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  1. #916
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I feel the opposite of you. I didn’t think Aaron did a good job handling that at all, whereas so far what I’m hearing from PKJ has me interested. Aaron just dumped on Odinson to shill Jane, and Thor didn’t really do anything while he was hammerless. Just moped and sulked until he finally got it back. Also absolutely hated that he couldn’t even use his name while he was without his hammer, that was the dumbest **** ever.



    I don’t hate metastorytelling as a whole (I am a Morrison fanboy after all) but I hate this specific story DC keeps doing. The “oh man the DCU sure is dark hahaha, oh and continuity doesn’t make any sense does it haha, well don’t worry, we’re going to restore HOPE and HEROISM and our continuity will make sense! Just buy this event and all its tie ins please”. Sick of that story, just start telling better ones.
    Gotta agree with you on the name thing. That one was dumb. But I think the idea of Gorr's whole argument coming back and convincing Thor that the gods really weren't worthy of adoration was really good. Although it coming in the form of Nick Fury's whisper was sort of weak. Jane a doctor on her dying bed due to cancer but suddenly becoming Thor while still dying was really sweet.

  2. #917
    Invincible Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Gotta agree with you on the name thing. That one was dumb. But I think the idea of Gorr's whole argument coming back and convincing Thor that the gods really weren't worthy of adoration was really good. Although it coming in the form of Nick Fury's whisper was sort of weak. Jane a doctor on her dying bed due to cancer but suddenly becoming Thor while still dying was really sweet.
    Don’t get me wrong, there were some fantastic Jane Thor stories. It’s how Aaron handled Thor himself while he was hammerless that I wasn’t a fan of. Given PKJ seems to be keeping Action which will be the Clark solo book, and handing off Superman to someone else to write Jon in, I don’t think PKJ is going to disparage Clark given he will continue to be writing him solo. It’s not good practice to dump on the protagonist you’ll be continuing to write in a solo capacity, if you want your audience to stick around that is. That’s why I’m more optimistic.

    Gorr is one of the best new villains, I love that guy. Hopefully Bale’s portrayal of him will be good.

  3. #918
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Why are people cinvinced PKJ is gonna hand off the Superman title any time soon and that he prefers to write Clark over Jon? Did I miss something? I mean, he's putting all this work into defining Jon's conflict with having been thrown from one reality to the next multiple times. Why would he worry so much about defining Jon if he doesn't intend to write him for very long?

  4. #919
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Why are people cinvinced PKJ is gonna hand off the Superman title any time soon and that he prefers to write Clark over Jon? Did I miss something? I mean, he's putting all this work into defining Jon's conflict with having been thrown from one reality to the next multiple times. Why would he worry so much about defining Jon if he doesn't intend to write him for very long?
    Because he's said he'll only write both books for 6 months, then there'll be an event and finally he'll drop one of them and concentrate on the other.

  5. #920
    Wayward Member GSman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Why are people cinvinced PKJ is gonna hand off the Superman title any time soon and that he prefers to write Clark over Jon? Did I miss something? I mean, he's putting all this work into defining Jon's conflict with having been thrown from one reality to the next multiple times. Why would he worry so much about defining Jon if he doesn't intend to write him for very long?
    As someone else mentioned, we know he'll be dropping one of the Super books in the near future and working on just one. Though do we know it'll be the book with Clark with absolute certainty? No. It's more of an educated guess, since he writes Clark in Future State under the space status quo he'll apparently be in, in the present day soon. So the logic is that it would make sense for him to build up the space status quo since he's doing it in Future State.

  6. #921
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    I don't know why Dc comics wants to replace Clark as superman. There is only one superman Clark Kent, now and forever!! Dc needs to stop trying to make superman into something he's not. Why doesn't Dc find writers that understand the character. Write stories about who he is, not stories for those that have a problem with his values.
    Last edited by lotchj; 01-17-2021 at 11:45 AM.

  7. #922
    Black Belt in Bad Ideas Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lotchj View Post
    I don't know why Dc comics wants to replace Clark as superman. There is only one superman Clark Kent, now and forever!! Dc needs to stop trying to make superman into something he's not. Why doesn't Dc find writers that understand the character. Write stories about who he is, not stories for those that have a problem with his values.
    I do get some element of it. Clark's myth has grown to astronomical levels and everyone has a very firm belief of who he is and isn't. Unlike others who mostly just have to be cool, Superman is also a symbol of the United States to many and as such a divided nation, both sides want to claim him. Clark has become too ingrained in the American identity. Jon doesn't have that problem. Their goal is a Superman that feels familiar without the preconceived notions on what he should or shouldn't do. Everyone thinks they know Superman, and they might, but that means any decision he makes in a film isn't going to just be a choice in the movie, it's going to be checked against the viewer's interpretation and if you don't hit every note, it's not Superman.

    You really think we're going to get a Superman story-- even a cosmic one-- where he has to fight Luthor, Mongul, whatever and the Comicsgate people aren't going to whine it's a thinly veiled mockery of Trump? If Lois says one word to a male character that isn't praise, they're going to whine woke.

    Jon doesn't have any of that, but you get your Superman fix. That's honestly what it seems to be. They think the brand is too big to risk making anyone unhappy, so rather than tell a story about Superman, they're trying to start again with a new version that hopefully has what they think everyone cares about-- his powers-- and then all will be well. Jon's "safe" in that respect. Of course, Superman of Metropolis was anything but safe, but I don't trust AT&T paid that much attention to what got published.

  8. #923
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    N/M, Rob already touched up on it and I largely agree.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

  9. #924
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    I do get some element of it. Clark's myth has grown to astronomical levels and everyone has a very firm belief of who he is and isn't. Unlike others who mostly just have to be cool, Superman is also a symbol of the United States to many and as such a divided nation, both sides want to claim him. Clark has become too ingrained in the American identity. Jon doesn't have that problem. Their goal is a Superman that feels familiar without the preconceived notions on what he should or shouldn't do. Everyone thinks they know Superman, and they might, but that means any decision he makes in a film isn't going to just be a choice in the movie, it's going to be checked against the viewer's interpretation and if you don't hit every note, it's not Superman.

    You really think we're going to get a Superman story-- even a cosmic one-- where he has to fight Luthor, Mongul, whatever and the Comicsgate people aren't going to whine it's a thinly veiled mockery of Trump? If Lois says one word to a male character that isn't praise, they're going to whine woke.

    Jon doesn't have any of that, but you get your Superman fix. That's honestly what it seems to be. They think the brand is too big to risk making anyone unhappy, so rather than tell a story about Superman, they're trying to start again with a new version that hopefully has what they think everyone cares about-- his powers-- and then all will be well. Jon's "safe" in that respect. Of course, Superman of Metropolis was anything but safe, but I don't trust AT&T paid that much attention to what got published.
    You made some very good points on why Dc comics wants to replace Clark with his son!! Don't call Jon superman, give him another Name!! Let Jon be his own person completely different than his dad, Let Clark remain the one and only superman.

  10. #925
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lotchj View Post
    You made some very good points on why Dc comics wants to replace Clark with his son!! Don't call Jon superman, give him another Name!! Let Jon be his own person completely different than his dad, Let Clark remain the one and only superman.
    I got the reverse question.Why is clark called superman?cause,he was it in 1938.Clark was never the one and only superman.Bill dunn was the first superman. As for jon being his own person.He is his person.When written good.That doesn't negate being superman.for me,Superman is a strongman who protects the defenceless and the weak.Jon does that.He defended a kid from a war.So,jon is it.
    "People’s Dreams... Have No Ends"

  11. #926
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Are you saying that Jon needs to be Superman in order to be a legitimate hero? (And nobody in the DC universe knows who Bill Dunn is so that short story doesn't matter, Clark is the only Superman they know) name

    "a strongman who protects the defenseless and the weak" Are you talking about Shazam? Atom Smasher? Citizen Steel? Captain Atom? Aquaman? Hawkman? They all do that. Why does Jon need to be Superman? And why can't Conner Kent be Superman if we need someone to take up the name?

  12. #927
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Are you saying that Jon needs to be Superman in order to be a legitimate hero? (And nobody in the DC universe knows who Bill Dunn is so that short story doesn't matter, Clark is the only Superman they know) name

    "a strongman who protects the defenseless and the weak" Are you talking about Shazam? Atom Smasher? Citizen Steel? Captain Atom? Aquaman? Hawkman? They all do that. Why does Jon need to be Superman? And why can't Conner Kent be Superman if we need someone to take up the name?
    No,i am saying.Superman is title given to whomever.It can be clark kent,hugo danner or toshinori yagi.All i am saying is jon does what a superman does.So he is superman.

    Captain marvel is more of a knight of the round table than a strongman or gladiator.He is a kid and Messiah like figure(which is the beauty of the concept.A grown man playing the savior is shitty for me).Jon doesn't need to superman.But,he is.None of the other dude are superman as defined.Any strongman element they have in their design is taken from superman and in a superficial way.Superman isn't a title that can be gained just because you save people.It is more fundamental than that.You have to have the instinct to be protect those weaker.Any of these guys can be called superman if they are like that earn it from the people.Conner included.Did i say any of these guys couldn't?to be superman,people need to believe you are super.good or bad.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 01-17-2021 at 09:30 PM.
    "People’s Dreams... Have No Ends"

  13. #928
    Extraordinary Member DragonPiece's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    As someone else mentioned, we know he'll be dropping one of the Super books in the near future and working on just one. Though do we know it'll be the book with Clark with absolute certainty? No. It's more of an educated guess, since he writes Clark in Future State under the space status quo he'll apparently be in, in the present day soon. So the logic is that it would make sense for him to build up the space status quo since he's doing it in Future State.
    Hopefully DC doesn’t just have Sean Lewis write Superman after PKJ leaves

  14. #929
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    Hopefully DC doesn’t just have Sean Lewis write Superman after PKJ leaves
    You should check out the thread I made about Lewis first interview regarding his Superman book. https://community.cbr.com/showthread...uperman-writer

    It f%$king SLAPS! This dude really truly "gets it", and he has a vision for where to go next.

    Also worth noting that some of the stranger/weaker aspects of the issue were just flat out out of his hands. He didn't come up with Jon shrinking the city. That was mandated. He didn't come up with Jon and Kara's disagreements, or even the fact that Kara was there at all. That was mandated. He was tasked with setting up stuff for the whole line (including Midnighter stuff). And the main thing that he made his own was Jon's internal conflict. The level of passion and thought he has for that is very clear in both the book and his interview. It was very easily the strongest part of the book by far.

    I'd absolutely love to see him get more freedom and space to really dig into the stuff that he's so clearly passionate about the character.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!" - The Digger

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  15. #930
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    No,i am saying.Superman is title given to whomever.It can be clark kent,hugo danner or toshinori yagi.All i am saying is jon does what a superman does.So he is superman.
    This is where I'm in direct conflict with the current DC's approach. I don't see Superman as just a title for anyone who acts the part on any given Earth. It was for example the most lasting and awesome message of Reign of the Supermen so long ago. There can be those who are inspired by him and be great heroes in their own right but there is only one Superman. I am supremely disappointed to see that now after so long they're trying to turn the approach into that of Flash or Green Lantern.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 01-18-2021 at 12:03 PM.
    "They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son." - Jor-El

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