Sun Wukong vs Satan

[Jcogginsa]

Sun Wukong, from the seminal classic Journey to the West

vs

The fallen angel Satan from John Milton's epic poem Paradise Lost

Which one of these two supremely prideful people wins?

Bonus: They sit and talk

[The MunchKING]

Sun Wukong actually has hard feats for what he does, like how much his staff weighs and what not. Does Paradise Lost provide any hard feats or does it just leave it vague and metaphysical?

[The MunchKING]

Of course if we're going with Civ 6 logic, they CRAZY nerfed Sun Wukong. No laser-eyes, no giant multi-limbed war monkey form, no cloning, no jumping out of the very Universe itself; Heck he's not even THAT good at fighting. Beowulf, Hercules, the Twins, heck even SINBAD THE SAILOR is better at it than him. I mean they TRY to encapsulate his 6x Immorality thing, but it only ends up being "lasts a little longer". He's not any harder to kill than anyone.

EDIT: Ok, I said no shapeshifting, but apparently that's the power he's supposed to be using that keeps him invisible until a unit is right next to him. I guess at that point they can see his tail or something.

[Cody]

Of course if we're going with Civ 6 logic, they CRAZY nerfed Sun Wukong. No laser-eyes, no giant multi-limbed war monkey form, no cloning, no jumping out of the very Universe itself; Heck he's not even THAT good at fighting. Beowulf, Hercules, the Twins, heck even SINBAD THE SAILOR is better at it than him. I mean they TRY to encapsulate his 6x Immorality thing, but it only ends up being "lasts a little longer". He's not any harder to kill than anyone.

EDIT: Ok, I said no shapeshifting, but apparently that's the power he's supposed to be using that keeps him invisible until a unit is right next to him. I guess at that point they can see his tail or something.

There are a lot of versions of him that vary greatly in power. Even the original Sun Wukong wasn't technically all that powerful as a lot of the things being referenced weren't drawn to scale due to the limited knowledge of the universe back when the story was first conceived.

Correct me if I am mistaken.

[The Drunkard Kid]

Well, translating to modern units of measurement (note: not changing the actual feats, just going from the archaic li and jin to miles/kilometers and pounds/kilograms), he could cover approximately 33,600 mi/54,073 km in one leap (which is around 1.25 times the circumference of the Earth), and easily use a staff that weighed 17,550 lb/7,960 kg. More nebulously, he casually shrugged off 5 mountains once they were no longer being held in place by Buddha's seal, knows 72 transformations that can involve turning into giant monsters, can transform each of his hairs into a copy of himself that seems to be as powerful as himself (IIRC), knows a bunch of really powerful general magic, and so on.

I dunno if Paradise Lost Satan has any relevant feats; the biblical Satan's feats are pretty much non-existent.

[MichaelC]

Irrc, PL Satan was absolutely colossal. That implies a great deal of strength simply to stand up. That's...about all I can think of about that character that's combat relevant.

[Sharpandpointies]

That's about what I got from Paradise Lost, myself.

"Satan was big. I mean, really big. This dude is huge."

It goes on like that for a while.

[master of read]

Of course if we're going with Civ 6 logic, they CRAZY nerfed Sun Wukong. No laser-eyes, no giant multi-limbed war monkey form, no cloning, no jumping out of the very Universe itself; Heck he's not even THAT good at fighting. Beowulf, Hercules, the Twins, heck even SINBAD THE SAILOR is better at it than him. I mean they TRY to encapsulate his 6x Immorality thing, but it only ends up being "lasts a little longer". He's not any harder to kill than anyone.

EDIT: Ok, I said no shapeshifting, but apparently that's the power he's supposed to be using that keeps him invisible until a unit is right next to him. I guess at that point they can see his tail or something.

can't believe i'm seeing a CIV 6 post here.

but yeah. we all know herc is a beast when you build districts.

[The MunchKING]

can't believe i'm seeing a CIV 6 post here.

I've done it a few times when that's the main source I know about what's being debated. Often with ancient cultures/leaders.