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  1. #1171
    Incredible Member witchboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Lying is in Superman's bones. At least in regards to his true identity/identities. In all incarnations, including Reeve. Is it hypocrisy, boiled right down to it sure, but its a dichotomy that should be fascinating if people weren't so afraid of it these days. This just sounds like shilling the comics line. In the comics his secret is out and he's glad, so he should be that open across all mediums. And I mean...just no. I get part of that is his job, pushing the status quo he is going to be maintaining. But I mean, this is just so in-character to not tell any hypothetical child this information for a long time.
    I have thought that the parallel between secret identities and the closet may have shifted, however unintentionally. LGBT people have always found something to identify with in super heroes having a secret life, but as we are increasingly able to live openly, the trend seems to follow that secret identities aren't as common with heroes as they used to be. I don't expect this is something that was planned, but it is the way things have gone.

  2. #1172
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    I have thought that the parallel between secret identities and the closet may have shifted, however unintentionally. LGBT people have always found something to identify with in super heroes having a secret life, but as we are increasingly able to live openly, the trend seems to follow that secret identities aren't as common with heroes as they used to be. I don't expect this is something that was planned, but it is the way things have gone.
    I think moreso it’s the MCU that has shifted heroes away from secret identities. Pretty much no one except Spider-Man in the MU has a secret identity anymore. Over on the DCU side, Diana and Arthur don’t have secret identities (funny because Diana actually does have one in the movies). Superman is out for the moment. Does Hal have a secret identity still? I know John doesn’t and neither does Guy.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

  3. #1173
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchboy View Post
    I have thought that the parallel between secret identities and the closet may have shifted, however unintentionally. LGBT people have always found something to identify with in super heroes having a secret life, but as we are increasingly able to live openly, the trend seems to follow that secret identities aren't as common with heroes as they used to be. I don't expect this is something that was planned, but it is the way things have gone.
    I think it's more just Superhero fiction veering away from the heroes having a life or persona outside their Superhero identities that has hurt it the most. All the major plot focus has gone into the Superhero side and not their life outside of it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    I think moreso itís the MCU that has shifted heroes away from secret identities. Pretty much no one except Spider-Man in the MU has a secret identity anymore. Over on the DCU side, Diana and Arthur donít have secret identities (funny because Diana actually does have one in the movies). Superman is out for the moment. Does Hal have a secret identity still? I know John doesnít and neither does Guy.
    And the MCU treats Spidey's secret identity like it's a joke.

    Hal depends on who you're asking.

  4. #1174
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I think it's more just Superhero fiction veering away from the heroes having a life or persona outside their Superhero identities that has hurt it the most. All the major plot focus has gone into the Superhero side and not their life outside of it.

    And the MCU treats Spidey's secret identity like it's a joke.

    Hal depends on who you're asking.
    There is a reason for it.These movies are pure wishfullfillment.The mcu is built around Ironman.Ironman was wishfullfillment.If you think about it,superman used to be about SUPERman,as well.The escapism is what the audiences is looking for.There might come a time when that wouldn't no more.But,that hasn't happened.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 02-28-2021 at 09:44 PM.
    "I swear to devote my life to the destruction of piracy, greed, cruelty and injustice! And my sons, and their sons, shall follow me!"

  5. #1175
    Spectacular Member The Frog Bros's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    Itís awesome, highly recommend! Hope you enjoy, I saw it as a fascinating exploration of what ďSupermanĒ can mean through the lens of Chinese culture. Kenan himself is one of my top 5 favorite Superfamily members.
    Read Vol 1 and it was awesome! Thought the banter between Kong and Batman was especially funny, and the villain names were great (plus any Starro appearance earns extra points). After I read the JL of China volume I'll have to pick up the TPs in between vols. to complete the "homemade" omnibus.
    "There is nothing quite so perfect as the exact way in which comics combine the word and image." --Alan Moore
    "Before it was a Bomb, the Bomb was an Idea. Superman, however, was a Faster, Stronger, Better Idea." --Grant Morrison

  6. #1176
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    There is a reason for it.These movies are pure wishfullfillment.The mcu is built around Ironman.Ironman was wishfullfillment.If you think about it,superman used to be about SUPERman,as well.The escapism is what the audiences is looking for.There might come a time when that wouldn't no more.But,that hasn't happened.
    I don't think a secret identity necessarily negates escapism though.

  7. #1177
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Frog Bros View Post
    Read Vol 1 and it was awesome! Thought the banter between Kong and Batman was especially funny, and the villain names were great (plus any Starro appearance earns extra points). After I read the JL of China volume I'll have to pick up the TPs in between vols. to complete the "homemade" omnibus.
    Glad you enjoyed it! That run was without a doubt one of the best ongoing Superman runs of all time imo. Yang really showed that he could write a great Superman after his New 52 run was a dud. Even when the Superman was very different from Clark.
    Last edited by Vordan; 03-01-2021 at 05:00 PM.
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  8. #1178
    Extraordinary Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Loved PKJ’s bit in Infinite Frontier #0 today. Felt very Morrison-esque, I’m excited for his run proper to start next week.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

  9. #1179
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I don't think a secret identity necessarily negates escapism though.
    it depends.So,far the man emphasis with superman has resulted in a boring character for me,(most of the time).As for spidey,the character is full of that catharsis you get when you see him not being able to pay rent or failing exams or bucking responsibility inorder to learn it.They can't go fully indepth with that in mcu movies like they did in sam raimi movies.Because marvel movies have groomed an audience that expects escapism.Even when they do something like civil war based on a topic like collateral damage and accoutability.It's done with that in mind.So,that mean they can't do much angst like this.

    Instead they go for badass champion kicking righteous ass in intense situation like this or elavator fight scene in winter soldier.

    (This scene is something i see superman doing,atleast original one)
    when thing are a bit grey they tone done the punches like in civil war or thor3(hulk vs thor) or avenger2(ironman vs hulk) and addin jokes/subversion so that the character remain heroic.Russo brothers knew that was problem.So they decided to do personal fight with no holding back at back end of civil war.But still,It was confined.They don't full indepth with that in later movies.Personally,prefer this approach.It's(mcu) is basically goldenage for me.It's got that western and samurai movie feel.Ofcourse,it can change with coming movies.But so far this is the kinda thing i like.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 03-02-2021 at 08:19 AM.
    "I swear to devote my life to the destruction of piracy, greed, cruelty and injustice! And my sons, and their sons, shall follow me!"

  10. #1180
    Fantastic Member ospfwildcard's Avatar
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    I havent read Superman since Doomsday "killed" him. PKJ is the only reason im buying both now.
    Marvel and DC comics are no different than the food at McDonalds. It will fill you up but in the end bad for your health. Read more independent publishers. Get away from the corporate homogenous cookie cutter fast food comics.

  11. #1181
    THE MARK OF MY DIGNITY Superlad93's Avatar
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    New interview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEJ9...l=GateCrashers

    The interviewers were very big Jon Kent fans, so they ended up having a bunch of Jon centered questions, but there's a good deal of other details here too.

    * His take on Superman isn't really a Superman that he wants to really relate to, or a Superman that has the same sort of weaknesses that we have (examples given: anger, feeling lost, or not knowing what the right thing is), but rather a Superman that shows us the way. A Superman that "shows us who we're supposed to be, and can aspire to be". But he makes it clear that doesn't mean his is a Superman that he doesn't want to see struggle or have a hard time.

    * His stance is that his powers come from Krypton, but what makes him special is his Earth parents and what he learned from them as a man.

    * He says that it's necessary that we see his powers, but they aren't the point.

    * World building is going to be a big driving force in this run. And he wants to show Superman in a larger context.

    * PKJ feel that Clark calls himself Clark in his thoughts, and that's how he'll introduce himself now that he's out in the open.

    * Lois will be used in the main stories by PKJ for as long as the book (Action) takes place on Earth, but it'll be a relatively smaller role than how she was used during the Bendis era. Instead she'll be getting a larger role in the back up stories.

    * Lois is very much part of the Super family and there's some stuff coming up where we will see the modern day House of El (as named by PKJ: Clark, Kara, Jon, and Lois), and she will be playing an active role in stuff that's happening in the story.

    _____________

    * Clark has a deep existential love for all life, and PKJ feel that's a concept that a lot of people can't really wrap their heads around. But he feels Jon gives us a way to put our finger on it because we can understand the deep love for a child or parent. He feels that Superman is all about compassion, and you can now boil that down into one person that represents his love for everything.

    * Apparently the issue this month (March) will show off a lot of that love and compassion that Jon represents.

    * On a personal note (and related to his work and Superman run) a lot of PKJ's work has become about his son and the love for his son in some way (either seen through his eyes as a parent or seen through his son's eyes), and also the legacy he wants to leave behind for his son.

    * Clark still feels guilt over what happened to Jon, and there will be times in the run where it's implied that he's still looking at his son like the 10 year old from before he left. However, Clark's not going to navel gaze about it. It'll just be part of the texture of their relationship.

    * PKJ once again brings up that Jon is potentially more powerful than Clark is, but he goes a bit more into it....

    * PKJ says that Jon already is a real player in the DCU because of his creation of the United Planets and his link to the Legion, but he says that his status as a force in the DCU is about to go up even more in part because of just how powerful he is.

    * He says that Clark, in a way, will be overshadowed by Jon's power, and he has to accept that his little boy is now going to be "a major player in the power structure of the DCU".

    * Clark's protective nature will be going into overdrive as Jon gets more and more powerful (implying that it's going to be power that builds on itself) and a more and more active role in the DCU.

    * When asked what sets Jon and Clark apparent in terms of personality PKJ doesn't beat around the bush, and I think it's an answer that'll make some fans happy: "I really liked Jon's playful nature when he was younger, and that's still kind of there when we see him a little bit older. I've kinda-- not playing it up--but I'm definitely embracing it." "Superman kinda has this stature. He's used to going places around the universe and being the voice of reason [..] Diffrent situations need an adult in the room, and Superman is the toughest dude alive and everyone knows he'd lay his life down for any of them so he has this automatic stature around the universe. He has this gentle, quite way of talking." "Jon is a little more gregarious. He's just a little more outgoing, and fun, and sloppy kind of. He's just-- he's just fun, ya know? Fun to be around. There's all these scenes of him doing fun things and being in fun situations [..] He just has such a fun personality, and I love writing his voice especially in contrast to his dad. So he has all the power, but he's still kind of the new kid, and everything's still fun and new to him. He doesn't feel the weight of it really."

    * "It's a really fun dynamic between him and his dad because he's less restrained and is still just having fun with it. He still just loves to fly.

    * "We reveal a little big later that he's kinda been experimenting with his heat vision. He's gonna have more control over certain aspects of his powers than his dad did, and it's just been really fun to explore. And it's fun for him too."

    _____________________

    * Most of the characters that PKJ has been writing so far are actually new characters. Some will be heroes, and other will not be.

    * We're gonna see Superman join forces with some characters you might not expect. "We're gonna see Superman in the context of a different kinda crew than he normally runs with"

    * If they opportunity allows for it, he'd love to bring in some of the characters from House of El, but that opportunity isn't there yet.

    * PKJ is cool with Mon-El now being a Kryptonian and part of the House of El.

    * PKJ will be fleshing out an alien race that he's always felt was underserved, and he wants to see a lot more of, and make it a legit culture. There's also going to be a new race of aliens that will be very critical to the Superman canon going forward.

    * The suit from Future State Worlds of War may be coming back for Clark.
    Last edited by Superlad93; 03-03-2021 at 03:56 PM.
    "Mark my words! This drill will open a hole in the universe. And that hole will become a path for those that follow after us. The dreams of those who have fallen. The hopes of those who will follow. Those two sets of dreams weave together into a double helix, drilling a path towards tomorrow. THAT's Tengen Toppa! THAT'S Gurren Lagann! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!"

    - The Digger

    We walk on the path to Secher Nbiw. Though hard fought, we walk the Golden Path.

  12. #1182
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Well, he certainly knows how to say all the right things. I may still have zero interest in where things are going here, but this guy comes off as a lot more likable and down to earth than Bendis, and I get the sense that he really does love Jon as a character and sees where Bendis made his MANY missteps with how the age up was handled. So I'm happy for him. For his sake, I hope things go well.

  13. #1183
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    I know I been one of the biggest haters I read infinite Frontier and I've decided to come into this giving Teen Jon a clean slate. Now if we could do away with him at any point I still say do it, but that being said Bendis destroyed a character I really liked for no purpose, if he can give this age-up some purpose it would at least make it worth it IMO.

  14. #1184
    Mighty Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    I know I been one of the biggest haters I read infinite Frontier and I've decided to come into this giving Teen Jon a clean slate. Now if we could do away with him at any point I still say do it, but that being said Bendis destroyed a character I really liked for no purpose, if he can give this age-up some purpose it would at least make it worth it IMO.
    Infinite Frontier still didn't really sell me on him. In fact, all biases aside, I thought his was one of the weakest of those stories. I still didn't see anything that was different from what we've already been seeing. Nothing to really change my mind. But enough to reaffirm that this isn't the Jon I wanna follow. Which is a shame. I really like everything else I've seen from Infinite Frontier. And I REALLY like the current directions for characters like Damian, Wally, the Amazons, and the Titans. Hell I'm even interested in (but also worried about) Justice League.

    This little era might be the happiest I've been about DC since Rebirth. But....I just can't get myself to be hyped for Superman. Even when I'm pretty much convinced it won't be the trainwreck that Bendis' run was. I dunno. This might not end up being a bad Jon...but he ain't my Jon. It's like this new younger version of Cable that we have in the X-Men comics. He's cool and all but...he's not my Cable. Hopefully Super Sons keeps going for a long time but that's really just a consolation prize. One that I doubt will be able to last since it can only exist in a set time period.

  15. #1185
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Infinite Frontier still didn't really sell me on him. In fact, all biases aside, I thought his was one of the weakest of those stories. I still didn't see anything that was different from what we've already been seeing. Nothing to really change my mind. But enough to reaffirm that this isn't the Jon I wanna follow. Which is a shame. I really like everything else I've seen from Infinite Frontier. And I REALLY like the current directions for characters like Damian, Wally, the Amazons, and the Titans. Hell I'm even interested in (but also worried about) Justice League.

    This little era might be the happiest I've been about DC since Rebirth. But....I just can't get myself to be hyped for Superman. Even when I'm pretty much convinced it won't be the trainwreck that Bendis' run was. I dunno. This might not end up being a bad Jon...but he ain't my Jon. It's like this new younger version of Cable that we have in the X-Men comics. He's cool and all but...he's not my Cable. Hopefully Super Sons keeps going for a long time but that's really just a consolation prize. One that I doubt will be able to last since it can only exist in a set time period.
    I ain't say I liked it I just said I read it. And don't get it twisted I don't care what's done to this Jon if I have to swap him for real Jon then that is the move. I trust DC will come to their senses sometime next year hopefully around when Hogwarts Legacy comes out. (That way if I'm disappointed i have something to occupy my time)

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