X-Force # 15 Spoiler/Review Thread - Trench Warfare

[Drexelhand]

For me I was glad to see that the interrogation was finished humanely and Beast was denied access. Shows that he doesn't have absolute power and can be held in check when needed. My favorite part was when he went to apologize later and got put in his place by Kayla. He was so cocky when he answered 60% never suspecting that the question being asked was rhetorical and a warning. One he didn't heed.

Personally I hope Piotr refuses Beast's offer and stays in the Savage Land with Kayla. He doesn't need to get mixed up with X-Force.

You're right, but Peter does need to handle Mikhail. Helping X-Force is not his responsibility, but stopping his brother is. Especially since he was the last one who faced his brother, leaving him in a dimension outside of the universe due to Mr. Sinister's machinations. In fact, Mr. Sinister needs to face responsibility for turning Mikhail into who he is as well.

[silvercover]

while I did like the issue, I do echo others concern that X-force really feels the most detached from the rest of the universe and makes it feel like stuff here doesn't matter that much. like right now of all the X-books, we still have no idea on the timeline for the events here in relation to X of Swords. the other books made mention and are addressing some of the fallout from there, like for hellions with nanny, orphan maker and wild child, marauders with regards to the quiet council members, X-factor with the new rockslide, new mutants with doug being busy and warlock now out in the open, and SWORD with the space station they got.

and then here's X-force, where this whole interrogation, michael and quentin situation, did it happen and get resolved already before X of Swords happened considering quentin shows up? or is it still from after the event, in which case then its weird how they haven't made reference to it like the other books that makes it feel detached from the rest of the series. like this could actually been an interesting time to bring up how the island is technically Okkara again since they got back the Arakko piece, hell you could even use that as basis for this current threat they are facing like say this part of the island is hostile or their union ended up birthing this rogue plant thing.

[Mr. White]

I liked the issue. Found it enjoyable/ not offensive.

That said the image painted from the start was X-Force is the CIA of Krakoa and for a while now, I don't feel like they have been doing "CIA things".

Right now the story seems to be told in "broad strokes" and its lost its focus e.g. the threat of Xeno.

Think as a foundation, which I guess Percy has tried to do to a degree, the X-Force book shoud focus on some of the enemies of Krakoa and how the team battles/navigates them.

[Rev9]

At this rate Krakoa is literally no better than Chernobyl, it's an ecological disaster zone, either Krakoa is doing its own thing and the mutants are clueless or they are doing this purposefully to create a feared area 51/Bermuda triangle type dread to scare off humans...first the plantinels, now this sea monster stuff.**** is getting real weird, maybe because Krakoans are so insular that no repercussions or caution is being exercised to study Krakoa itself but I'm surprised if Orchis or even Avengers in the know of some strange phenomena are not asking for explanation or prepping some serious bio weapon to neutralise the island

[Rev9]

After Ewing & Vita just gave us a masterclass in how to properly utilize the Krakoan status quo, its qualities and its contradictions, all while handling a huge cast, it's impossible not to feel Percy's X-Force lacks in worldbuilding. It all just feels too limited to its cast and even though we get to see Xavier's actually supporting Beast's shady actions in the data pages it doesn't feel like it has the weight it should have.

Also I know Percy's just developing his story of Beast's downfall but I just would like to see X-Force being an actual organization at this point. It feels like we have actually devolved in Krakoan security from where we started at issue #1

I wish there were a few panels discussing Omega Red's 'resurrection' move, in the council. This is a deeply unethical -Omega Red deserves the pit absolutely but what precedent this sets is what I feared for months ,that Xavier (despite not stating it overtly) will play a more direct role of absolute puppet master. After Omega there is no reason not to implant doctored or erase 'inconvenient' memories for or from anyone they want. All Krakoa will become 'Stepford' if the council sees fit.More importantly why did Xavier give such sweeping power to a team headed by the ever unscrupulous Beast?

[Jackraow21]

So the subplots we’ve got roiling around are Mikail and the whole Xeno plot, plus the Russians, and also the vampire nation. And on top of that this Krakoan tumor infecting people/animals and possible fallout from Terra Verde. Not sure if those last two are interconnected. But I like the more self-contained nature of this book. Not everything needs to connect with the wider landscape, especially when the mutant CIA is trying to keep these things under wraps. It’s clandestine by nature.

[LordUltimus]

How dare the Five offer a cure for a congenital disease and years of horrific trauma for a psychopath.

Monsters

"Is it ethical to psychically remove someone's traumatic memories" was a major question with the Phoenix Five to show them going off the rails.

And here it's just brushed aside.

[Kurolegacy]

This issue reminded me, whatever happened to Domino’s dog that she got back in her solo?

[Omnipitus]

You're right, but Peter does need to handle Mikhail. Helping X-Force is not his responsibility, but stopping his brother is. Especially since he was the last one who faced his brother, leaving him in a dimension outside of the universe due to Mr. Sinister's machinations. In fact, Mr. Sinister needs to face responsibility for turning Mikhail into who he is as well.

Excellent point. When Peter was painting his brother way back, I thought Percy was obviously foreshawdoing an eventual "reunion". I am not a "Dominlossus" fan, so that fact Colossus is in a new relationship is cool with me. I just fear when Mikhail shows up again, he will kill Kayla and we get more mopey/evil Peter.

[Alphaxman]

I agree that this title needs a revamp and a new writer. Someone who can properly deal with a large rotating cast, like Paul Levitz's LoSH in the 80s. There are way too many mutant characters running around that have espionage powers not to use them. I can see using Copycat (infiltration), Cipher & Silhouette (subterfuge), Locus (extraction), Trinary and Sage (intel) and many more.


And the line needs some kind of police or military structure with different departments.

As for Beast, Jean should have booted him out of his position while she was still a Councilmember. Chief scientist, yes -- head of international espionage, hell no!

[Master of Sound]

I just added Kayla's torturing of Beast to the 2020 X-Books awards voting possibilities of this forum, as that scene is fantastic!

Also regarding Kayla, already I love her...!

[Thievery]

I found issue# 15 to be very enjoyable.

I don't mind that this series is less connected to the rest of the current X-books. As others have pointed out, not every comic has to be completely tied to every other comic in the X-line of comics. And, this comic is meant to be a CIA comic. Shady things are supposed to happen in comics like this. And this comic helps provide a different brand of comic for those who are looking for it. There is an X-Men comic for everyone this way for for fans to enjoy.

I don't mind how Beast was portrayed in this issue. He was just doing his job as a CIA agent in terms of routing out an X-Man who thought was a sleeper or a plant. He just happened to be wrong. It was shady, but this comic is meant to be shady. And, for all that we know, Beast could possibly still be right. Jean has been wrong when she has done telepathic scans in the past. And, Beast did appologize for being wrong.

Hell, shady things have been happening in Krakoa and the Quite Counsel has been allowing it to happen. They allowed Shaw to get away with killing Kate in Marauders. They refused to resurrect Madalyn Pryor and Even. And they sent Sabretooth to the pit for violating a law that hadn't even been made yet. And these decisions are being supported by the council members who are supposedly the goodguys on the Council, including Jean. I don't see this comic or Beast's actions in issue#15 as being any less creepy or shady than what often happens on Krakoa.

Beast was a bastard earlier in X-Force when he ruined that country with the plant things. But, I don't see how trying to have Colossus investigated for possibly being a sleeper agent is all that horrible.

[Jackraow21]

I agree that this title needs a revamp and a new writer. Someone who can properly deal with a large rotating cast, like Paul Levitz's LoSH in the 80s. There are way too many mutant characters running around that have espionage powers not to use them. I can see using Copycat (infiltration), Cipher & Silhouette (subterfuge), Locus (extraction), Trinary and Sage (intel) and many more.

And the line needs some kind of police or military structure with different departments.

As for Beast, Jean should have booted him out of his position while she was still a Councilmember. Chief scientist, yes -- head of international espionage, hell no!

I like the cast and direction for the most part... buuut... if I were going to tweak the lineup, I’d do it like so:

- Boot Beast from the Intel branch for ethics violations or something; keep Sage, Black Tom and now Colossus (I suppose, though he’s not really an “intel” guy but can advise on the Russia stuff, for now) plus Forge as tech support; Jean has already kind of left, but don’t mind seeing her cameo some, especially considering her and Logan being romantically involved now; move Quire to Intel branch to replace Jean.

- Add Bishop and Psylocke (Kwannon) to Operations branch with Logan and Domino; if can’t use Kwannon since she’s a big part of Hellions, then use Shatterstar, as he doesn’t get enough love from the X-office in my view (plus having someone on the team with rad swords is never a bad call); and I don’t think there’s any issue with snagging Bishop from Marauders since he’s basically done nothing over there.

So my revamped (or tweaked really) X-Force team?

- Sage (Intel)
- Quentin Quire (Intel)
- Black Tom (Intel)
- Colossus (Intel)
- Wolverine (Ops)
- Domino (Ops)
- Bishop (Ops)
- Psylocke or Shatterstar (Ops)
- Forge (Supporting Cast)
- Jean Grey (Supporting Cast)

[Pav]

After Ewing & Vita just gave us a masterclass in how to properly utilize the Krakoan status quo, its qualities and its contradictions, all while handling a huge cast, it's impossible not to feel Percy's X-Force lacks in worldbuilding. It all just feels too limited to its cast and even though we get to see Xavier's actually supporting Beast's shady actions in the data pages it doesn't feel like it has the weight it should have.

Also I know Percy's just developing his story of Beast's downfall but I just would like to see X-Force being an actual organization at this point. It feels like we have actually devolved in Krakoan security from where we started at issue #1

Thank you, nandes, for these comments -- they completely echo my own thinking, and I was having some trouble figuring out how to word my opinion on the issue. But I agree with everything above. Furthermore, I've always kind of enjoyed Beast's more adversarial role in the modern X-comics, but I didn't like the outright disrespect he showed to both Jean and Logan here -- it honestly seems out of character, because say what you will about his decisions: Beast at least loves and cares for his friends and treats others with respect. He may make poor decisions, but his motivation is genuinely good, more often that not. Here, he just seems like a heartless bureaucrat, full of disdain for everyone around him. Perhaps being humbled by Colossus' ladyfriend will change his tune.

On the other hand, I loved the characterization of Forge -- and Black Tom remains a new favorite as well.

I'll probably continue reading for a bit, because I am intrigued by whatever scary monster thing is taking over other beings, but this may end up being the series closest to the chopping block right now. A shame, too, because I felt like it started on the highest note, as far as non-Hickman X-books go.

-Pav, who prefers the books with larger casts as a general rule...

[rhaenylis]

Beast was a bastard earlier in X-Force when he ruined that country with the plant things. But, I don't see how trying to have Colossus investigated for possibly being a sleeper agent is all that horrible.

Wanting to investigate is one thing, trapping Colossus to force him to perform a walk of shame in front of all Krakoa is another. Piotr is way too nice with Beast