Endings they should have changed?

[Sutekh]

I always took the activation of all of the Potential Slayers to be less about fighting The First, and more about the fact that Buffy wouldn't be alone in her calling anymore. Of course, that just makes The First superfluous.

Another ending where I saw lots of foreshadowing and it amounted to a hill of beans. The Slayer's power was 'chained to the earth' and it was strongly implied that the men who created the first Slayer did so by binding the power of an actual demon into her, so she had the strength to protect them from other demons.

And then they cast a spell that activates dozens of Slayers all at once, in theory making that demon dozens of times more powerful! (Since the demon's power that Buffy channels isn't divided in half when Faith becomes a Slayer, or divided into a tiny fraction of itself when dozens of others become Slayers, they *all* become full-strength Slayers!)

And what if that nameless demon actually had a name? The First Evil? Whom they just (accidentally) vastly made stronger? That seemed like where the plot was going, and then, bam, magic necklace. It ends. Nobody is actually sure why. The First Evil just sort of gives up, I guess?

I sometimes wish Buffy ended at the end of season three. That felt like a good ending.

[Celestialbeyonder]

And yes kylo was hit with a exploding arrow that just blew stormtroppers up and took out parts of the ship.

And healed within 24 hours....

Baby yoda is a baby and was force chocking people!

Baby Yoda faints when he chokes beasts/stormtroopers to long because it drains him and he had training at the Jedi Temple and was 50 years old.....

[WebLurker]

So is getting shot.

Doesn't work like that; the movie shows us that Chewie's bowcaster is an instant-kill weapon that knocks its victims like a rocket launcher. They take the time to establish that the accepted "gunshot is a flesh wound" conceit that action movies usually operate under does not apply in this case. No such exception was made for concussions, like getting thrown into a tree.

She wins. With 0 training.

She did know how to use a staff (which we see her using the saber as during the fight). Skill extrapolation like that is common movie logic and been part of the franchise ever since Luke's ability to succeed as a fighter pilot in the original movie.

She should not have been able to tap into the force/command it to such an extent to beat an experienced force user that had DECADES of training, Wounded or not. This completely contradicts some 40 years of SW Movies and EU and is an insult to all the force users that came before her.

And yet every fantastic thing she's done was done at least once in the franchise before (or has something comparable happen before).

Not matter how many stupid excuses Rey fanboys make up - she was allready ridiculously OP in TFA.

Excusing the fact that everything was set up for the final act (which is what those of us who study fiction call "good writing"), and Force skills have always advanced at the speed of plot (e.g. Luke becoming a knight in less then a month of formal training vs Anakin taking years to get that), if you're going to tell me that Rey is overpowered compared to the likes of Starkiller or the students pushing Star Destroyers out of orbit in the Jedi Academy Trilogy novels, or that child that built a function lightsaber solely on the direction of the Force in the Riptide novel, etc,

Rey is not OP; the theory was DOA since 2015 (I was there; I've heard all the bad arguments). Seriously, the movies are over and the character is currently not in use. Why are we still having this conversation? Let the past die and all that.

So yes, Valentis is right. Without help (like 2 vs 1) she should not have been able to defeat Kylo, even with him having a Medium level injury.

Sad thing is, I seriously doubt we'd be having this discussion if Rey had had a Y chromosome.

[Celestialbeyonder]

Doesn't work like that; the movie shows us that Chewie's bowcaster is an instant-kill weapon that knocks its victims like a rocket launcher. They take the time to establish that the accepted "gunshot is a flesh wound" conceit that action movies usually operate under does not apply in this case. No such exception was made for concussions, like getting thrown into a tree.

This supposedly severe wound heals completely within 24 hours, even Bacta could not heal a severe wound so fast. Therefore it could not have been so severe, therefore Kylo could not have been that much weaker.

She did know how to use a staff (which we see her using the saber as during the fight). Skill extrapolation like that is common movie logic and been part of the franchise ever since Luke's ability to succeed as a fighter pilot in the original movie.

OMG Rey could use her magic stick so she is an expert sword fighter! She still has 0 training in the force.

And yet every fantastic thing she's done was done at least once in the franchise before (or has something comparable happen before).

Not by people with ZERO training in the force.

Excusing the fact that everything was set up for the final act (which is what those of us who study fiction call "good writing"), and Force skills have always advanced at the speed of plot (e.g. Luke becoming a knight in less then a month of formal training vs Anakin taking years to get that), if you're going to tell me that Rey is overpowered compared to the likes of Starkiller or the students pushing Star Destroyers out of orbit in the Jedi Academy Trilogy novels, or that child that built a function lightsaber solely on the direction of the Force in the Riptide novel, etc,

1. This final act was written so badly and stupidly that a 5 year old could have done it better.
2. All these characters needed TRAINING. Even if they were OP they were so after TRAINING. Rey has not had ANY training in TFA and PERHAPS a few hours in TLJ - if you can call that training.

Rey is not OP; the theory was DOA since 2015 (I was there; I've heard all the bad arguments). Seriously, the movies are over and the character is currently not in use. Why are we still having this conversation? Let the past die and all that.

Rey is OP this theory was there since 2015 and has been confirmed again in 2017 and again in 2019. That there are still some fanatics that try to defend this stupidly written OP character is beyond me.

Sad thing is, I seriously doubt we'd be having this discussion if Rey had had a Y chromosome.

Dont be stupid. The fact that she has 2 X Chromosomes saves her a lot of criticism. If a Gary Stu character would have done what she did - he would be slaughtered by the Fans.

[Gaastra]

Edit--why am i talking about how powerful ray is in a movie ending thread? Deleated all that from my response.


To me the ending i would change would be i am legend with will smith. They should have used the deleated ending!

[AnakinFlair]

Another ending where I saw lots of foreshadowing and it amounted to a hill of beans. The Slayer's power was 'chained to the earth' and it was strongly implied that the men who created the first Slayer did so by binding the power of an actual demon into her, so she had the strength to protect them from other demons.

And then they cast a spell that activates dozens of Slayers all at once, in theory making that demon dozens of times more powerful! (Since the demon's power that Buffy channels isn't divided in half when Faith becomes a Slayer, or divided into a tiny fraction of itself when dozens of others become Slayers, they *all* become full-strength Slayers!)

And what if that nameless demon actually had a name? The First Evil? Whom they just (accidentally) vastly made stronger? That seemed like where the plot was going, and then, bam, magic necklace. It ends. Nobody is actually sure why. The First Evil just sort of gives up, I guess?

I sometimes wish Buffy ended at the end of season three. That felt like a good ending.

It's been years since I've watched these shows. Did they ever explain the amulet in Angel? I know Spike was a ghost there for a while after the amulet showed up at Wolfram & Hart, and then he became a real vampire again. But I don't remember any explanation given.


Here's a bit of a twist on the subject- I think they should have ended the Alien franchise after Aliens. Ripley, Hicks, Newt and Bishop on the Sulaco, heading back to Earth to be a family. The end. No travesty that was Alien 3, no clone Ripley in the farther future, none of it.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

I always took the activation of all of the Potential Slayers to be less about fighting The First, and more about the fact that Buffy wouldn't be alone in her calling anymore. Of course, that just makes The First superfluous.




He already did something like that in Inception- we leave the movie not knowing if Leo is in a dream or in reality. I don't think Nolan wanted to repeat himself, and a lot of the audience would have hated that.





She also accidentally blew up the transport she thought was carrying Chewie.



Heyman has said that early on, they decided they had to focus on Harry's journey exclusively, otherwise the movies would be too long. So stories got combined, condensed, or excised completely, like SPEW. And Ron did get his quidditch match, but he got it in the 6th movie. To be honest, I don't even remember any quidditch in the 5th movie, though I know it had to be there because Harry and the Twins being banned was a part of the story.

In the 5th book we saw Ron nervous about trying out for quidditch, how terrible he was at times with the Slytherin's taunting him with a song over and over again, when Harry and the twins got banned Hermione didn't seem that upset by it and was really worried as she hadn't seen Ron since the match, but Harry hadn't given Ron a second thought in that time, then Ron shows up all covered in snow and Hermione fusses over him, later on while Hermione and Harry go to see Grawp Ron and the Gryffindor quidditch team win their final match and the Gryffindor's carry Ron back to their common room on their shoulders, he's the big celebrity and when Ron learns that Harry and Hermione missed seeing his triumph yeah he's mad, but mostly at Hagrid about wanting to keep Grawp around...and also in the 5th book Ginny joins the team and she and Harry start to interact more, not romantically but still...

IN the 1st book against the troll Hermione is so scared that she can't say anything and Ron does the spell totally by himself without her help, in the 3rd book it's Ron that stands up to Sirius and tells him that he if he wants to kill Harry then he'll have to kill Ron and Hermione to, all while almost passing out due to his standing on a badly broken leg, thanks to Sirius in his dog form, but the movies gave that line to Hermione to bolster her role and on it went...

[Steel Inquisitor]

Pfff, please dude, you're just embarassing yourself.

Luke? Luke who needs to be saved by Solo and to be helped by Obi-Wan to destroy the death star? Luke who gets almost killed by a freaking wild beast on Hoth? Luke who loses a hand to Vader? Luke who is shot down during the battle of Hoth?

That Luke is more OP than Reysus Christ? Yeah, sure.

Luke pulled off an impossible shot, with no training with this specific form of the Force, by having a ghost tell him to believe in himself - Rey cut a guy's face and ran away.

[Starter Set]

Luke pulled off an impossible shot, with no training with this specific form of the Force, by having a ghost tell him to believe in himself - Rey cut a guy's face and ran away.

The shot wasn't all impossible (like for real, small target yeah but straight line, what was so hard?), he was trained and was guided by his mentor. Rey just fresh out of Jakku pulls a lightsaber from the ground to her (a thing Luke could hardly do in ESB and only managed cause his life was on the line) and beat the **** out of a Sith.

But yeah, keep digging your own grave my friend, the world needs amusement during those trying times.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

Actually didn't Luke say something about shooting some creature back home that was about the same size as the pipe or whatever that he had to fire the bomb through, so it's not entirely impossible...

[Gaastra]

Again not sure why a movie thread is talking about training of a jedi and i was done talking about it also but will talk about luke one more time.

Luks training. How much training did luke even had? Ben had him using the shield and dodging blasts for a few mins on the falcon but it was stopped by the death star and tie fighter then ben is killed right after so ben didn't train luke at all!

He has no training till empire but is able to grab that lightsaber really good from the snow! Then he goes to yoda and trains for what 2 days only? He fails the two tasks yoda asks him the lifting of the ship and the cave then runs off right after to fight vader and never does much training.

He comes back in return after he raided jabba and was jumping around like a jedi pro but with no training only to have yoda die so he never got trained!

So luke "training" was a shield test in the falcon from ben and that's it for ben and two days with yoda and that's it for lukes training.

In other words luke trained himself!

[Celestialbeyonder]

Again not sure why a movie thread is talking about training of a jedi

Not sure why you are talking about it when you ignore my answeres to Kylos "severe" wound that healed within 24 hours and Grogu fainting from using to much force despite beeing older/having more training than Rey.

He has no training till empire but is able to grab that lightsaber really good from the snow! Then he goes to yoda and trains for what 2 days only? He fails the two tasks yoda asks him the lifting of the ship and the cave then runs off right after to fight vader and never does much training.

So Luke has one short training session - then 3 YEARS of self training/guidence by Obi Wans ghost - then he trains for a week with Yoda - AND HE STILL FAILS AT EVERYTHING. Meanwhile Rey with 0 training (a few hours if one can call TLJ training) goes from less than Padawan level at the start of TFA to Jedi Knight level at the end of TLJ within 10 days AND SUCEEDS AT EVERYTHING. See the difference here?

He comes back in return after he raided jabba and was jumping around like a jedi pro but with no training only to have yoda die so he never got trained!

ONE YEAR after TESB in which he could self train himself/ build upon the foundations Yoda has shown him.

So luke "training" was a shield test in the falcon from ben and that's it for ben and two days with yoda and that's it for lukes training.In other words luke trained himself!

AND 4 YEARS OF SELF TRAINING! Frankly the ONLY thing that was strange was Lukes victory over Vader in ROTJ. However it is explained by Vaders emotional conflict which weakened him and Lukes temporary rage boost.

Basically if one thinks that Luke has not enough training to justify his abilities - then people should absolutely hate Rey.... Oh they do, because she is an OP Marey Sue. That gets handed everything to her with 0 training,

[Gaastra]

then 3 YEARS of self training/guidence by Obi Wans ghost

Luke was shocked to hear ben at the start of empire like he had not hard him in along time. Don't think luke heard from ben till then again after the end of star wars so what ghost training? Luke was on his own between new hope and jedi.

Of course if you want a "hero" (or bad guy) that is op and a mary sue in star wars look at the force unleased games. The main hero kills vader, beats luke and kills ships of people with his bare hands. He is van diesell from fatf (who has it in his contract he can't lose in the fatf films! Fatf has the ultimate mary sue in van diesell! He makes ray look tame! Heck he makes rambo 3, chuck norris and 80s arnold who killed armies in seconds without a sweat tame!)

Still don't see ray as op in fa. Again people forget she not only loses to kylo on their first fight, she loses to him in seconds! She then fights a injured klyo later. Can't comment on the later ones but don't see her as goku or one punch man in fa. Don't see her as overpowered.

[Celestialbeyonder]

Luke was shocked to hear ben at the start of empire like he had not hard him in along time.

Luke was "shocked" because he was close to death, freezing, just escaped with his life. We dont know how long it was since Luke saw Ben the last time.

Of course if you want a "hero" (or bad guy) that is op and a mary sue in star wars look at the force unleased games.

Yes Starkiller is OP and should never have been able to defeat Vader. He got OP after YEARS OF TRAINING though and basically the entire community thinks that he is OP.

Can't comment on the later ones but don't see her as goku or one punch man in fa.

Goku is OP but in order to get OP he has to train, unlock new transformations, sustain grievous injuries ect ect and One Punch Man is a comedy series. Saitama is OP and it is ackknowledged that he is OP - thats the hearth of the series.

Can you imagine Luke beating a wounded Vader at the end of ANH with the amount of "training" he got in ANH? I cant. It would have been a WTF moment. This is Rey beating Kylo. His wounds heal within 24 hours, so his armour probably absorbed most of the blasts energy. The guy is still around 1/3 or perhap even 2/3 of his max, yet Rey defeats him..... A few days ago someone leaked the supposed draft for episode 8 and 9 written in 2014 by JJ Abrams (supposedly) there Rey´s power was explained by basically beeing a puppet of Luke. This would have been an satisfactory explanation of her power. What we got, is not. And everyone who claims that Rey is not OP - I simply cant understand how your brains work to arrive at this conclusion, when compared to the rest of SW lore.

Take Darth Bane for example. Allthough the most powerful Sith of his era, all he could do before receiving training is:

- Stopping the hearth of an old and heavily drunk and unhealthy man after receiving the worst beating of his life
- Some precognition in card playing
- One 5 second force flash of good shooting

Thats it. He couldnt move objects, perform mind tricks and he sure as hell would have lost to any Sith Lord he would have dared to challange. Wounded or not.

[sunofdarkchild]

The original trilogy had the advantage of establishing the rules. We learn about the force at the same time Luke does. It's hard to break rules as they are being established. The sequel trilogy can't just break those previously established rules. Legend of Korra had a similar problem when it retconned or deviated from things which were established in the og Avatar. There is a lot of freedom when creating a new world, but once those rules are set they need to be kept or the suspension of disbelief is lost.