gwen stacy death diminished by spider Gwen and gwenpool?

[Darthfury78]

They aren’t the original Gwen Stacy nor are they pretending to be. So no, their existence doesn’t diminish Gwen’s death.

But their presence in Marvel-616 does to a degree. both characters belong in their own universe, along with most of the x-characters who came to marvel-616 from other timelines, like Rachel Summers, Cable, and Bishop....

[Spiderfang]

Well Gwen's death was diminished as early as the (original) Clone Saga, when Miles Warren created a clone of her to mess with Peter and by 2016-2017 (Clone Conspiracy) creative already had a free-pass (because a precedent had been made ages before) to do with whatever to pretty much any spider-related character, like nothing is even sacred anymore.

[federicodettofred]

It has no place here and you should take these words back. Anyone who knows Spider-Man from a toy/sticker/beanie their parents got for them when they were kids is a Spider-Man fan, period. End of discussion. For a ton of people, the PS4 game is their introduction to Spider-Man, no Gwen Stacy there, not even a reference. Are those people not Spider-Man fans?

So watching ONE James Bond movie makes you a James Bond fan. Sure.

[NC_Yankee]

Well Gwen's death was diminished as early as the (original) Clone Saga, when Miles Warren created a clone of her to mess with Peter and by 2016-2017 (Clone Conspiracy) creative already had a free-pass (because a precedent had been made ages before) to do with whatever to pretty much any spider-related character, like nothing is even sacred anymore.

I do not agree with this. If you go back to the Clone Saga, one of the intents was to possibly bring Gwen back. How come it did not happen? The readers did not exactly bang the doors down wanting her back. Just like most fans, Marvel knows who was and still is the best Parker Woman ( even though they hate to admit it). The answer is MJ. Think about it. They made Ghost Spider younger then Peter so they will not hook her up with him like Felicia. Even Dan Slott who did not like her created Renew Your Vows.

[Ursalink]

I do not agree with this. If you go back to the Clone Saga, one of the intents was to possibly bring Gwen back. How come it did not happen? The readers did not exactly bang the doors down wanting her back. Just like most fans, Marvel knows who was and still is the best Parker Woman ( even though they hate to admit it). The answer is MJ. Think about it. They made Ghost Spider younger then Peter so they will not hook her up with him like Felicia. Even Dan Slott who did not like her created Renew Your Vows.

She's younger than 616's Gwen Stacy; but then again, how was it possible for Spider-Gwen to disguise herself as regular Gwen during the Clone Conspiracy? I mean, wouldn't have been easy for anyone to realize 616's Gwen looked younger than she really was?

Anyway, Gwen Stacy's death at the comics was iconic back then; but years passed and the ways of thinking change too. Right now we see Spider-Gwen as a good alternative over the death of the character, and that has been applied in the most recent animated shows of Spider-Man: "Ultimate Spider-Man" and "Marvel's Spider-Man".

There's a possibility I have been considering for a time. You see, we never saw Gwen Stacy's dissolving to dust after "Clone Conspiracy", so I leave the door open over the possibility than 616's Gwen Stacy is still alive. (The body Kindred unburied doesn't have sense, how did it keep Gwen's hairstyle so perfectly?). So, in a POSSIBLE way to stabilize 616's Gwen if she's still alive, how about if she gets a blood transfusion from her alternative spider-self? They are technically the same individual, so maybe a The Other's process that makes her emerge from a caccoon as a completely healthy "Spider-Woman"? Weirder stuff has already happened.

[Ikari]

She's younger than 616's Gwen Stacy; but then again, how was it possible for Spider-Gwen to disguise herself as regular Gwen during the Clone Conspiracy? I mean, wouldn't have been easy for anyone to realize 616's Gwen looked younger than she really was?

Presumably Clone Conspiracy Gwen was resurrected from the point she was killed, which was long ago and she would have been close to 65-Gwen's age. Any way, her dad did quickly see through it.
Yes her death was just barely ambigious enough that it's possible she made it somehow. Though hopefully she did not.

[NC_Yankee]

She's younger than 616's Gwen Stacy; but then again, how was it possible for Spider-Gwen to disguise herself as regular Gwen during the Clone Conspiracy? I mean, wouldn't have been easy for anyone to realize 616's Gwen looked younger than she really was?

Anyway, Gwen Stacy's death at the comics was iconic back then; but years passed and the ways of thinking change too. Right now we see Spider-Gwen as a good alternative over the death of the character, and that has been applied in the most recent animated shows of Spider-Man: "Ultimate Spider-Man" and "Marvel's Spider-Man".

There's a possibility I have been considering for a time. You see, we never saw Gwen Stacy's dissolving to dust after "Clone Conspiracy", so I leave the door open over the possibility than 616's Gwen Stacy is still alive. (The body Kindred unburied doesn't have sense, how did it keep Gwen's hairstyle so perfectly?). So, in a POSSIBLE way to stabilize 616's Gwen if she's still alive, how about if she gets a blood transfusion from her alternative spider-self? They are technically the same individual, so maybe a The Other's process that makes her emerge from a caccoon as a completely healthy "Spider-Woman"? Weirder stuff has already happened.

Original Gwen is not coming back. Ghost Spider for better or for worse has taken her place. I would be interested to see the reaction from MJ if she took off her mask

[Ozymandias]

The only thing that is diminished is the value of Gwen Stacy as a love interest.

I don't think people really want to see Gwen in that role ever again.

But then again, they never did.

You know perfectly well there are people who do, so I can only imagine that your statement was of a provocative nature.

As much as Marvel may try, there's still some of us who were around in the 70's to read those comics and still remember what her role was. They may clone her, substitute her, smear her, diminish her relationship and plague the MU with alternate versions, but some of us can still tell her apart.

Gwen's death was a referendum on her status as love interest.

How come?

That's gatekeeping pure and simple.

It has no place here and you should take these words back. Anyone who knows Spider-Man from a toy/sticker/beanie their parents got for them when they were kids is a Spider-Man fan, period. End of discussion. For a ton of people, the PS4 game is their introduction to Spider-Man, no Gwen Stacy there, not even a reference. Are those people not Spider-Man fans?

Spider-Man is a character with its history, and that history has only been completely told in the 616 comics. Everything else are versions aimed at different markets were either the character has been edited or its history simply stripped bare. Pure and simple.