PKJ Action Comics Discussion and Spoilers

[DragonPiece]

Editorial really doesn't like her, at least historically. We're in a new regime so hopefully it changes, but I'm not betting on it. That said, a lot of the Ol' Boys club is seemingly purged so I think in time we'll start seeing more respect for Lois when she does show up even if it's not as often as we'd like.

What I will say is I sincerely hope his tight-lipped nature on Lois is more because there are some huge plans for her elsewhere he can't spoil and it's him being a good collaborator holding him back. I doubt that, but we know Bendis has plans for her over in Checkmate and he seems unable to speak of what's happening in a few months for any character, so with luck it just looks worse with Lois because she's harder to speak in platitudes about with respect to the cosmic focus. A lot of his talks even for Clark and Jon have been very broad "I like him as a dad and hey space," at least from what I've gleaned. For all we know, Bendis taking control of Lois in Checkmate was on the condition that he controls her and Phil actually can't control her fate despite running the Superman books. Does that sound stupid? Yes! But I've heard stories from editorial meetings of many writing teams across all mediums that make it sound quite plausible. We really don't know what's up.

Can he do better in addressing Lois Lane's fans? Yup, and I wish he would because she's my favorite character after Clark himself, but as I get older I'm learning more and more how hard it is to need to speak to multiple sources for hours on end and say absolutely nothing about the key players. We know the basic trajectory he wants to direct the book in, but not really any details. Even so, I'm still worried but I'm hopeful. I went into KSD's Aquaman dreading the Big Three New Aquaman Writer Woes (amnesia, movie synergy and torpedoing his relationship-- oh my!) but taking a chance paid off big in the long run and she delivered a pretty fun run. Hoping my misgivings with what's being said about Lois ultimately prove unfounded in the end.

I'm still a bit behind in my reading so I can't comment much on his work (I did cheat and read Batman/Superman by Yang which was excellent) but this is me looking for a silver lining in a cloud otherwise poised to rain on my parade.

I think it's clear he doesn't have some secret, big plans for Lois lol. He most likely just never had big plans for her and doesn't want to outright say that and get people asking to not buy his run. At least we've got Lois in checkmate in the summer.

[rpmaluki]

I think it was a conscious decision on his part to leave Lois out, or at the least sideline her. It sounds like he doesn't value her all that much and since he got the run he has been bombarded by concerned Lois fans, much to his surprise. He doesn't have answers to all the Lois questions because he had no plans for her at all. I'm not convinced it's all editorial.

[Yoda]

I don't get the sense he put much thought into her at all really until he started getting the pushback he is. He had just no interest in the DP portion of Superman and wants to reinvent him in some Planet Hulk style run. I don't think it's an active dislike and resentment of her like the New 52 editorial office or Austen had, so I do hold out hope for some.course correction.

I like how Bendis writes Lois, so I am looking forward to Checkmate.

But I am skeptical of anyone who looks at Kingdom Come Superman as capturing the essence of the character. That Superman is more toxic than Injustice Superman from my POV.

[rpmaluki]

I don't get the sense he put much thought into her at all really until he started getting the pushback he is. He had just no interest in the DP portion of Superman and wants to reinvent him in some Planet Hulk style run. I don't think it's an active dislike and resentment of her like the New 52 editorial office or Austen had, so I do hold out hope for some.course correction.

I like how Bendis writes Lois, so I am looking forward to Checkmate.

But I am skeptical of anyone who looks at Kingdom Come Superman as capturing the essence of the character. That Superman is more toxic than Injustice Superman from my POV.

I don't think he actively dislikes Lois, she just doesn't register high on the lists of people he likes to write/would like to write.

I am glad for Checkmate. It's a mini but at least it will feature Lois heavily. I never thought I'd be glad to have a book delayed until now. Had this book come out months ago, then there'd be almost nothing for Lois. If Yang features her somewhat, I just might buy that Batman/Superman book.

[Yoda]

I don't think he actively dislikes Lois, she just doesn't register high on the lists of people he likes to write/would like to write.

I am glad for Checkmate. It's a mini but at least it will feature Lois heavily. I never thought I'd be glad to have a book delayed until now. Had this book come out months ago, then there'd be almost nothing for Lois. If Yang features her somewhat, I just might buy that Batman/Superman book.

Yeah, outside of Superman I don't get the sense he cares for any of the mythos actually. Jon fits into his world building ideas so that is why he's featured, but it has nothing to do with Jon as a character just as a legacy and leading into his House of El stuff.

Yang is using Lois in the multiverse stories and she was great in that first issue. He appreciates her as a character and I think he'll continue to feature her.

[Vordan]

Lois is in Blue & Red, Checkmate, Batman/Superman, and will be in Superman ‘78. There’s a cool Superman & Lois pitch that would star her prominently you can vote for in the Round Robin tournament. Lois is fine, she’ll be showing up elsewhere, and she’s still appearing in his run, we know she will show up in Action because Sampere posted a piece of art with her and Clark. She’s just not the focus the same way she wasn’t when Tomasi was writing Superman.

Yeah, outside of Superman I don't get the sense he cares for any of the mythos actually. Jon fits into his world building ideas so that is why he's featured, but it has nothing to do with Jon as a character just as a legacy and leading into his House of El stuff.

Yang is using Lois in the multiverse stories and she was great in that first issue. He appreciates her as a character and I think he'll continue to feature her.

If you’re arguing that he doesn’t really have much interest in the classic status quo, I’d say his love of the Chris Reeve films would disprove that. He’s using Mongul and Warworld as the first big focus of his Action Comics run and his Annual is set to bring back an underserved part of the Supermythos. I posted his Q&A where he named the usual classic Superman works as his favorites and more under appreciated ones like Superman 400 alongside those. He clearly does love the character and his mythos, he’s just not focusing on Lois, and controversial opinion time I would rather he didn’t if he’s not interested in centering her. She’ll still be getting used and she’s still the focus of other books, but her name isn’t on the title so she’s a supporting character. Not every Spider-Man story heavily features MJ or every Batman story heavily features Selina.

Ultimately there’s a shakeup to the main books coming soon after the event so perhaps the new team taking over one of the books will have plans for her but Lois is getting used more heavily than most of the heroes in DC’s roster. I don’t feel like she’s being underserved if she’s not the focus here.

[Sacred Knight]

I would agree with that. Only total absence bothers me in terms of Lois because well, when you're above recurring an absense is always going to be noticed, and she's way above that. But I mean I've taken heat before for saying it like its an insult when its not, but on the reg she isn't a co-lead. She's a co-lead or a lead when her name is on the project, which indeed does happen sometimes. But with Superman's regular monthlies, she's the main supporting character. And its been that way to great success for 80 odd years. And that's fine. I don't find that an insulting role at all.

But like I said before with the total absence comment, it always feels odd when she's generally divorced from a direction altogether. That's something different, and I can see the annoyance there on that particular level.

[JorgeJ77]

I don't get the sense he put much thought into her at all really until he started getting the pushback he is. He had just no interest in the DP portion of Superman and wants to reinvent him in some Planet Hulk style run. I don't think it's an active dislike and resentment of her like the New 52 editorial office or Austen had, so I do hold out hope for some.course correction.

I like how Bendis writes Lois, so I am looking forward to Checkmate.

But I am skeptical of anyone who looks at Kingdom Come Superman as capturing the essence of the character. That Superman is more toxic than Injustice Superman from my POV.

Yeah, I like when Bendis wrote Lois like a horrible person.

[Yoda]

Lois is in Blue & Red, Checkmate, Batman/Superman, and will be in Superman ‘78.

While I don't really subscribe to this view, all those books "don't count" to most comic fans. Adventures of Superman ran during New 52 as well along with Smallville Season 11 and that really didn't alievate the way New 52 Lois got sidelined. And Jimmy is getting a Blue & Red story before she is.

I mean really, she is co-staring in Superman & Lois, which has like 2 million viewers for each episode. The 20,000 to 30,000 or so monthly comics buyers don't matter in the long run. But it doesn't mean I don't care that she's not going to be in the books that count.

There’s a cool Superman & Lois pitch that would star her prominently you can vote for in the Round Robin tournament.

The irony of that pitch (and the Imperious Rex mini) is that it is a storyline that kind of puts the lie to PKJ's justification for not using Lois in his run - that she doesn't work off Earth.

Lois is fine, she’ll be showing up elsewhere, and she’s still appearing in his run, we know she will show up in Action because Sampere posted a piece of art with her and Clark. She’s just not the focus the same way she wasn’t when Tomasi was writing Superman.

I wasn't a fan of how Tomasi & Gleason used Lois, but even there she did more than just show up in a few panels here and there. She was involved in pretty much all of the main storylines. There's no indication that that will be the case in Action or Superman before the event.

If you’re arguing that he doesn’t really have much interest in the classic status quo, I’d say his love of the Chris Reeve films would disprove that. He’s using Mongul and Warworld as the first big focus of his Action Comics run and his Annual is set to bring back an underserved part of the Supermythos. I posted his Q&A where he named the usual classic Superman works as his favorites and more under appreciated ones like Superman 400 alongside those. He clearly does love the character and his mythos, he’s just not focusing on Lois, and controversial opinion time I would rather he didn’t if he’s not interested in centering her. She’ll still be getting used and she’s still the focus of other books, but her name isn’t on the title so she’s a supporting character. Not every Spider-Man story heavily features MJ or every Batman story heavily features Selina.

That was a little hyperbolic of me. In the lead up to the New 52 the party line was how breaking up the marriage would actually improve Lois and how much we'd see how valuable she was as a character, etc. That was obviously BS. So I mean, the canned responses he uses across pretty much every interview really don't matter until we see what he actually does with the books. But he has changed his canned responses a little over the past few months seemingly recognizing that she is more than your basic supporting character.

But I guess I mean more that he isn't interested in telling a story using any of the classic elements. It may very well be what he's liked, but as of right now it doesn't seem to be the type of story he wants to tell. His main focus is on world building that completely divorces the character from the mainline DCU and all his classic status quo elements it seems. I may be wrong, but just cause he's pulling out some one off alien race from some Bronze Age book or something really doesn't tell me he values the parts of the myth all that heavily. He want's to make his own mark, build his own world and plop Superman into it. That's fine and can work for some good stories - Planet Hulk is one of my favorite Hulk stories. But we aren't talking about an arc, this is the direction of the entire line for the foreseeable future. And weirdly its a storyline where she should have some focus or centering - she's Jon's mother!

It's possible that when the books split we'll see she works into Jon's side a little more. But his canned response to where she'd turn up in his run was that there would be Metropolis focused back ups and she isn't showing up in those either so far.

[Robanker]

I think it's clear he doesn't have some secret, big plans for Lois lol. He most likely just never had big plans for her and doesn't want to outright say that and get people asking to not buy his run. At least we've got Lois in checkmate in the summer.

I don't get the sense he put much thought into her at all really until he started getting the pushback he is. He had just no interest in the DP portion of Superman and wants to reinvent him in some Planet Hulk style run. I don't think it's an active dislike and resentment of her like the New 52 editorial office or Austen had, so I do hold out hope for some.course correction.

I like how Bendis writes Lois, so I am looking forward to Checkmate.

But I am skeptical of anyone who looks at Kingdom Come Superman as capturing the essence of the character. That Superman is more toxic than Injustice Superman from my POV.

I also doubt he's got plans for her. My only hope is that Bendis does and that PKJ is staying mum not to spoil them. Doubtful, but it's either that or be frustrated, which is doubtless to come in the future so bring on the pointless optimism. lol

[Vordan]

While I don't really subscribe to this view, all those books "don't count" to most comic fans. Adventures of Superman ran during New 52 as well along with Smallville Season 11 and that really didn't alievate the way New 52 Lois got sidelined. And Jimmy is getting a Blue & Red story before she is.

Fair enough, although in Superman’s case “canon” as a concept has lost all meaning. I was just thinking the other day something hilarious: Superman has had 5-6 origin retellings in the last two decades and none of them are canon. Secret Origin isn’t even really, just the bare skeleton of it. If you weren’t a fan of Tomasi, Jurgens, or Bendis, pretty much ALL of your favorite stories are “non-canon” based on what a clusterf*** DC continuity is lol. So for me, if it’s a good standalone story that honestly probably helps Supes long term more than a canon story would, because it can just act as a recommendation without any caveats.

But I guess I mean more that he isn't interested in telling a story using any of the classic elements. It may very well be what he's liked, but as of right now it doesn't seem to be the type of story he wants to tell. His main focus is on world building that completely divorces the character from the mainline DCU and all his classic status quo elements it seems. I may be wrong, but just cause he's pulling out some one off alien race from some Bronze Age book or something really doesn't tell me he values the parts of the myth all that heavily. He want's to make his own mark, build his own world and plop Superman into it. That's fine and can work for some good stories - Planet Hulk is one of my favorite Hulk stories. But we aren't talking about an arc, this is the direction of the entire line for the foreseeable future. And weirdly its a storyline where she should have some focus or centering - she's Jon's mother!

It's possible that when the books split we'll see she works into Jon's side a little more. But his canned response to where she'd turn up in his run was that there would be Metropolis focused back ups and she isn't showing up in those either so far.

I was just pondering how the last time we got some real extensive work done in the “status quo” with focus on developing Superman’s classic Rogues was... Busiek/Johns era? Even Morrison and Pak’s Action tended to focus on more “new” elements. Jurgens and Tomasi were kinda hamstrung by the convoluted as all hell Rebirth status quo. Busiek and Johns were the last ones to really put in effort into revamping classic Rogues that were “uncool” like Metallo, Parasite, Prankster, Toyman, etc. They were the last ones to really focus on fleshing out Metropolis with the Science Police and the Avenue of Tomorrow and what not.

I share your frustration but honestly it seems like the Superman editorial just isn’t interested in that stuff. They just don’t care about fleshing it out which is why they keep choosing pitches that do little to nothing with “classic” Superman elements. I think Venditti’s Superman ‘78 is meant to somewhat serve that audience, we’ll see how he does. His Man of Tomorrow issues were just “ok” so I don’t expect him to really blow everyone away but you never know, Hawkman was great apparently.

But I would still love more focus on the classic Supermythos as well. Least S&L is focusing on them. We need more Superman stuff in outside media that does deep dives into his lore without making him evil.

All that said Mongul and Warworld are classic parts of Superman mythology, and those will be the focus of Action, so that side of Superman lore isn’t being totally abandoned. We’ll see what that Superman event is supposed to be about and what spins out of it as well soon enough. Hopefully it allows for at least one book to really focus on that stuff.

[Nelliebly]

Yeah, outside of Superman I don't get the sense he cares for any of the mythos actually. Jon fits into his world building ideas so that is why he's featured, but it has nothing to do with Jon as a character just as a legacy and leading into his House of El stuff.

Yang is using Lois in the multiverse stories and she was great in that first issue. He appreciates her as a character and I think he'll continue to feature her.

I mean....as others have stated well, I think he was surprised that so many people were concerned about Lois’s prominent absence (and it seems like it’s just as many men as women) and the problem is....that reflects poorly on his suitability to be writing Superman.

Lois doesn’t have to be like the co-star in every comic and I don’t think anyone here is asking for that. But if you are hired to write both Action and Superman you shouldn’t be acting this clueless when people ask you what’s going on with Lois Lane. It’s just terrible optics and reflects poorly on the entire Superman office distinctly because they have such a bad track record.

If you aren’t going to prominently use Lois, you should at least be ready to talk about her or at least expect that there will be concern over it. It doesn’t mean your ideas can’t be used but it’s an issue you should have considered thoughtfully. And, frankly, the Superman office are to blame as well because, again, why is a guy like this giving interviews to national publications and not understanding that not even mentioning her is a terrible, terrible look in 2021.

It’s less about the story he’s chosen to tell (though I agree with others that it’s both lazy and untrue that he couldn’t have found a way to give Jon’s mother more POV) and more about the crappy optics of DC hiring another white male writer for BOTH books in an office NOTORIOUS for sexism and problems with the way they treat women and then he not only doesn’t seem remotely interested in her but isn’t even doing a good job of showing that he understands that people care about her.

The offense is just as much his seemingly genuine surprise that people cared about her more than whatever book he’s writing. It reflects he’s a poor fit for this character and/or has serious gender issues that mean he’s not a good choice for DC. If you are hired to write Superman comics, you shouldn’t be taken aback that people seem concerned about Lois Lane. That should already have been on your radar and given a thoughtful consideration or you shouldn’t have been hired. Again. 2021. This stuff just isn’t ok anymore. I hope he does a better job in the future.

And yes the fact that the show is such a massive hit does give me a bit of satisfaction tbh. Because it’s just a reminder that no matter how crappy DC Comics treats her, she always wins this war. But still doesn’t excuse the office that manages the character being this clueless.

[Amacent]

Well, Lois might not be in Action Comics #1030 but this guy definitely is.
170180311_268300561699341_8868798448756648126_n.jpg

*le sigh* There hasn't even been 5 issues yet. Lovely artwork though.

[Ra-El]

Well, Lois might not be in Action Comics #1030 but this guy definitely is.
170180311_268300561699341_8868798448756648126_n.jpg

*le sigh* There hasn't even been 5 issues yet. Lovely artwork though.

Ha! So, there's been any Superman run in the last 5 years where Batman didn't show up in the first arc?

I wonder what role he will play. Will he Batsplain to Clark how he powers work? Reinforce how Jon will be more powerful than Clark? Give a Batman pep talk? Maybe Superman will need help with a investigation, since neither him or his wife have investigative skills.

[Robanker]

Ha! So, there's been any Superman run in the last 5 years where Batman didn't show up in the first arc?

I wonder what role he will play. Will he Batsplain to Clark how he powers work? Reinforce how Jon will be more powerful than Clark? Give a Batman pep talk? Maybe Superman will need help with a investigation, since neither him or his wife have investigative skills.

To be fair, the relationship with one another has become one of the most significant for both of them.

I wouldn't be so annoyed if Clark was showing up in Bruce's world more often, but we know that's not how it goes.