New WW Creative Team: Becky Cloonan, Michael Conrad and Travis Moore

[Koriand'r]

Yara seems to me to be a boring and bad designed character, in addition to the fact that her miniseries is terribly poorly written, and at the time I criticized everything that seemed to me to be wrong about her series, for which I left her after number 3. A few days ago I read the 7 consecutive numbers preparing for TotA, and it really convinces me more than everything I had already thought.
I don't particularly hate Yara, in fact I hope that she will be included in the Wonder Woman series and can generate ties and a relationship with Diana, it is the only way that over time I can accept her as part of the Wonderverse, but what's the point of her being a Wonder Girl totally disaffected to Diana? Of course they have to keep the creator away from her, I don't want Joelle Jones anywhere near Diana or her main serie, and I think with a decent writer Yara has a lot of opportunities.
I have already said all this before in different posts, and I think that people here can stop enjoying something, I never felt very enthusiastic, but it is real that something new in the Wonderverse can generate a hype that can later fall below due, in this case and according to me, to the lousy writer.
Let's be respectful of the tastes of others, as I always say good for those who enjoy it, what better thing than being able to read something you like, for the rest that we don't, we will wait for better opportunities to enjoy it some day, maybe.

As the kids say that's all cap. Joelle Jones is NOT a "lousy writer" her Catwoman run was endlessly entertaining and her Wonder Girl has been fun no matter how much an extremely vocal minority has campaigned against the book. That's the thing about hyperbole, when you say something subjective as if it were fact, especially something like Yara Flor being "a boring and bad designed character" when so many of us agree that her costume design is amazing (as evidenced by the plethora of pin-ups from fan art to comics professionals) it makes you seem disingenuous. And I'll say this as controversial as it sounds, I have to side eye people who rail so vehemently against a new character of color in an effort to prop up her Caucasian counterparts. I'm not saying it's racist, I'm just saying it looks funny and not in a good way.

[Mel Dyer]

As the kids say that's all cap. Joelle Jones is NOT a "lousy writer" her Catwoman run was endlessly entertaining and her Wonder Girl has been fun no matter how much an extremely vocal minority has campaigned against the book. That's the thing about hyperbole, when you say something subjective as if it were fact, especially something like Yara Flor being "a boring and bad designed character" when so many of us agree that her costume design is amazing (as evidenced by the plethora of pin-ups from fan art to comics professionals) it makes you seem disingenuous. And I'll say this as controversial as it sounds, I have to side eye people who rail so vehemently against a new character of color in an effort to prop up her Caucasian counterparts. I'm not saying it's racist, I'm just saying it looks funny and not in a good way.

I'm with you, in calling out some unfairness, in the trashing of Yara Flor.

I don't know if it's her race or her sexiness that's soliciting such mean-spiritedness. Some of us seem to be rabidly opposed to anything that inspires the slightest heterosexual interest in superheroines, condemning all of it, as exploitative and dehumanizing of women - it's not. There certainly seems to be some recurring misandry (man-hating) in our community, expressed in how we attack any male in the WW comic, who isn't deferential to Diana. While Yara isn't a man, Joelle Jones certainly shows her to be heterosexual and demonstratively so, and loves herself some hot, swaggering, blue-collar Tennessee Williams types, ..in João the Cabby.

Seriously...are we twisted out of shape, about THAT? From where I'm standing, ..some the Yara-crit just seems unfair.

Latin America and Latinos in America have an aesthetic, social expectation of what a man should look like...what he should be celebrated for. It's pretty plain and doesn't leave much room for diversity of interpretation, and Joelle Jones shows Yara loving that kind of Latin man - hard-working guys (who never get Wayne-rich), lovers ..and fathers. There's a whole world of Latin American women and men and families, who LOVE guys, like João. Do we hate Yara Flor, for that?

Being Mexican American myself, I think that's a Latin American thing; I'm not going to trash Joelle Jones or her character, for that, ..and I'm not going to apologize for it. We don't have to approve of it, but, Yara's sexuality, like Starfire's, ..is an expression of culture.

Honestly, I think Yara would have been better served, had she been introduced, helping Diana and her friends, in a short (VERY short) scene, in the WW comic, ..or a single-issue story, at the most, ..the way Yvonne Craig's Batgirl was introduced in Detective Comics #359. That's how new, recurring characters were introduced in the old days, before popping them up, in a 3-4 issue miniseries.

As I see it, it shouldn't take a four or six-issue mini, to tell me who Wonder girl is. We don't need that BS, just to fill an eight-issue trade paperback. All we needed to introduce a new Wonder Girl was a good story, ..even a short one. I would love to see the WG comic, followed up, by a new WONDER WOMAN FAMILY anthology comic, with small, stand-alone and two-issue stories about Wonder W., Etta Candy, Col. Steve, Artemis, Donna Troy, Nubia, new Shining Knight (Siggy), new Wonder Girl (Yara Flor), young Circe, heroic Hercules ..and I Ching. I think that would be a much better, on-going vehicle for Yara Flor, than her own title series.

For me, the problem, with Yara, is too much Yara, ..way too fast.

[Alpha]

Yeah I don't understand the Yara hate. The Wonder Girls book seems to be taking too long to move the plot forward, but it's genuinely showing love to the Wonderworld while introducing really cool new ideas like the automatons and a whole new mythology.

And you are crazy if you think DC would switch Diana for Donna Troy, who looks exactly like Diana. At most they would switch her with Artemis again or Nubia.

Yara's appearances in Future State were awesome, and the sad part is that one year later we still haven't seen her in her prime again.

And her design is amazing. Best Assymetric design we've had in a long time, or maybe ever

[Gaius]

I think the fans who weren't interested in Yara have stayed pretty consistent in being disinterested from the beginning to now.

There is no need to bash the character, but I don't think there was a unanimous hype train among the regulars here that's been derailed.

This pretty much. I wasn't particularly interested in Yara when FS debuted but I gave her FS and the first half of her solo series a chance but nothing in her solo stuff was particularly outstanding enough to keep my attention.

Maybe her mini with Jon Kent Superman was a banger but no interest in any Superman/WW books.

[Matt Rat]

As the kids say that's all cap. Joelle Jones is NOT a "lousy writer" her Catwoman run was endlessly entertaining

Nah, it was pretty naff and didn't know what it wanted to be thanks to those ridiculous "Year of the Villain" tie-ins, and it was doomed as a story because Selina had to tie back into whatever King was doing. Trying to launch a book right after the Bat-Wedding soured everybody on Selina wasn't the wisest choice. Ram V's run was when the book arguably bounced back, because at least by then Selina was closer to home and was only on a 'break' from Bruce, so it was easier to follow her story without being mad at her.

[OBrianTallent]

I would say at this point the thread should be retitled to the Cloonrad era as we have gone far beyond discussing just their work.

But as for the current course of topic, count me in as not a fan of Yara. While I do like Joelle's work, I did think the mini series (I suppose we can officially call it that since it only lasted 7 issues) took far too long to get to any kind of point. Why is she Wonder Girl? Why is she wearing the stylized W? Those are questions we never got answered. So far she is just Yara Flor. I also think it took too long to get the other Wonder characters to have any kind of interaction with her. Had those things been cleared up early on, it might have been a better story for the character.
As for her design....to me, it's horrendous. The emblem doesn't work in harmony with the rest of the design, it's overly busy. Here's two other designs I found online:
thumbnail_WG-Yara-Flor-Concept-Art-Joëlle-Jones-for-DC.jpg ply_wonder_woman_joelle2.jpg
The first one is just a little plain, but doesn't cause eye fatigue when looking at it. The second, looks like it could have been an interesting design for the character. I find it interesting that the pants were swapped out for the long sleeves, which I do think works better. This image makes me think her current design would work better in black and white rather than blue and red.
ply_future_state_costume_inspiration_gold.jpg

However, back on point, for the seven issues (not counting Future State) there should have been much more interaction with the Wonder Family. She should have met Diana at the very least. It's possible that would have happened and been part of the plan by the end of the first 12 issues, but plans change and hiccups happen (late shipping, slipped schedules etc.)
Her personality is fun and quirky and her weapons are cool and unique and she's got a cool horse...but as a Wonder family member, she's just a bit flat to me.

[Sebastianne]

As the kids say that's all cap. Joelle Jones is NOT a "lousy writer" her Catwoman run was endlessly entertaining and her Wonder Girl has been fun no matter how much an extremely vocal minority has campaigned against the book.

I judge her only by her WG mini, so for me she is.

That's the thing about hyperbole, when you say something subjective as if it were fact, especially something like Yara Flor being "a boring and bad designed character" when so many of us agree that her costume design is amazing (as evidenced by the plethora of pin-ups from fan art to comics professionals) it makes you seem disingenuous.

I don't like her outfit, periodt.

And I'll say this as controversial as it sounds, I have to side eye people who rail so vehemently against a new character of color in an effort to prop up her Caucasian counterparts. I'm not saying it's racist, I'm just saying it looks funny and not in a good way.

You are projecting yourself too much.

[Sebastianne]

Anyway going back to the thread, reading some of Conrad's tweets, and the ideas they've left floating around in the series, Holliday girls, Villany Inc., Jumpa, Wonder Woman's doppelganger from the mirror verse, Steve's new girlfriend, something with Maxwell Lord, Wonder Girls etc. I feel like the monthly publication is not enough to cover so many ideas that they have, in addition to the fact that some are left behind because time passes quickly, it seems to me an eternity since we saw the Holliday Girls in that distant issue 780 for set an example.
You believe that we would need a publication every fifteen days or another complementary series to develop these ideas in parallel? I really feel like I need more production from this creative team, in addition to Nubia and the Amazons and Artemis and the Banas.

[SiegePerilous02]

And I'll say this as controversial as it sounds, I have to side eye people who rail so vehemently against a new character of color in an effort to prop up her Caucasian counterparts. I'm not saying it's racist, I'm just saying it looks funny and not in a good way.

It may just be the "new character" part and not the "of color" part that people are disinterested in. Fans tend to not like new characters who are propped up with major important identities but take up page time that old favorites are already struggling to get. Same with Jace not really setting the world on fire over in Batman because he's so disconnected from every other major character, and that IP is already crowded.

Meanwhile, nobody has any issue with Nubia getting a major push and we always want more Artemis (when artists remember she is a POC).

Anyway going back to the thread, reading some of Conrad's tweets, and the ideas they've left floating around in the series, Holliday girls, Villany Inc., Jumpa, Wonder Woman's doppelganger from the mirror verse, Steve's new girlfriend, something with Maxwell Lord, Wonder Girls etc. I feel like the monthly publication is not enough to cover so many ideas that they have, in addition to the fact that some are left behind because time passes quickly, it seems to me an eternity since we saw the Holliday Girls in that distant issue 780 for set an example.
You believe that we would need a publication every fifteen days or another complementary series to develop these ideas in parallel? I really feel like I need more production from this creative team, in addition to Nubia and the Amazons and Artemis and the Banas.

A 52 or Batman Eternal style series would be great for the number of ideas they seem to have, with the rotating writing team of Cloonrad and the writers from Nubia, maybe some others.

[HestiasHearth]

Yara seems to me to be a boring and bad designed character, in addition to the fact that her miniseries is terribly poorly written, and at the time I criticized everything that seemed to me to be wrong about her series, for which I left her after number 3. A few days ago I read the 7 consecutive numbers preparing for TotA, and it really convinces me more than everything I had already thought.
I don't particularly hate Yara, in fact I hope that she will be included in the Wonder Woman series and can generate ties and a relationship with Diana, it is the only way that over time I can accept her as part of the Wonderverse, but what's the point of her being a Wonder Girl totally disaffected to Diana? Of course they have to keep the creator away from her, I don't want Joelle Jones anywhere near Diana or her main serie, and I think with a decent writer Yara has a lot of opportunities.
I have already said all this before in different posts, and I think that people here can stop enjoying something, I never felt very enthusiastic, but it is real that something new in the Wonderverse can generate a hype that can later fall below due, in this case and according to me, to the lousy writer.
Let's be respectful of the tastes of others, as I always say good for those who enjoy it, what better thing than being able to read something you like, for the rest that we don't, we will wait for better opportunities to enjoy it some day, maybe.

Concur with that bolded text 100 %. To me she seems as bland as one gets, and I cannot believe that some people actually think she should "replace" Diana. Nubia is awesome and I will go with her to the ends of the earth. Yara, not so much. And nope, the costume was not anything extraordinary either.

[Robanker]

I've been away from comics for a while due to a lot of issues offline, but when I left Yara was the new hotness and we all loved her and I've returned and now she's hated? What the hell did I miss?

[Primal Slayer]

I've been away from comics for a while due to a lot of issues offline, but when I left Yara was the new hotness and we all loved her and I've returned and now she's hated? What the hell did I miss?

She may become WW again and thus sideline Diana for a hot minute.

[Robanker]

She may become WW again and thus sideline Diana for a hot minute.

During the whole "the OGs die in space" timeframe of Dark Crisis?

I'm not happy about losing Diana again, but given everyone else is also being taken off the board, I understand why it's going to be Yara even if I think it should be Donna. I'm not going to hold that against Yara when Luke and Jon have been occupying their respective roles for longer than she has and likely will.

[Fuzzy Mittens]

A 52 or Batman Eternal style series would be great for the number of ideas they seem to have, with the rotating writing team of Cloonrad and the writers from Nubia, maybe some others.

Oh id love to see something along those lines. Ive no idea how it would work as Batman Eternal required three different writers and a cavalcade of rotating artists, but gosh that would be a fascinating piece of work....

[Sebastianne]

Oh id love to see something along those lines. Ive no idea how it would work as Batman Eternal required three different writers and a cavalcade of rotating artists, but gosh that would be a fascinating piece of work....

I was checking that, it would be something like Batman Urban Legends? how lucky is He with all those series where they develop more about his universe, I want even one like that for WW.