New WW Creative Team: Becky Cloonan, Michael Conrad and Travis Moore

[Robanker]

We really pretending the Simone run was bad? It was the only good run after Infinite Crisis all the way until Rebirth. It had its issues (Genocide didn't work and it had to pick up the pieces from the Picoult stuff/Nemesis) but I enjoyed it quite a bit.

[HsssH]

We really pretending the Simone run was bad?

No, some people are pretending that it was objectively good.

As long as we are wanting to get things "straight" let's remember that Gail wasn't dropped because of sales. She was dropped for JMS' alternative universe/reboot thing he was trying to do (and subsequently left after a handful of issues.)

And why do you think DC wanted to reboot WW? Because everyone loved Simone's run and it was a great seller? No, lots of people didn't like it and sales weren't good so DC were looking for solutions. Was solution that they picked good? No, it was real bad, but it somehow doesn't make Simone's run better.

[John Venus]

Feels like folks are trying to pass their opinions as facts.

I've read Simone's run, it wasn't as good Rucka/Perez/Jiminez but certainly much better than Heinberg, Picoult, JMS, Azarello and Wilson.

[Garrac]

I like every WW comic except for Kanigher, maybe Byrne?, Picoult, Finch, and Robinson

[Dr. Poison]

I love how Etta is written in the latest preview. She comes off as a strong, smart, capable woman. Hopefully we find out who "Management" is in this issue.

[SonOfBaldwin]

I like every WW comic except for Kanigher, maybe Byrne?, Picoult, Finch, and Robinson

I generally find something to appreciate--a character, a story, art--in every run even if I don't like particular runs overall.

[Koriand'r]

For me the runs go like this...

1. Perez
2. Rucka 1
3. Rucka 2
4. Jimenez
5. Messner-Loebs
6. Orlando
7. JMS/Hester
8. Heinberg
9. Fontana
10. Robinson (I know we're not supposed to like James Robinson's run but I honestly didn't hate it.)

[Koriand'r]

4.5 is without a doubt Cloonrad. They've done some things that are so hard to do. They added humor without it being corny or annoying. They changed Diana's voice in a way that calls back to the Golden Age, she's high energy and cocky but not in a way that's off putting. There's a freewheeling sense of adventure and sharp political allegories. So far their run has been a delight and majorly successful.

[SiegePerilous02]

We really pretending the Simone run was bad? It was the only good run after Infinite Crisis all the way until Rebirth. It had its issues (Genocide didn't work and it had to pick up the pieces from the Picoult stuff/Nemesis) but I enjoyed it quite a bit.

Feels like folks are trying to pass their opinions as facts.

I've read Simone's run, it wasn't as good Rucka/Perez/Jiminez but certainly much better than Heinberg, Picoult, JMS, Azarello and Wilson.

Considering all the crap Simone got saddled with after IC and Amazons Attack and the editorial interference she had to deal with, it's actually kind of remarkable the run is as solid as it is. In an ideal world, Rucka would have been allowed to finish his run as he planned it while Simone would have been brought on board afterward.

For the runs afterward, maybe Azzarello's run is better on a craft level and is self contained without any editorial interference. But the ideas introduced in the run are inherently incompatible with what WW represents, and Simone at least didn't introduce stuff like that.

[bardkeep]

Feels like folks are trying to pass their opinions as facts.

Yeah, I didn't mean to claim that it was objectively anything, I just meant that Gail's run is very popular around Twitter, Reddit, etc. It for sure has a lot of problems and I don't think anyone would deny that it goes seriously downhill after The Circle.

The Genocide arc was, yes, a slog when I went through the omnibus but The Circle, the GL storyline, Hollywood arc (even though I don't care for Queen of Fables), and the team-ups with Black Canary and Powergirl were all good reads.

Yeah this is how I feel. The Genocide arc was just bad, Contagion was a slog, the Asgard arc was so forgettable that I can't even tell you how I feel about it, and I thought the Achilles arc had good moments and ideas but didn't come together overall. And it's a shame that Gail had to pick up the really stupid Diana Prince spy stuff AND the Amazons Attack nonsense. Knowing it had a lot of editorial interference makes sense.

But on the positive side, The Circle is one of my favorite WW stories ever, the one-shots/mini-arcs were a lot of fun, and most importantly I really love how she writes Diana. She actually gave her a sense of humor that made sense, nailed her compassion and warmth, and hit a really good balance between formal/ponderous and casual/spirited. And she was the first person to actually make me really like Etta and buy her and Diana as besties (Cloonrad are doing a great job with Etta as well).

I also actually liked how she handled the Nemesis relationship, which is apparently controversial? I never got the sense that she was using him - she explained several times that Amazon courtship was totally different and moved really fast, and over time she realized she couldn't figure out how to do things his way so she showed him how she was thinking about it and it freaked him out. It's an interesting, more nuanced approach to the "fish out of water" thing, it added subtle depth to Amazon culture, and gave her realistic flaws (haven't we all dated someone and started thinking through a future with them waaay too early?). Also whoever took issue with her asking him to take a shower with her is wack...why do people hate when she has sex?

And her run aside, the stories she's written with Star Blossom in the last couple of anthologies have been A+. I want that team-up book.

[Gaius]

Considering all the crap Simone got saddled with after IC and Amazons Attack and the editorial interference she had to deal with, it's actually kind of remarkable the run is as solid as it is. In an ideal world, Rucka would have been allowed to finish his run as he planned it while Simone would have been brought on board afterward.

For the runs afterward, maybe Azzarello's run is better on a craft level and is self contained without any editorial interference. But the ideas introduced in the run are inherently incompatible with what WW represents, and Simone at least didn't introduce stuff like that.

Yeah, I've said it before but I think her run's biggest problem was the opposite of Rucka's first. He had a truncated ending to make way for Infinite Crisis while she inherited a mess because of Infinite Crisis/Amazons attack.

Yeah this is how I feel. The Genocide arc was just bad, Contagion was a slog, the Asgard arc was so forgettable that I can't even tell you how I feel about it, and I thought the Achilles arc had good moments and ideas but didn't come together overall. And it's a shame that Gail had to pick up the really stupid Diana Prince spy stuff AND the Amazons Attack nonsense. Knowing it had a lot of editorial interference makes sense.

But on the positive side, The Circle is one of my favorite WW stories ever, the one-shots/mini-arcs were a lot of fun, and most importantly I really love how she writes Diana. She actually gave her a sense of humor that made sense, nailed her compassion and warmth, and hit a really good balance between formal/ponderous and casual/spirited. And she was the first person to actually make me really like Etta and buy her and Diana as besties (Cloonrad are doing a great job with Etta as well).

I also actually liked how she handled the Nemesis relationship, which is apparently controversial? I never got the sense that she was using him - she explained several times that Amazon courtship was totally different and moved really fast, and over time she realized she couldn't figure out how to do things his way so she showed him how she was thinking about it and it freaked him out. It's an interesting, more nuanced approach to the "fish out of water" thing, it added subtle depth to Amazon culture, and gave her realistic flaws (haven't we all dated someone and started thinking through a future with them waaay too early?). Also whoever took issue with her asking him to take a shower with her is wack...why do people hate when she has sex?

And her run aside, the stories she's written with Star Blossom in the last couple of anthologies have been A+. I want that team-up book.

Don't know if you read it (or if it's even easily available now) but her Conan crossover from a few years back was pretty enjoyable, was a better version of the viking arc from her run.

[SonOfBaldwin]

I really liked Gail Simone's "The Circle" arc and I also really liked the arc where she brought back the Empress of the Snake. And there were several issues with the Bernard Chang art that I really liked as well.

[bardkeep]

I really liked Gail Simone's "The Circle" arc and I also really liked the arc where she brought back the Empress of the Snake. And there were several issues with the Bernard Chang art that I really liked as well.

Oh yeah that's another thing, the artwork was consistently top-notch. Bernard Chang was probably my least favorite of the major artists on the run but he still did a great job, the competition was just super steep - the Dodsons and Nicola Scott are obviously legendary on the character and Aaron Lopresti is severely underrated IMO.

[Koriand'r]

Aaron Lopresti draws beautiful faces but his art has a puritanical quality I dislike. You could tell he was a Conservative Christian by some of his fashion choices. Whenever he had to draw Diana in regular clothes she looked like she stepped out of a 1950's Doris Day movie.

Bernard Chang's art I didn't like at all, it was too unrefined for my tastes, unlike Lopresti's smooth, clean, lines.

[Dr. Poison]

For me the runs go like this...

1. Perez
2. Rucka 1
3. Rucka 2
4. Jimenez
5. Messner-Loebs
6. Orlando
7. JMS/Hester
8. Heinberg
9. Fontana
10. Robinson (I know we're not supposed to like James Robinson's run but I honestly didn't hate it.)

While Robinson's Jason story didn't play out anywhere near the way I wanted it to, I liked the other stories that he wrote especially the one with Zara and the Blue Snowman.