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  1. #286

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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    It is not rocket science either while only films like X-MEN 1 or Batman Begins or Man of Steel or even TDK, LOGAN, Joker are called Oscar worthy comic films while films like batman and robin and endgame are never taken seriously. Even the recent Snyder Cut would stand a far better chance at Endgame to get nominated for oscars because of the lord of the rings fantasy sort of vibe and it been an auteur director film after the cooperate mess of the Whedon film.
    Oscar nominations for MCU films: 19

    Oscar nominations for Zack Snyder films: 0

    I'd say your claim has no basis in reality.
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

  2. #287
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Oh, the horrors, that the X-Men might actually look like their comic book counterparts.
    The "yellow spandex" joke has really aged poorly, considering how bland and ugly those leather suits became in comparison to what we can get for CBM costumes these days.

    If the MCU can make the X-Men look like the X-Men, they will automatically surpass Fox.

  3. #288
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    XCU costumes were so boring. It's nice to see each X-Man have their own unique style, like in the comics.

  4. #289
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    The "yellow spandex" joke has really aged poorly, considering how bland and ugly those leather suits became in comparison to what we can get for CBM costumes these days.

    If the MCU can make the X-Men look like the X-Men, they will automatically surpass Fox.
    The yellow spandex joke was to much of an inside joke to age badly or poorly because it literally broke the 4th wall and those kinds of jokes are always out of time. Let me just say, as in terms of screen writing. that is why it is a 4th wall.


    If the MCU can make the X-Men look like the X-Men, they will automatically surpass Fox.
    Except X-MEN are not defined by costumes or looked like as costumes. their compelling adult stories and themes make the series, even in the comics their costumes go through different stages, it is not really a must to some writers and color artisst, Grant Morrsion maybe the best X-Men writer in this millennium and he striped down the colourful costumes.

    What defined singer xmen was not the leather suit, though a running joke. I never cared about it. it could be there or could not be there, what defined his first movies was the story style he brought. for MCU to artistically match that, they would have to

    1. Open an opening scene that has more gravitas than the Holocaust in world war 2

    2. Find a way to tell a comic story were action scenes are not the most important, but more realistic story themes with a more mature tone to their current movies like Endgame and Captain Marvel.

    3. End the movie with intellectual dialogues taken from Malcom X that shows a complex rivalry beyond punch bags- Xavier and Magneto ''friendship''

    This is what defines xmen and singer manged to cover that. MCU would have to come with something similar, so thinking outside their formula, but Disney is likely not going to allow that.

    if MCU can even makes a Man Of Steel kind of xmen, because that is the only recent first comic film that reminds me of what a good xmen film would be maybe with less action. Their MCU would be fine, Costumes don't matter, costumes now in 2021 are just seen as nothing more but theme parks assets with superhero films.

    I will still watch Feige X-MEN regardless to be informed , but Snyder's X-Men would have been more exciting to watch even in costumes because he would have made it maybe mythological like he did with Justice League, than what we currently see now in Eternals which looks kind of.... not realistic at all and just says its about TOYS.



    This looks fitting for Eternals and the primary Disney style, but for X-MEN in a live action film. it just won't look right since we are supposed to take X-MEN a lot more seriously in a more realer world.


    Give me X23 is normal cloths and I am fine

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    Last edited by Castle; 06-23-2021 at 12:58 AM.

  5. #290
    Ultimate Member Holt's Avatar
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    The notion that Zack Snyder's Justice League is Oscar worthy but Marvel isn't is really, REALLY funny and full of ****. If anything, it'll maybe get a nomination in Best Visual Effects...the exact same category multiple Marvel films have been nominated for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Holt View Post
    The notion that Zack Snyder's Justice League is Oscar worthy but Marvel isn't is really, REALLY funny and full of ****. If anything, it'll maybe get a nomination in Best Visual Effects...the exact same category multiple Marvel films have been nominated for.
    Apart for the MCU vs DC debate which is what your post feels like.. if it is just a film honest debate. Snyder's movies will be more Oscar worthy.

    1. it is much darker

    2. it is more director done

    3. it has serious themes and takes itself way too seriously.

    4. it is depressing

    5. It has more violence

    The Oscars will choose any comic film that has this more than the light hearted action comedies of comics films that lean more kid friendly. I have been watching the Oscars sort of faithfully for almost 20 years to know what films they like.

    Also this is why I will forever feel for Snyder, all he wanted was to make his comic films away from the MCU style and he got slammed for it to the point WB had to bring Joss whedon to turn his own film to an MCU film with the JL 2016 film.

    I am just happy Snyder at least was vindicated with the JL Cut, he deserves it as an auteur film maker.
    Last edited by Castle; 06-22-2021 at 12:30 PM.

  7. #292
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    The Oscars award films that are serious and generally execute their themes well. Films that aim to be serious but come across as unintentionally hilarious like the Snyder films mostly are are not going to be considered.

    Maybe they will be considered for the special effects category. But the Snyder films still devolve into laser shows with explosions and Punchyman brawls. Even though the Snyder Cut ended up being mostly entertaining for that reason and not aiming to be anything higher, it's still not something the Academy generally looks at.

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Except X-MEN are not defined by costumes or looked like as costumes. their compelling adult stories and themes make the series, even in the comics their costumes go through different stages, it is not really a must to some writers and color artisst, Grant Morrsion maybe the best X-Men writer in this millennium and he striped down the colourful costumes.[/B]
    They have various costumes over the years, but at the end of the day they are still superheroes with costumes. They have compelling adult stories (when they are written well at least- they are just as capable of being in relentlessly stupid stories as any other heroes), but what makes the X-Men work is the larger than life aspects (including the costumes) mixed with the serious themes and characterizations. Remove one element, and the whole package doesn't work quite as well. And there is no reason live action X-Men movies can't come closer to what makes them work in the comics at this point. The earlier films being ashamed of many aspects of the source material isn't necessary anymore.

    And yes, Morrison has one of the best runs, but their run sans costumes is kind of an outlier. Even then, their run has a lot of larger than life aspects that the films avoided, including references to the Silver Age stories, a LOT of weird looking mutants, the Shi'ar Empire in full force and eventually even Jean having her Cockrum Phoenix costume.

  8. #293

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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Apart for the MCU vs DC debate which is what your post feels like.. if it is just a film honest debate. Snyder's movies will be more Oscar worthy.

    1. it is much darker

    2. it is more director done

    3. it has serious themes and takes itself way too seriously.

    4. it is depressing

    5. It has more violence

    The Oscars will choose any comic film that has this more than the light hearted action comedies of comics films that lean more kid friendly. I have been watching the Oscars sort of faithfully for almost 20 years to know what films they like.

    Also this is why I will forever feel for Snyder, all he wanted was to make his comic films away from the MCU style and he got slammed for it to the point WB had to bring Joss whedon to turn his own film to an MCU film with the JL 2016 film.

    I am just happy Snyder at least was vindicated with the JL Cut, he deserves it as an auteur film maker.
    I'll repeat it, your subjective opinion is contradicted by these objective facts:

    Oscar nominations for MCU films: 19

    Oscar nominations for Zack Snyder films: 0
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

  9. #294
    Ultimate Member Holt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Apart for the MCU vs DC debate which is what your post feels like.. if it is just a film honest debate. Snyder's movies will be more Oscar worthy.
    History has not born that out thus far, given he's directed many films and has had precisely zero Oscars from any of them. As others here have already mentioned, reality does not back up this assertion.

  10. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    The Oscars award films that are serious and generally execute their themes well. Films that aim to be serious but come across as unintentionally hilarious like the Snyder films mostly are are not going to be considered.

    Maybe they will be considered for the special effects category. But the Snyder films still devolve into laser shows with explosions and Punchyman brawls. Even though the Snyder Cut ended up being mostly entertaining for that reason and not aiming to be anything higher, it's still not something the Academy generally looks at.



    They have various costumes over the years, but at the end of the day they are still superheroes with costumes. They have compelling adult stories (when they are written well at least- they are just as capable of being in relentlessly stupid stories as any other heroes), but what makes the X-Men work is the larger than life aspects (including the costumes) mixed with the serious themes and characterizations. Remove one element, and the whole package doesn't work quite as well. And there is no reason live action X-Men movies can't come closer to what makes them work in the comics at this point. The earlier films being ashamed of many aspects of the source material isn't necessary anymore.

    And yes, Morrison has one of the best runs, but their run sans costumes is kind of an outlier. Even then, their run has a lot of larger than life aspects that the films avoided, including references to the Silver Age stories, a LOT of weird looking mutants, the Shi'ar Empire in full force and eventually even Jean having her Cockrum Phoenix costume.
    We were comparing Snyder to MCU. from the Oscars attitude, Snyder's films would still get nominated over MCU if Oscars had to bitterly choose.

    No. Superhero don't need costumes, the concept has developed more on the genre to not matter. How come Logan, Legion or even the new mutant kids not wear costumes?
    They have compelling adult stories (when they are written well at least- they are just as capable of being in relentlessly stupid stories as any other heroes), but what makes the X-Men work is the larger than life aspects (including the costumes) mixed with the serious themes and characterizations. Remove one element, and the whole package doesn't work quite as well. And there is no reason live action X-Men movies can't come closer to what makes them work in the comics at this point. The earlier films being ashamed of many aspects of the source material isn't necessary anymore.
    X-MEN does have stupid stories, but is it is why they are called their stupid stories and not their best stories. The Package can work with or without costumes. it is not a must necessity.


    And yes, Morrison has one of the best runs, but their run sans costumes is kind of an outlier. Even then, their run has a lot of larger than life aspects that the films avoided, including references to the Silver Age stories, a LOT of weird looking mutants, the Shi'ar Empire in full force and eventually even Jean having her Cockrum Phoenix costume.
    Yes Morrison had one of the best run and he did without without colourful costumes. I don't need to have colourful costumes to enjoy Riot at Xaviers.

    If you really think Morrsion had one of the best runs, I think you would be more concerned that MCU likely won't even authentically touch any of his best runs. Morrsion was a very mature and challenging to structure comic book writer, in fact i think this is the reason Marvel chose him for New X-MEN because of his work in Batman. He did really make Batman grow up as a character with creating Damian Wayne, who changed how people saw superhero character kids. That should be technically more worrying than costumes now in comic films, that there may not even be an authentic Morrison story in movies.

    Anyone can hate Singer for the leather suits but Singer at-least manged to do 2 Claremont stories with great critical and commercial success beyond the kid friendly action-comedy bubble where costumes is a necessity. Only people like Nolan and Snyder have done that and succeeded to.

    Why Am I talking about costumes again? I don't like this topic and I wont please be replying anymore to anyone about costumes.
    Last edited by Castle; 06-22-2021 at 01:19 PM.

  11. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holt View Post
    The notion that Zack Snyder's Justice League is Oscar worthy but Marvel isn't is really, REALLY funny and full of ****. If anything, it'll maybe get a nomination in Best Visual Effects...the exact same category multiple Marvel films have been nominated for.
    Even then, you have had several films that were better this year in that category (Godzilla vs. Kong, Voyagers) and you have several others that have buzz around that (Eternals, Spidey, Ghostbusters, Swan Song, Shang Chi, Dune) already.

    I don't see it getting anything. He might get a nod for the Tig stuff in Army of the Dead, however. I still don't see it.
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  12. #297
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    We were comparing Snyder to MCU. from the Oscars attitude, Snyder's films would still get nominated over MCU if Oscars had to bitterly choose.
    They would never be forced to bitterly choose, and again: 19 film nominations for the MCU, none for Snyder.
    So you can't be serious, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    No. Superhero don't need costumes, the concept has developed more on the genre to not matter. How come Logan, Legion or even the new mutant kids not wear costumes?
    Didn't New Mutants bomb? Who even cares about that one?
    They don't need costumes, but there is no need to shy away from it as much anymore.


    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Yes Morrison had one of the best run and he did without without colourful costumes. I don't need to have colourful costumes to enjoy Riot at Xaviers.

    If you really think Morrsion had one of the best runs, I think you would be more concerned that MCU likely won't even authentically touch any of his best runs. Morrsion was a very mature and challenging to structure comic book writer, in fact i think this is the reason Marvel chose him for New X-MEN because of his work in Batman. He did really make Batman grow up as a character with creating Damian Wayne, who changed how people saw superhero kid character kids in comic films and That should be technically more worrying than costumes now in comic films, that there may not even be an authentic Morrison story in movies.
    Morrison did New X-Men before they did a long Batman run and invented Damian Wayne

    I don't think Disney will authentically be able to re-capture what made the best of Morrison and Claremont work, but honestly I don't feel like Fox did either for the most part. I think Morrison's run leans more towards what the MCU is capable of and willing to do than what Singer did. Morrison loves to use Silver Age concepts and a lot of their new creations are reminiscent of that era, and those are things the studios typically do not touch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Anyone can hate Singer for the leather suits but Singer atleast manged to do 2 Claremont stories with great critical and commercial success beyond the kid friendly action-comedy bubble where costumes is a necessity. Only people like Nolan and Snyder have done that and succeeded to.
    The lukewarm reception of his films outside of his diehard followers and WB moving as far away from it as they can begs to differ.

    Reeves for The Batman has a higher chance of managing it than Snyder.

  13. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    They would never be forced to bitterly choose, and again: 19 film nominations for the MCU, none for Snyder.
    So you can't be serious, right?



    Didn't New Mutants bomb? Who even cares about that one?
    They don't need costumes, but there is no need to shy away from it as much anymore.




    Morrison did New X-Men before they did a long Batman run and invented Damian Wayne

    I don't think Disney will authentically be able to re-capture what made the best of Morrison and Claremont work, but honestly I don't feel like Fox did either for the most part. I think Morrison's run leans more towards what the MCU is capable of and willing to do than what Singer did. Morrison loves to use Silver Age concepts and a lot of their new creations are reminiscent of that era, and those are things the studios typically do not touch.



    The lukewarm reception of his films outside of his diehard followers and WB moving as far away from it as they can begs to differ.

    Reeves for The Batman has a higher chance of managing it than Snyder.
    No they would not be forced too because Oscars dont care about comic films, however the oscars wont change what they like to see in movies. their diversity push wont change that and that means more films about slavery, the holocaust, LGBT themes, War movies, would now even get more chance at the Oscars. this themes would not be a big problem for Snyder, they will for Feige though.

    Morrison did New X-Men before they did a long Batman run and invented Damian Wayne

    I don't think Disney will authentically be able to re-capture what made the best of Morrison and Claremont work, but honestly I don't feel like Fox did either for the most part. I think Morrison's run leans more towards what the MCU is capable of and willing to do than what Singer did. Morrison loves to use Silver Age concepts and a lot of their new creations are reminiscent of that era, and those are things the studios typically do not touch.
    I think Morrison run of Batman came before New XMEN, any...does not matter. Morrsion is in a higher class of comic writer who had a no nonsense kid friendly policy approach to comics books.


    And you are right, that Disney wont capture it but this reason is because, disney can only really make one type of film. Singer did better trying to recapture DOFP and God Loves, Man Kills with X2 and DOFP films because he had more to work with, more than Disney would have given him in the first place.
    The lukewarm reception of his films outside of his diehard followers and WB moving as far away from it as they can begs to differ.

    Reeves for The Batman has a higher chance of managing it than Snyder.
    They did not really have lukewarm reception because the superhero film critical genre is now worth-lessssss than it used to, man of steel is as lukewarm to anyone that feels Thor Ragnarok had great reviews that should be compared to 20 years ago comic films like X1 or Batman Begins.

    Comic book reception is meaningless now. there no longer exist a strong fine line of lukewarm reception and good reception.

  14. #299

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    Quote Originally Posted by BeastieRunner View Post
    Even then, you have had several films that were better this year in that category (Godzilla vs. Kong, Voyagers) and you have several others that have buzz around that (Eternals, Spidey, Ghostbusters, Swan Song, Shang Chi, Dune) already.

    I don't see it getting anything. He might get a nod for the Tig stuff in Army of the Dead, however. I still don't see it.
    The only awards Snyder movies will be in contention for next year are the Razzies and Army of the Dead should have a serious shot at getting some of them.
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

  15. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castle View Post
    Apart for the MCU vs DC debate which is what your post feels like.. if it is just a film honest debate. Snyder's movies will be more Oscar worthy.

    1. it is much darker

    2. it is more director done

    3. it has serious themes and takes itself way too seriously.

    4. it is depressing

    5. It has more violence

    The Oscars will choose any comic film that has this more than the light hearted action comedies of comics films that lean more kid friendly. I have been watching the Oscars sort of faithfully for almost 20 years to know what films they like.
    THE ROOM directed by Tommy Wiseau is Oscar worthy according to your criteria.

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