Amazing Spider-man 55 Preview

[TheCape]

He's also a super-hero who risks his life literally everyday 'cause New York has some douchebag trying to rob a bank or nuke it every 5 seconds, and he tries to stop them all, so yeah, one could figure that having a life ensurance would be helpful, specially back during JMS' run when he was married.

Even then, this isn't about irresponsibility, it's about him being short sighted, this is just one example.



I was comparing the level of hyper competence lol.

Plus Slott's Peter hardly lacked money and had dumb gadgets too, like a fucking "Anti Sinister Six" suit, but my point is still mostly about hyper competence, and Batgod was only mentioned as a joke about Spidey's competence being that good in those moments.



Zdarsky started out so bad I dropped his comic for a while lol.

He improved a lot though, very fast too, kinda funny his Spectacular#2 was just obnoxious to read, and Spectacular#6 was pretty good.



About the best thing that can support this idea that "Peter is the Superior Spider-Man" is that in the end, when things got too tough, Otto just gave up 'cause he couldn't handle it, while Peter just never stops as long as he can.

Even then, while that's something Peter has over Otto, it just feels like such a basic message.

It's like ASM#801, while that story is not wrong about Peter being a good hero 'cause he saves people from small crimes, it's such a basic message... And considering the kind of character Spidey is, which Slott was writing him for so long, that's all he can say? It really didn't help it when Zdarsky's Spectacular#311 came out not long after, and it felt like he understood Spider-Man better... Yeah.

Edit: Awshit, deleting spree, should've seen that coming lol.

I mantain that Superior's message is "Peter is the Superior Spider-Man, but Otto is the Superior Peter Parker", i mean he probably didn't mean like that, but it's hard for me to not read his story that way, especially with consistently bad his Peter is.

Also, thanks again (comment was deleted) for the timeline thing, i was gonna leave the annual for last.

[Lukmendes]

The superhero stuff wouldn't be covered in Life Insurance especially since he has a secret identity. He could pass his injuries as accidents and so on but that would be committing insurance fraud.

Well, if he got in a situation where he tried to get a life insurance, but couldn't for a variety of reasons, or would rather not commit insurance fraud, then at least he would be trying to think ahead, even if this specific attempt failed.

Now, this isn't a flaw that I would really want to be gone, specially since it goes both ways, being both bad and good, 'cause it can be bad in his personal life as he doesn't think of a way to improve his life eventually, but it's good for him as a hero since it means he'll always try to stop current threats as soon as possible, but like I was saying in the deleted conversation, this is a flaw that could be talked about or exploited (Not just this one too, as it was just an example), but instead Slott chose to make up some new flaw that isn't even there outside of a few individuals saying he has it, except that they directly contradict Peter's own actions, so yeah, classic Informed Flaw lol.

[quote](Can you get Life Insurance if you are a superhero? That feels like a Fantastic Four kind of story...I mean who can insure a family that do not have regular mortal biology, and basically have free healthcare since they are the only beings who can heal and treat anything that can potentially injure them?).

If The Other is any hint, there might be for those who have secret identities, since Tony was talking about this entire process of super-heroes who get killed while fighting, and the injuries may be altered to make it look like they died of something else to preserve the secret identities, I wouldn't be surprised if something like that were used for super-heroes who have a life ensurance, and the cause of death to be lied about so the families can be fine afterwards.

As for heroes with public identities, I think this is a situation that the more you think about, the less sense that world makes, specially since heroes may resurrect, so no insurance company would ever want to get near 'em, unless there's a company that specifically catters to super-heroes, and if there is, they're probably bankrupt lol.

The "Peter just never stops" thing is undercut by the fact that nothing Peter did helped him get his body back. He was basically some backup "break glass when it's time to end story" switch. So yeah...that dog doesn't walk even if it is a basic message as you said. Even that basic message is disingenuous.

Huh, never even considered the angle of Peter failing before, and that "He never gives up" was the only positive thing I could see about Superior's message in the end, even if it was still whatever, now there's nothing lol.

The message is that Spider-Man doesn't save the world because he's not Thor or Black Panther but he helps the regular people and saves lives. That entire point has a kind of condescension because it implicitly assumes that "saving the world" stuff matters or counts for more...it's the "below my pay grade" thing from MCU Homecoming writ large. It's the equivalent of saying doctors and nurses or first responders aren't as heroic as astronauts or soldiers. To internalize that as a vallid sentiment is to surrender ground to a toxic concept to start with.

It's not like that since the entire point of that story is that Peter saved one guy, essentially preventing his family from suffering, and giving that guy the chance to see his family grow, all because Spidey stopped some "small" crime, that story makes it rather obvious that Spider-Man doing such a thing matters, never does it look like that he's less important for not being part of the universe saving adventures other heroes have.

It's also hypocritical on Slott's part since so much of his run had Peter involved in bizarre high concept stories...like Parker Industries, Go Down Swinging, Spider-Verse, Clone Conspiracy, and even before that Spider-Island. Slott himself never wrote or cared much about Peter in a working-class reality (and going by most of his output, I don't think he has an interest in that in general...which fair enough write what you like)...it's like now at the end you are affirming a version of Spider-Man you didn't write. It's a bit like assuming you wrote Paul Jenkins' Spider-Man when you didn't.

While the real meat of Slott's run is those bigger stories, it's worth pointing out that part of the point of that story is that it was just some random robbery Peter stopped, he just went there, stopped it, made a few snarky comments and left, it wasn't even a big fight against a super-villain, just a robbery in some store, which he forgot about when he met the guy again (And likely forgot not even a week later too), but the fact is he went there and stopped it, and just that made a world of difference for that guy.

But yeah, fact he doesn't do it much doesn't help, Spidey stops random crimes like that robbery like, once every 50 issues in Slott's run lol.

So much of Slott's take is rooted in genre and not in real life. Take "No one dies" the big emotional punchline of that is "bad characters in comics come back from the dead more often than good characters" and like really...that's your take on grief. You are getting meta on grief?!

What the ****?

Like I read Slott's run at random points, so I didn't read ASM#655 until I read what you said... That's so weird to make a meta commentary in that nightmare, more than once too lol.

The art in that comic and Slott's run in general is often a lot better than the writing deserves. It's probably the outstanding example of a Spider-Man run where the art was so far better than the writing.

It's always funny to see good art when the writing isn't anywhere near on that level.

Peak example of this though, is All Star Batman and Robin, if the dialogue is deleted from that, the comic would be so much better, 'cause the art is just gorgeous, and the writing is the exact opposite.

I mantain that Superior's message is "Peter is the Superior Spider-Man, but Otto is the Superior Peter Parker", i mean he probably didn't mean like that, but it's hard for me to not read his story that way, especially with consistently bad his Peter is.

Yeah I think his Otto had moments where he was a douche and neglected people because he would rather be Spider-Man at times, even when not necessary, but he did seem more competent at handling the social life in spite of that, his relationship with Anna Maria is the best example I think, since they knew each other for only like a month, but there weren't many problems with it, if any, and were obviously in love, or at least passionate.

Also, thanks again (comment was deleted) for the timeline thing, i was gonna leave the annual for last.

No problem.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

If The Other is any hint, there might be for those who have secret identities, since Tony was talking about this entire process of super-heroes who get killed while fighting, and the injuries may be altered to make it look like they died of something else to preserve the secret identities, I wouldn't be surprised if something like that were used for super-heroes who have a life ensurance, and the cause of death to be lied about so the families can be fine afterwards.

Short of Stark giving heroes life-insurance on these grounds or SHIELD doing it, that would qualify as insurance fraud. Stark is falsifying records to hide the liabilities many heroes have and then making them free to exploit private insurance companies. Now insurance business is broken and all...but that's very much an actual crime and con that Tony would be enabling and were it exposed would make the Marvel heroes a center of a political scandal on the level of the College Admissions Scandal, and would tarnish the Marvel superheroes as a bunch of hustlers not very different from the low-rent hoods they routinely catch.

It's not like that since the entire point of that story is that Peter saved one guy, essentially preventing his family from suffering, and giving that guy the chance to see his family grow, all because Spidey stopped some "small" crime, that story makes it rather obvious that Spider-Man doing such a thing matters, never does it look like that he's less important for not being part of the universe saving adventures other heroes have.

I get that but it's framed around the perspective of the girl, the assumed stand-in for the young Marvel fan who is dazzled by the MCU and the big-screen heroes and so on. It validates what I think is a fundamentally toxic perspective, and one that in my experience most young people don't have (they tend to be bored or snarky about constant "world-ender types").

Like I read Slott's run at random points, so I didn't read ASM#655 until I read what you said... That's so weird to make a meta commentary in that nightmare, more than once too lol.

"No One Dies" is often considered one of Slott's best stories in his run. And I think it's a good story on the whole, not great mind you. And "No one dies" is this theme that Slott refers to multiple times in many of his stories. And it's not clear what he's trying to convey with that. It feels like he's trying to have Peter get his "I am vengeance I am the night" speech, so Slott attached a lot of importance to that, it's just that it's so generic and nonsensical and vague.

It's always funny to see good art when the writing isn't anywhere near on that level.

It's more tragic. Marcos Martin in general has a great style (though maybe too arty for a monthly ongoing, but then again, Esad Ribic threads that needle) but I never felt he had the right collaborator. The only good stuff he did on Spider-Man in terms of writing and art is the Stan Lee backup stories for BND i.e. "Spidey Super Sundays". That was great, and among the best Spider-Man stuff Lee ever did (especially "Identity Crisis" not to be confused with Mackie's). The art and layout and the nightmare in No One Dies is genuinely amazing and beautiful and haunting, and on that level the issue is special. But again the writing turns what should have been a masterpiece into something that's just a little above "good".

Peak example of this though, is All Star Batman and Robin, if the dialogue is deleted from that, the comic would be so much better, 'cause the art is just gorgeous, and the writing is the exact opposite.

I don't think anything Slott did is as bad as ASBAR, although nothing he (or many other writers) did is as good as Miller at his best.

I think Batman HUSH...I mean it's a landmark Batman story for the 2000s decade in terms of bringing in a lot of new readers (the way Long Halloween did in the '90s). But the writing of that story is okay and generic, Tommy Elliot/Hush as a character is basically a Black Mask clone and he had to wait for Paul Dini's Heart of Hush to enjoy his only great story. And of course Batman Hush made Bruce/Selina a canon ongoing ship for the first time (at a time when it was new and wasn't worn out by Tom King...*disappointed sigh*).

But the art by Jim Lee really makes it special. In fact that's basically Jeph Loeb in a nutshell, when you think of his most famous and celebrated stories -- Spider-Man Blue, The Long Halloween, Hush -- in terms of script and plot, they are good but not especially great and not without problems but the right collaborator, -- Tim Sale, Jim Lee -- and his work is elevated. Spider-Man Blue for instance would not have been a great comic without Sale's particular chiffon-light texture that gives it that seductive nostalgic glow, without that you have a kind of mashing together of Lee-Romita's run, but Sale gives it art that sits next to the original by Romita Sr. (no mean feat, that).

[Lukmendes]

Short of Stark giving heroes life-insurance on these grounds or SHIELD doing it, that would qualify as insurance fraud. Stark is falsifying records to hide the liabilities many heroes have and then making them free to exploit private insurance companies. Now insurance business is broken and all...but that's very much an actual crime and con that Tony would be enabling and were it exposed would make the Marvel heroes a center of a political scandal on the level of the College Admissions Scandal, and would tarnish the Marvel superheroes as a bunch of hustlers not very different from the low-rent hoods they routinely catch.

Well, super-heroes went through Civil War a few weeks later, by that point there was little reason for the public to respect them .

I get that but it's framed around the perspective of the girl, the assumed stand-in for the young Marvel fan who is dazzled by the MCU and the big-screen heroes and so on. It validates what I think is a fundamentally toxic perspective, and one that in my experience most young people don't have (they tend to be bored or snarky about constant "world-ender types").

The girl's perspective is shown for all of one page, and then that guy gets a double splash page saying that Spidey is special for "saving someone's world everyday", and then she sees his points and admits he was right, so the story made it really obvious in its point that Spidey does a good job.

"No One Dies" is often considered one of Slott's best stories in his run. And I think it's a good story on the whole, not great mind you. And "No one dies" is this theme that Slott refers to multiple times in many of his stories. And it's not clear what he's trying to convey with that. It feels like he's trying to have Peter get his "I am vengeance I am the night" speech, so Slott attached a lot of importance to that, it's just that it's so generic and nonsensical and vague.

No one dies would work better with an younger, more naíve Spidey, 'cause this attitude he got during it was, weird.

Like if he had attitude that was basically "I'm going to try to make sure no one dies" or "I can make sure no one dies", it'd be more acceptable with the Spidey here, since working harder to be a better hero is admirable, it's just weird that he went for "I will make sure no one dies", and it's not even me being nitpicky about word choices, because Spidey also said this during its epilogue:

https://i.imgur.com/FFuF9ee.png

(ASM#656)

So yeah, he was being naíve about thinking he could make it work, and also super arrogant to think he'd manage, and that could work better with an younger, less experienced Spidey, but the guy has been at this for 10 years or so, and characters point out to him that he's being naíve once in a while too, so the direction that was going was obvious lol.

It's more tragic. Marcos Martin in general has a great style (though maybe too arty for a monthly ongoing, but then again, Esad Ribic threads that needle) but I never felt he had the right collaborator. The only good stuff he did on Spider-Man in terms of writing and art is the Stan Lee backup stories for BND i.e. "Spidey Super Sundays". That was great, and among the best Spider-Man stuff Lee ever did (especially "Identity Crisis" not to be confused with Mackie's). The art and layout and the nightmare in No One Dies is genuinely amazing and beautiful and haunting, and on that level the issue is special. But again the writing turns what should have been a masterpiece into something that's just a little above "good".

I think his art style is okay, not really a fan of how he draws characters, but it doesn't look bad.

And of those Super Sundays stories, think the only one I remember was the one Peter randomly decided to make a time machine, which has this gem:



Though yeah, the nightmare sequence in No one dies was really awesome looking.

I don't think anything Slott did is as bad as ASBAR, although nothing he (or many other writers) did is as good as Miller at his best.

Oh I wasn't saying Slott was near that level, just that it's the biggest case of "Great art, horrible story" case I can think of.

And Miller, the problem is that he found this style, and got lazy with it, so he repeats the same clichés, story beats and characters, that his old stories had (Even the likes of Born Again), without any of the things that made his style work before, so he can be really bland.

I think maybe he's improving again, or at least, he was better in that first issue of Superman: Year One, not that the first issue is any good, I guess it's only decent, but at least it wasn't another of his bland stories, or ASBAR.

I think Batman HUSH...I mean it's a landmark Batman story for the 2000s decade in terms of bringing in a lot of new readers (the way Long Halloween did in the '90s). But the writing of that story is okay and generic, Tommy Elliot/Hush as a character is basically a Black Mask clone and he had to wait for Paul Dini's Heart of Hush to enjoy his only great story. And of course Batman Hush made Bruce/Selina a canon ongoing ship for the first time (at a time when it was new and wasn't worn out by Tom King...*disappointed sigh*).

It's funny and tragic when a story does something new and interesting, but then other stories overdo those things so much that the original doesn't look that special anymore.

One example of this I like is Legion's Great Darkness saga, a story with the twist of using Darkseid as the main enemy, which was new and original back then since nobody knew who Darkseid was, now the guy shows up a lot, and that story looks less interesting because of that...

Although, I only read it recently, like last year, and I find Darkseid's overexposure to be annoying, I still liked it, 'cause despite the novel factor of Darkseid being used not existing anymore, it was still a well told story that definitely makes him look that strong, but not in an overbearing way, and the heroes were interesting.

But the art by Jim Lee really makes it special. In fact that's basically Jeph Loeb in a nutshell, when you think of his most famous and celebrated stories -- Spider-Man Blue, The Long Halloween, Hush -- in terms of script and plot, they are good but not especially great and not without problems but the right collaborator, -- Tim Sale, Jim Lee -- and his work is elevated. Spider-Man Blue for instance would not have been a great comic without Sale's particular chiffon-light texture that gives it that seductive nostalgic glow, without that you have a kind of mashing together of Lee-Romita's run, but Sale gives it art that sits next to the original by Romita Sr. (no mean feat, that).

I have yet to read Hush, it seems to be a story even some non-comic fans are aware of, or at least, a friend of mine is.

I do remember seeing pages from it though, the art is just beautiful.