything to sabotage Krakoa and mutants and Therefore his husband.

    And then there’s is the fact that when two mutants have a child, or one mutant and a human or two humans, whenever that child is born of it has the X-Gene it likely won’t manifest until the child hits puberty(so from like 8-16)or in some unsual, but not unprecedented cases, earlier or later. Or the person could have a latent mutant gene. So at the end of the day, EVENTUALLY, there will come a time when there is a relatively portion of Krakoa that may be ‘humans’...especially with the whole make more mutants thing if people start popping out babies fast and quick.

    And yes, I do recognize that a great deal of points on here(even the ones that are opposite of mine)are valid and have at least SOME truth to them(such as how Kitty kind of has a Viking funeral and not a Jewish one, how Kurt pretty much is no longer a Catholic, how Magneto is pretty much now a lapsed Jew, and Mirage says some contradictory things)I feel like most of it can be chalked up to writers not knowing their stuff, editorial, writer wanting to change characters(such as in Kurt’s case for whatever reason...but I feel that in the future they will make him Catholic again since it’s such a core part of his character)and in Magneto’s case...he is lapsed...which I feel is a representation of real life where to find a non-practical Jew is no uncommon, and with all that Magneto has seen, done, and been through...I can see how he might loose faith/motivation to practice his religion as these things happen in real life.

    As for the X-Force thing...okay I think most of us know that Beast is really becoming something else, something that is veer much on the extreme side. From erasing people’s minds(though that’s understandable...they can’t afford to make mistakes of the past), to basically eradicating thousands of people by way of those plant-viruses thingies(but that was a mistake...and many have purposefully done worse for worse reasons), but the whole thing with the Russian Mutants to me is unacceptable(not the fact that I don’t think it should be allowed in comics, but that Beast is obviously in the wrong). That’s where Beast crosses a line, how can he do such to his own people? Of what other people said is true that it likely had to go through The Quiet Council, I can see maybe(Magneto, Charles, Apocalypse, Emma, Sebastian Shaw,Exodus, Mister Sinister, And Mystique)AND THIS IS ONLY A MAYBE BECAUSE FOR SOME OF THESE CHARACTER’S IT’S A STRETCH agreeing to it and in the Council I believe you need 6 or more votes...so maybe that’s how it happened...saying yes. But I don’t see Kitty, Storm, Jean, or Nightcrawler(especially not Nightcrawler) agreeing. And if they did I feel it’s only 1 or 2 things, 1. a plot where certain people in Krakoa are being mind-controlled or being infected with some virus that makes them not themselves. Or 2. Editorial/Writing does not care about mainting character’s cossisstency and is doing what they want to do for the plot. And gene then Mutants outside of the Council should be opposing it besides Wolverine(but alos characters like Cyclops and pretty much all the Summers expect for Vulcan who may not care, Rogue and Gambit, Jubillee, Betsy Braddock, Psylocke(Kwannon), The New Mutants including Illyana since Colossus is her brother and Beast is obviously wrong, Polaris and X-Facror...and many many others that I forgot to mention)and if this many is opposing it it should have gotten stopped because this is on a whole nother level of wrong and Beast is pretty much being prejudice...because ge’s basing it off of their ethnicity and nationality and I agree with people who say that this is not right. And I can see why some might believe that Beast was the only one who knew...but I’m not exactly sure because I only skimmed through those later X-Force comics so I would need to re-read them in depth.

    Also I don’t know all the facts about Juggernaut, as I’m not currently reading anything with him in it. But as far as I know, and PLEASE correct me if I am wrong, but he never submitted that he wouldn’t try to dissemble what they were building with/on Krakoa like traditional villains such as Apocalypse, Sinister, Selene, Exodus, Fabian Cortez, and many others did...not to mention not only did they submitted but most of them have great use. Apocalypse(obv Apoc more than Exodus) and Exodus are very powerful ‘villains’ who’s interiors are rooted in helping mutants...and they have great wisdom and experience. Fabian Cortez while not powerful in a traditional sense has a unique power-set and is about to be on S.W.O.R.D and be of use.(As Xavier said to Mystique: everyone who would wish to be on Krakoa has to offer it SOMETHING—Mystique also has her uses as well). And Sinister and Selene are both relatively powerful, but without Sinister no one would be resurrected and Selene managed Krakoa’s process’ in absobding just the right amount of energy in Mutants...although I read Captain America and she’s probably in prison now just like Sabertooth. And then if you want to take, say the Hellions, who most(not all)of the, are not necessarily villains but just pretty misguided.

    (And yes, I know Sinister, basically a eugenicist, stone DNA from a Native American man to be able to be on Krakoa, but he helped Create the resurrection process and they kind of need him, trust me no one really wants him there it’s just how it is)

    Btw I respect the opinions of everyone.

  2. #77

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    BTW I ran out of space, so I have more to say here.

    Juggernaut on the other hand(even before he became Juggernuat—If I remember correctly anyways)HATED Charles and I think Mutants in general and because now of that Cain became The Juggernaut...and for decades upon decades, everything he did was either out of selfishness or he was being controlled by an external/outside force(but his interiors were still rooted in selfishness)and as far as I am aware, again correct me if I am wrong, never submitted that he wouldn’t try to ruin anything. And yes he did fight WITH the X-Men and help them that time, but likely from many prominent mutants on Krakoa’s perspective they still see him as a big-bag-villain and with Charles saying ‘oh you can’t come Cain’ and that’s his own stepbrother...they likely don’t question it and just agree. You have to remember, that many are still wary(such as Gambit) about Apocalypse(who I suppose is now gone) and Sinister(such as Havok and Psylocke...kind of since she has that deal with him).

    As for Deadpool, why would he be allowed? He’s not as ‘evil’ as Apoc and Sinister or many villains, I see him as an anti-hero. It’s just that he’s so unserious, and to him Krakoa is not a safe-haven where he can be free from persecution...to him it’s a new place he can fool around in and explore when he is bored. And it’s not like he and a mutant(let’s just throw Rogue in for an example even though she and Gambit are now wed)are married and it would be extremely hard for them to have a successful marriage if they were not both on Krakoa. Of course, Deadpool would never intentionally just try and sabotage Krakoa, but he is a national security potential threat and there is no need or legitimate reason in him being there.

    No onto Franklin Richards, who to me is the most complicated matter in all of this, well he’s NOT no longer a mutant he NEVER was, and yes Professor Xavier conveyed it in a shady way through telepathy. But I think we all know Xavier is really shady and probably thought to himself that ‘oh Franklin isn’t actually a mutant, he’s powerless to add onto that, and he’s beneath me and no longer worth my time’. So that’s probably why he did that. Now what I’m going to say after this will likely sound harsh, but it’s my opinion and in my opinion it’s true: Franklin is not a mutant and he doesn’t belong on Krakoa(although who knows if they might go back and change this one day, OR that they will keep him human but still give him his powers back). Sure, he’ll probably face discrimination for who his parents are and whatnot, but that’s the reason he’ll face discrimination, it’s because of that NOT because he is a mutant. And yes he always felt out of place and like he didn’t belong and that’s why he was so eager to be on Krakoa. But I think this is mostly attributed to one(he has beyond Omega level powers, or I guess did)and two, because he was thought to have Been a mutant at the time he felt like he missing part of his identity by not being able to explore that part of himself, and be with his fellow people. But now that’s no longer true. He’s not a mutant and he doesn’t belong on Krakoa. And I doubt anyone will invite him over. Why? Well for 1, because he was likely only there for about a few months and the friends he did make were like those friends you make in Summer camp and once you leave you never talk to them again...or see them next year and just don’t really care about them. And 2, if you What to bring Kitty into it...they did put a lot of emphasis on the relationship(their platonic friendship obviously)but they really made it more than what it was. During the time when Kitty’s phasing abilities were not working back all their decades ago, and they had their connection Franklin was pretty much a toddler(don’t worry I don’t dispute their connection, I believe it’s real)but it’s like where you meet and stranger and you bond over a mutual experience and you guys have a connection, but at the end of the day they aren’t someone fundamentally important in your life. Like how Franklin is not to Kitty what Kurt is, and yes that probably hurts Franklin because he probably felt like for the first time he belonged he he was who he was supposed to be he though he and Kitty were like best-friends dancing in the rain, but that’s not really the truth...and it’s safe...but it is what it is.

    If I missed any points, though, yuh can point them out to me I would be more than happy to go into more explanation about all I’ve stated here. And more.

    So yeah, that’s just my take on this whole thread. Again respect to everyone! I respect everyone’s opinions.

  3. #78
    Astonishing Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    For God's sake man you don't need parenthesis every few words. I saw three parenthetical in one sentence in that onslaught of word garbage

  4. #79
    Mighty Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    Sorry, but, TLDR. Break up your posts and have one point at a time. That's way too much to get through.

    "He's a total monster, but we need him!" is probably the worst reason to put up with characters. They're unequivocally evil, but they work for us and are useful, so they get a pass. Its not a new line of reasoning for this run; its a problem with the writing for a long time. Someone stops someone else from finishing off a terrible person for vague "We will need them later" reasons. Just off the top of my head, Jean stopped Magneto from killing Emma in BLUE after the whole worldwide mass bombing thing.

    Its a pet peeve, so I get why others are OK with it. X comics have this problem more than others because their villains are so popular. This sort of thing doesn't happen with the kind of regularity and vagueness with other big villains, like, say, Red Skull or the like.

  5. #80
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post

    "He's a total monster, but we need him!" is probably the worst reason to put up with characters. They're unequivocally evil, but they work for us and are useful, so they get a pass. Its not a new line of reasoning for this run; its a problem with the writing for a long time. Someone stops someone else from finishing off a terrible person for vague "We will need them later" reasons.
    like America did with Nazi scientists?
    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Its a pet peeve, so I get why others are OK with it. X comics have this problem more than others because their villains are so popular. This sort of thing doesn't happen with the kind of regularity and vagueness with other big villains, like, say, Red Skull or the like.
    Red Skulls a Nazi tho
    GrindrStone(D)

  6. #81

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    People are really using the one page splash from Ben Percy, Wolverine book to make an argument. If that page is used as an example then what does it say about Logan that the same writer then had him flirting and drinking with Storm during X of Swords and acting like nothing happen. I think most readers were actually side-eyeing that page as well so im actually intrigued now how real meaning comes from that.

    And based on that same page we are suppose to take serious ALL of Krakoa was hand waging colossus and thought he should be brought to justice by they let Wolverine chase them all away of all people who easily out powered him. Just the thought.
    Last edited by jwatson; 12-01-2020 at 04:11 PM.
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  7. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by allthingzamasing View Post
    BTW I ran out of space, so I have more to say here.

    Juggernaut on the other hand(even before he became Juggernuat—If I remember correctly anyways)HATED Charles and I think Mutants in general and because now of that Cain became The Juggernaut...and for decades upon decades, everything he did was either out of selfishness or he was being controlled by an external/outside force(but his interiors were still rooted in selfishness)and as far as I am aware, again correct me if I am wrong, never submitted that he wouldn’t try to ruin anything. And yes he did fight WITH the X-Men and help them that time, but likely from many prominent mutants on Krakoa’s perspective they still see him as a big-bag-villain and with Charles saying ‘oh you can’t come Cain’ and that’s his own stepbrother...they likely don’t question it and just agree. You have to remember, that many are still wary(such as Gambit) about Apocalypse(who I suppose is now gone) and Sinister(such as Havok and Psylocke...kind of since she has that deal with him).

    As for Deadpool, why would he be allowed? He’s not as ‘evil’ as Apoc and Sinister or many villains, I see him as an anti-hero. It’s just that he’s so unserious, and to him Krakoa is not a safe-haven where he can be free from persecution...to him it’s a new place he can fool around in and explore when he is bored. And it’s not like he and a mutant(let’s just throw Rogue in for an example even though she and Gambit are now wed)are married and it would be extremely hard for them to have a successful marriage if they were not both on Krakoa. Of course, Deadpool would never intentionally just try and sabotage Krakoa, but he is a national security potential threat and there is no need or legitimate reason in him being there.

    No onto Franklin Richards, who to me is the most complicated matter in all of this, well he’s NOT no longer a mutant he NEVER was, and yes Professor Xavier conveyed it in a shady way through telepathy. But I think we all know Xavier is really shady and probably thought to himself that ‘oh Franklin isn’t actually a mutant, he’s powerless to add onto that, and he’s beneath me and no longer worth my time’. So that’s probably why he did that. Now what I’m going to say after this will likely sound harsh, but it’s my opinion and in my opinion it’s true: Franklin is not a mutant and he doesn’t belong on Krakoa(although who knows if they might go back and change this one day, OR that they will keep him human but still give him his powers back). Sure, he’ll probably face discrimination for who his parents are and whatnot, but that’s the reason he’ll face discrimination, it’s because of that NOT because he is a mutant. And yes he always felt out of place and like he didn’t belong and that’s why he was so eager to be on Krakoa. But I think this is mostly attributed to one(he has beyond Omega level powers, or I guess did)and two, because he was thought to have Been a mutant at the time he felt like he missing part of his identity by not being able to explore that part of himself, and be with his fellow people. But now that’s no longer true. He’s not a mutant and he doesn’t belong on Krakoa. And I doubt anyone will invite him over. Why? Well for 1, because he was likely only there for about a few months and the friends he did make were like those friends you make in Summer camp and once you leave you never talk to them again...or see them next year and just don’t really care about them. And 2, if you What to bring Kitty into it...they did put a lot of emphasis on the relationship(their platonic friendship obviously)but they really made it more than what it was. During the time when Kitty’s phasing abilities were not working back all their decades ago, and they had their connection Franklin was pretty much a toddler(don’t worry I don’t dispute their connection, I believe it’s real)but it’s like where you meet and stranger and you bond over a mutual experience and you guys have a connection, but at the end of the day they aren’t someone fundamentally important in your life. Like how Franklin is not to Kitty what Kurt is, and yes that probably hurts Franklin because he probably felt like for the first time he belonged he he was who he was supposed to be he though he and Kitty were like best-friends dancing in the rain, but that’s not really the truth...and it’s safe...but it is what it is.

    If I missed any points, though, yuh can point them out to me I would be more than happy to go into more explanation about all I’ve stated here. And more.

    So yeah, that’s just my take on this whole thread. Again respect to everyone! I respect everyone’s opinions.
    I just wanted to take the time to say i actually read all that, and i appreciate the punctuation, the spacing, and the well presented opinions.
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  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by BroHomo View Post
    like America did with Nazi scientists?
    Red Skulls a Nazi tho
    The standard should not be the American Government

    And Gorgon is right there.

  9. #84
    Incredible Member frostedemma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Actually it should be, because one of the last things Cain did before this relaunch was help the X-men out in Limbo. He hasn't been a card carrying villain for a long while, and is probably a better person than half the council. Including Xavier.
    I feel like if Xavier is going to have people like Emplate, Sinister, Empath and etc roam around Krakoa freely knowing that they willingly tortured and abused many X-men enough to leave them deep psychological scars than he can suffer having his step brother who used to bully him during their childhood around.

  10. #85
    Ultimate Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordUltimus View Post


    Really? Literally everything we’ve seen of Krakoa involves the Government forcing an artificially constructed and induced culture built on erasing, shaming and belittling anything even remotely human-adjacent except when that’s convenient for them. Didn't Dani herself comment on how humans have built nothing of value in the first issue of New Mutants?

    (And while arguably all cultures spend some time separating what they are from neighboring cultures that they are not, some of them are a lot more... into that than others.)
    Mutant faahion , mutant cuisine. It seems Emma has all the leaders in art working for her. If Dani said that its incorrect. Mutants had a culture before Krakoa hence why Wanda commited genocide

    There is also mutant history, science, medicine etc
    Last edited by ExodusCloak; 12-01-2020 at 06:59 PM.

  11. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    For God's sake man you don't need parenthesis every few words. I saw three parenthetical in one sentence in that onslaught of word garbage
    Well I’m sorry(I’m not really sorry)that I wanted to make sure I had good points that were organized and explained everything thoroughly. And I’m sorry(I’m not really sorry; LOL be annoyed)that I used parenthesis to add more information that would have been out of place if they were not in parenthesis. ._. Have a good day—All respect

  12. #87

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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I just wanted to take the time to say i actually read all that, and i appreciate the punctuation, the spacing, and the well presented opinions.

    Thank you! I tried my best to be as conrtsictove and organized as possible so that it would make sense. You seem I’ve only been a member since February, although I’ve read comics for longer, and yet I have only 20 something posts. So when I do post, it always has a great deal of information in it. And something I feel is important. I’m glad you read it all! Thanks for RESPECTING my opinion. Have an awesome day!

  13. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Sorry, but, TLDR. Break up your posts and have one point at a time. That's way too much to get through.

    "He's a total monster, but we need him!" is probably the worst reason to put up with characters. They're unequivocally evil, but they work for us and are useful, so they get a pass. Its not a new line of reasoning for this run; its a problem with the writing for a long time. Someone stops someone else from finishing off a terrible person for vague "We will need them later" reasons. Just off the top of my head, Jean stopped Magneto from killing Emma in BLUE after the whole worldwide mass bombing thing.

    Its a pet peeve, so I get why others are OK with it. X comics have this problem more than others because their villains are so popular. This sort of thing doesn't happen with the kind of regularity and vagueness with other big villains, like, say, Red Skull or the like.
    IMHO, you have a reasonable point. But many comic lines have done it in the past, so I don’t see much wrong with the X-Men doing it. And some of these villains, are they really villains or are they just PERCEVEIED this way. Plus if you look at it from Marvel’s perspective turning these ‘villains’ into ‘heores’ since some of them are quite popular will get them more money so it’s an easy choice.(You are correct when you say X-books have many popular villains, such as Magneto just to name one)

    And also, putting the others aside in Mister Sinister’s case...it’s not some flimsy reason like ‘oh we need him because if not instead of us having a 100% chance of winning we’ll have an 80% chance’ of something like that. It’s because he helped to create the resurrection process, you know...so that whena mutant died it’s not permmanet? And if you read X-books I tell you people die a lot it’s half-way ludicrous. So without that, everything would go to hell pretty quickly. But also I believe Sinister, eventually, will be put to an end...although he’ll probably come back as per usual.

    And besides, what do you expect when you’ve been persecuted your whole life? Not everyone is the X-Men and will defend people that persecuted them and in some cases KILL MEMBERS OF THEIR FAMILY. I know I wouldn’t. And some may say that it’s not excuse for such villainy, but I disagree.

    Red Skull was a Nazi, so to keep him around would be very offensive and anti-semitic. What do you WANT Marvel to keep someone like him away? His villainy is rooted in real life events that were horrendous and still affect people to this day.

    Besides Wanda is still on The Avengers. She isn’t really on the main line like that, but she is still a member. I can’t really speak too deep into non-mutant superheroes books who’s villains hang around. But it’s a human place Earth is, save Krakoa, and those heroes are bound to protect and defend humans...the villains they fight are usually trying to kill humans. Where as some X-villains...they fight the X-Men in order to HELP mutants because they think the X-Men are not helping mutants and are the wrong side. There is a difference. But like I was saying I can’t speak too much on non-mutant superhero books villains,(besides Fanstatic Four)I only read those occasionally or when there is a big event. Or if I am bored.

  14. #89
    Mighty Member pkingdom's Avatar
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    Sinister is literally a Nazi scientist. Totally unrepentant about it. They don't need him, they need his DNA banks, which they have now. Apocalypse has joked about the civilizations he's ended. He has successfully done the kinds of things Red Skull wants to do. And many mutant X villains fought the X men and didn't give a damn about mutankind. Shaw funded the Sentinel project, and the Hellions once tried to kill a mutant kid with Down Syndrome because it made him 'useless'. Hell, Stryfe created and unleashed the Legacy virus on mutantkind out of spite! And even the ones that were trying to 'advance the cause' often were eager to commit genocide and mass murder. That doesn't suddenly become OK because mutants have it rough.

    Quote Originally Posted by frostedemma View Post
    I feel like if Xavier is going to have people like Emplate, Sinister, Empath and etc roam around Krakoa freely knowing that they willingly tortured and abused many X-men enough to leave them deep psychological scars than he can suffer having his step brother who used to bully him during their childhood around.
    Don't forgot those guys continue to abuse their powers on the people around them while on Krakoa. Empath has mind raped someone every issue he's shown up.

  15. #90
    Extraordinary Member BroHomo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frostedemma View Post
    he can suffer having his step brother who used to bully him during their childhood around.
    Some wedgies are just too deep to ever pull out.
    Quote Originally Posted by allthingzamasing View Post
    And besides, what do you expect when you’ve been persecuted your whole life? Not everyone is the X-Men and will defend people that persecuted them and in some cases KILL MEMBERS OF THEIR FAMILY. I know I wouldn’t. And some may say that it’s not excuse for such villainy, but I disagree.
    Exactly!!! People aren't surprised when an abused animal finally snaps and turns on the abuser/people in general...Its the ones that are still trusting/friendly that people find novel
    Quote Originally Posted by allthingzamasing View Post
    Red Skull was a Nazi, so to keep him around would be very offensive and anti-semitic. What do you WANT Marvel to keep someone like him away? His villainy is rooted in real life events that were horrendous and still affect people to this day.
    Ikr smdh
    buuut tbh
    I can't even think of Avengers villain worth reading about having a change of heart.... Definitely not the Red Skull ugh! Ultron? He's done done pretty irredeemable sh!T but if he switched it'd read like Vision 2.0. Kang? Thanos? They're not even in the same Timeline/universe? The only one I can think of is Loki and the Scarlet Witch and..
    Quote Originally Posted by allthingzamasing View Post
    Besides Wanda is still on The Avengers. She isn’t really on the main line like that, but she is still a member. I can’t really speak too deep into non-mutant superheroes books who’s villains hang around. But it’s a human place Earth is, save Krakoa, and those heroes are bound to protect and defend humans...the villains they fight are usually trying to kill humans. Where as some X-villains...they fight the X-Men in order to HELP mutants because they think the X-Men are not helping mutants and are the wrong side. There is a difference.
    Riiight again....compare body counts with Scarlet Witch and you'd lose hands. Down
    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Sinister is literally a Nazi scientist. Totally unrepentant about it. They don't need him, they need his DNA banks, which they have now.
    You coulde argue the shock of losing his children broke him.kiiinda like the Scarlet Witch
    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Apocalypse has joked about the civilizations he's ended. He has successfully done the kinds of things Red Skull wants to do.
    Yeeeah in normal conversation I'd chalk it up to an awkward off-putting joke. Buuut if you wanna harp on deaths from waaaay back in 1200 BC more power to ya.
    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Shaw funded the Sentinel project, and the Hellions once tried to kill a mutant kid with Down Syndrome because it made him 'useless'.
    it was the Acolytes who tried to kill the kid btw.
    Shaw didn't realize the extent of the Sentinels tenacity. And under No understanding of the 'final' brutality that was gonna be captured Mutsnrs fate. Were tryna play the long game with Mutants...and Didn't continue
    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    And even the ones that were trying to 'advance the cause' often were eager to commit genocide and mass murder. That doesn't suddenly become OK because mutants have it rough.
    Nooo you got it backwards



    Quote Originally Posted by pkingdom View Post
    Don't forgot those guys continue to abuse their powers on the people around them while on Krakoa. Empath has mind raped someone every issue he's shown up.
    You know his powerset right? Dude sooo I feel Mindrape is just used for shock....What happened to Jean, Emma, Iceman Friedlander&Corsi etc would be considered Mindrape. Empath is just controlling the person much like Karma
    GrindrStone(D)

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