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  1. #61
    Astonishing Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Thing is that in that case, we need the Justice Underground to be a far stronger team than they are. Because if the Crime Syndicate continues to completely dominate their world, than the cops and the military andbthe government stand no chance.
    Hell yeah! They need competition, and I think there's two main sources for that. First is by expanding the Justice Underground; I know that classically, Luthor was the only super-hero on Earth 3, but I'm far more interested in the "Batman: The Brave and the Bold" approach where any villain can be a hero instead. Good versions of Grodd, Cheetah, Manta, Scarecrow, etc.

    The other method to create competition for the Syndicate is to have rivalries between super-heroes. Some of this can be infighting between two Syndicate heads who don't want to share territory ("Owlman v. Ultraman: Justice of the Dons" has a nice ring to it, haha!) or it could be between the Syndicate and other super-crime lords who aren't part of the inner circle. I think there's at least one version of Ultraman who claims his first big challenge was a rival criminal Martian?

    Though I'll also say, in line with the way that just plain crooks, with no powers, still occasionally give the individual members of the JLA a hard time (tho not the team as a whole), I do think that every so often, a normal cop, detective, CIA agent, should pose a threat to Ultraman, Owlman, Jonny Quick, etc.

    Either way, I think there's a lot of room to expand and explore Earth 3, and I think taking it in the direction of just plain old "world domination" is ultimately... kind of boring.
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  2. #62
    Invincible Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    They could also show us the JSA and Titans counterparts. The Crime Lodge and the Young Offenders.
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  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adekis View Post
    Hell yeah! They need competition, and I think there's two main sources for that. First is by expanding the Justice Underground; I know that classically, Luthor was the only super-hero on Earth 3, but I'm far more interested in the "Batman: The Brave and the Bold" approach where any villain can be a hero instead. Good versions of Grodd, Cheetah, Manta, Scarecrow, etc.
    Ooh, I would love that. An underground led by people like Deathstroke, completely blind in this world because he gouged out his own remaining eye to save him from becoming possessed again by his teenaged son Jericho, who forced him to betray the previous Justice Underground to the Syndicate and their allies... Crazy stuff like that. Also it's interesting that so many villains are not powered, like many of the Flash's Rogues, or Batman's foes, perhaps suggesting that, in this world, power *does* corrupt. And maybe the fish rots from the head, and the source of this 'power corrupts' goes all the way to the top, with the Specter being Hell's Vengeance, a fallen figure of great wickedness?

    An evil Titans, with Grayson as Slade's apprentice who turned to wickedness, Raven as Trigon's Daughter, stringing her father along because she enjoys the power she wields in his name while he can't break through without her help, Starfire as an alien conqueror, here to help weaken Earth enough so that it can be subjugated by her Okaaran masters, etc. could be naughty fun.

  4. #64
    Astonishing Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    They could also show us the JSA and Titans counterparts. The Crime Lodge and the Young Offenders.
    Yes! I'd love to see that. I'm sure the Lodge wouldn't fully cede it's territory and influence to the Syndicate, and meanwhile, the Young Offenders would obviously want to make a name for themselves by moving in on the Syndicate's territory, so it's like a mirrored conflict.

    In my mind, a lot of the conflict comes from the fact that different mobs just don't get along as easily as different super-heroes do, so there would be a lot of infighting over resources, territory, power, respect, in addition to all super-criminals needing to fight off the legitimate would-be crime busters like the Justice Underground.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sutekh View Post
    Ooh, I would love that. An underground led by people like Deathstroke, completely blind in this world because he gouged out his own remaining eye to save him from becoming possessed again by his teenaged son Jericho, who forced him to betray the previous Justice Underground to the Syndicate and their allies... Crazy stuff like that. Also it's interesting that so many villains are not powered, like many of the Flash's Rogues, or Batman's foes, perhaps suggesting that, in this world, power *does* corrupt. And maybe the fish rots from the head, and the source of this 'power corrupts' goes all the way to the top, with the Specter being Hell's Vengeance, a fallen figure of great wickedness?

    An evil Titans, with Grayson as Slade's apprentice who turned to wickedness, Raven as Trigon's Daughter, stringing her father along because she enjoys the power she wields in his name while he can't break through without her help, Starfire as an alien conqueror, here to help weaken Earth enough so that it can be subjugated by her Okaaran masters, etc. could be naughty fun.
    I don't know about the changing the fundamental nature of how power corrupting works in this universe compared to real life - it seems too much like externally mandated alignment change, something I really don't care for. I'm interested in the narrative rule of "the bad guys usually win in this universe," but not in the proposal that maybe getting powers just turns you evil. I mean, there are a lot of villains with powers.

    Imagine Black Adam, who sometimes makes alignments with the Syndicate or the Lodge, but they're never sure how much or how long they can trust him because of his heroic history! Think about the psychic super-cop Newcastle White, who's gone up against Ultraman and almost won, or the would-be hero Hank Henshaw, the Cyborg-Ultraman who impersonated the real dead after he died, and tried to use Ultraman's reputation and resources to improve the global community! There's too many good powered "heroes" to give up, in my mind.

    But I like some of your other ideas a lot. Slade having to blind himself to save himself from his evil son Jericho sounds awesome! Owlman's former sidekick Talon could briefly join Slade, horrifying the rest of the super-villain world when they realize how he knows so much and is friends with so many people, that his testimony could potentially put them all away forever, only for him to turn on Slade in the end.

    Raven uses the holy power of her angelic father Trigon for personal gain and evil, as he can only watch in horror from his imprisonment, perhaps? Lots of ideas to be found in twisting these characters around!
    Last edited by Adekis; 01-28-2021 at 02:14 PM.
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  5. #65
    Incredible Member SuperX's Avatar
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    Justice Underground is a cool name, maybe the YJ team can take that name and do more covert things, while the younger kids get the YJ name

    Can't the suicide squad be the ones who could be set up to handle the chime syndicate, like in future state.
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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adekis View Post
    Raven uses the holy power of her angelic father Trigon for personal gain and evil, as he can only watch in horror from his imprisonment, perhaps? Lots of ideas to be found in twisting these characters around!
    Ooh, I hadn't thought that far down, and imagined Raven as a daughter of a demon Trigon, tapping into his demonic power but never quite getting around to opening the gate and letting him into this dimension (because then she wouldn't be in charge of the Church of Blood anymore...).

    Raven as daughter of an angelic Trigon, using her powers for evil, is even more twisty!

  7. #67
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperX View Post
    Justice Underground is a cool name, maybe the YJ team can take that name and do more covert things, while the younger kids get the YJ name

    Can't the suicide squad be the ones who could be set up to handle the chime syndicate, like in future state.
    The Outsiders already do that. I prefer to let them continue to scratch that itch instead of taking away their unique role. And I don't like the idea of Conner becoming a permanent part of a covert team. He has been pushed away from public acknowledgement for so long, he needs a place where he can connect to people in his own way.

    Justice Underground really is a cool name. Kurt Busiek made it up. Check the DC Database

  8. #68
    Astonishing Member Mutant God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Digifiend View Post
    They could also show us the JSA and Titans counterparts. The Crime Lodge and the Young Offenders.

    Doom Patrol - Peace Killers ( A group of deranged killers)
    Suicide Squad - Resurrection Army (Ras al-Ghul uses the Lazarus Pit to bring back everyone the CS killed and uses them to fight them)
    Outsiders - Insiders (wealthy criminals and corrupt government agents)

  9. #69
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    I like those ideas man. Earth 3 has always been such an interesting concept when done creatively

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