T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2021

[Ekie]

They could've had Klaw kill T'Chaka and T'Challa go after Bucky for other reasons, like maybe Hydra made him attack Wakanda.

I think at the time Hollywood still underestimated the potential success of a Black-focused superhero movie

Many of the ppl working at marvel like the Russos and Feigie admitted to that too. Had they known then maybe Panther would have done more in infinity war and not been killed off.
But who knows with how strange and shady Feigies comments have been lately.

[Dboi654]

E-Man is doing God's work.

So proud of him

[CosmiComic]

Many of the ppl working at marvel like the Russos and Feigie admitted to that too. Had they known then maybe Panther would have done more in infinity war and not been killed off.
But who knows with how strange and shady Feigies comments have been lately.

What did he say recently?

[Ezyo1000]

I stopped talking here as much because I'm quite tired of the same repetitive discussions about the current comic books and debates about the first film. But I think I'm most annoyed by what I'm perceiving as an attempt to downplay everything Coogler did for that and using Chadwick's death as an excuse for that.

I have to agree with DigiCom about the revisionist history: When Ava DuVernay did not get on board to direct the film, many of you were thanking the stars because you thought she might have done the same things Coates was doing in the comics because she is a woman and an outspoken feminist. But now because she did the bare minimum of putting an action figure in her show (something Coogler and Feige were partially responsible for) she's now suddenly the best thing for the character?

This isn't a slight towards her because I'm actually a fan of her work (unlike most here I assume, but forgive me if I'm wrong) but she hasn't even proven that she can handle big IPs and fantasy films. A Wrinkle in Time was disappointment and a flop, she dropped out of Black Panther for a reason (and ot certainly wasn't because she wanted to do too good for T'Challa), and she has quit making New Gods for DC. At least Ryan Coogler proved with Creed that he could make a great franchise film and also direct fight scenes, which DuVernay hasn't proven she can actually do.

And sure, an MCU Black Panther movie would have always been successful. However what makes a film special comes from the specific vision of a director, and Coogler and DuVernay had different visions because they are different directors and people. Without Coogler you don't get the Oscar winning score because Ludwig Goransson has been his friend for years. Without Coogler you don't get Rachel Morisson's cinematography who is also his close friend. You don't get the overarching theme of partenal legacy because that's a big theme in Coogler's films. You probably wouldn't even get the same cast because a few of them signed on because of Coogler.

You don't get the same kind of film even if you get an MCU Black Panther film, because Ryan Coogler was hired for his vision, and it's he that has proven twice that his vision for franchise films can be successful, not DuVernay. Putting a toy in a TV show does not prove that she has any more respect for the character to recast the role, than the person who actually made the film and arguably made the character in film iconic in the first place. At least give a reason why you'd think she's a good choice other than the fact that she's not Ryan Coogler.

But like I said, the discussion is repetitive and tiring. If anything new is being said it's just increasingly negative. I'm just tired of the idea that random people like us on the internet think we knew Chadwick Boseman better than the the people who actually worked with and were his friends. I'm sure almost if not none of us who think our emotions are somehow more valid never even met Chadwick. We only saw him on screen. None of us knew what he wanted.

Really it's only been one or two people at most championing Ava. The rest of is are just frustrated by how the MCU is just moving along and then slights like Bucky thanking Ayo (who hadn't been shown to even know or interact with him since her debut) and Shuri for all they have done for him while ignoring completely that Shuri interacted with Bucky once in an after credits scene and T'Challa was the one to talk with him the most.

People are frustrated that it just feels like the whole "Honoring" Chadwick is just an excuse to remove the Character. Yes us here don't know Chad personally. But can you honestly say, based on HIS OWN WORDS in Interviews about how he approaches roles and how he operated, that he would be Cool withy T'Challa being gone with him? Dude battled cancer and toughed through it to bring T'Challa to the big screen, you don't do that just so the Character is retired if something happens to you, as of it was some sort of move to lay claim and ownership over the Character.

I think part of the reason for no recast in part had to do with rushing deadlines. People grieve differently and at different paces, and for Disney to push to keep the same schedule and announce their plans less than 3 months after his passing? You really think these decisions were made with clear heads?

That's what is frustrating

[Ezyo1000]

I mean, half the plot of Priest run was when Mephisto made him kiss Nakia and then she freaking snapped because of it.

Yeah that's true on top of that Coates conveniently ignored Hudlins run when it came to the Doras, ya know, when Hudlin straight up shut that **** down when Ramonda asked why he didn't just marry a Dora "It would turn an asset into a liability" but nah, T'Challa is a powerful black male, he has his urges and the Dora have to "serve in all ways" and "will potentially marry T'Challa" seriously when the above you quoted and Roxannes bullshit cringe worthy writing came out... It was like.... Seriously? They okayed this ****??

[Blind Wedjat]

To be fair, his own brother said recast though.

I, personally and not speaking for others on #teamrecast, don't have much of a problem with Chadwick's co-workers going, "I don't want to recast because I can't emotionally handle it," type of thing. My general problem with some of the stuff released from Team Marvel is that a) I don't know why they rushed any announcements while the wound was really really really fucking fresh and b) it has turned into a "T'challa isnt important and doesn't mean anything. Wakanda is important" which is very... weird considering they beat over the head how "important" T'challa was to the black community or whatever last movie. It feels very very very very cooperate. A lot of this situation seems fake as hell. But that is hollywood so whatever I suppose.

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I remember that Chadwick's brother was more against the idea of killing off T'Challa than he was for recasting the role. And according to him he felt that although he didn't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist, he felt like the proverbial "they" don't want to see a black male king character. I found it gross that he was even asked such a question in the first place because it allows his mind to go places it shouldn't, and he was asked a question framed in a certain way when no official information was out and when Chadwick was only gone for some months.

I also think many of you who are for a recast have failed to acknowledge that "We will not be recasting the role of T'Challa in 'Black Panther 2'" is not the same thing as "We will be killing off T'Challa and he will never be used in the MCU ever again," because these can be two separate discussions. "We will not be recasting the role of T'Challa in 'Black Panther 2'" could mean holding that off because the character simply won't be present in the sequel, a recast in a later film, or the worst case scenario of killing him off. Marvel hasn't said anything specific, but we've all assumed the worst for some reason.

Why is Duvernay being a feminist bad for Black Panther?

I wasn't trying to say that, but I'm also not stupid and vividly remember that it was a reason why some people here were glad she didn't get the gig, because they thought she would do what they didn't like what Coates was doing in the comics.

What did he say recently?

Can't remember who between Nate Moore, the Russos or the Infinity War writers said that they may have reconsidered killing T'Challa off in the film if they knew how well Black Panther was going to do.

Really it's only been one or two people at most championing Ava. The rest of is are just frustrated by how the MCU is just moving along and then slights like Bucky thanking Ayo (who hadn't been shown to even know or interact with him since her debut) and Shuri for all they have done for him while ignoring completely that Shuri interacted with Bucky once in an after credits scene and T'Challa was the one to talk with him the most.

People are frustrated that it just feels like the whole "Honoring" Chadwick is just an excuse to remove the Character. Yes us here don't know Chad personally. But can you honestly say, based on HIS OWN WORDS in Interviews about how he approaches roles and how he operated, that he would be Cool withy T'Challa being gone with him? Dude battled cancer and toughed through it to bring T'Challa to the big screen, you don't do that just so the Character is retired if something happens to you, as of it was some sort of move to lay claim and ownership over the Character.

I think part of the reason for no recast in part had to do with rushing deadlines. People grieve differently and at different paces, and for Disney to push to keep the same schedule and announce their plans less than 3 months after his passing? You really think these decisions were made with clear heads?

That's what is frustrating

The writers of Falcon and the Winter Soldier are simply working with what they've been dealt with and what they have. Ayo is being used because Florence Kasumba was available (unlike Letitia Wright and Danai Gurira who probably were not). Bucky thanking Ayo is a thank you to Wakanda, not a slight as T'Challa wasn't personally involved in the deprogramming process but only arranged it.

Again, what you THINK is the best way to honour Chadwick based on what you THINK you know about him is still a projection because you didn't KNOW him. And you have to acknowledge that not only are your feelings simply yours alone but they actually have less value than those who knew him and worked with him. The only way your feelings could hold more value is if they were part of an overwhelming majority big enough to scare Marvel with financial losses, which could make them go against and potentially lose someone like Ryan Coogler on board.

None of the petitions have up to 10,000 signatures. None of the videos have up to 100,000 views. There are no banners, no billboards, no fundraising events, no merchandise, no marches. There's no Twitter hashtag that trends with millions of tweets. There are no trending article. There's zero industry support. This thing is not a movement at all, and for context everything listed there is what the Snyder Cut movement had and even that needed a global pandemic to succeed.

[Lou_Kayge]

Movie and Geek culture YouTuber John Campea said that he thinks killing off T'Challa in the MCU is stupid because the character is too important and should be recast. He's against the petition though because it's basically a waste of time(my words). The studios don't have to listen to us fans.

[BlackClaw]

They could've had Klaw kill T'Chaka and T'Challa go after Bucky for other reasons, like maybe Hydra made him attack Wakanda.

I think at the time Hollywood still underestimated the potential success of a Black-focused superhero movie

I was hoping that the solo film could’ve at least said that Klaw gave Zemo the bomb so that way he could still be responsible for T’Chakas death, just indirectly this time. But we all know how that story ends.

[Chesterfield]

Edited post

[Username taken]

Re: the Dora Milaje.

There was some discussions about them a couple of pages back.

The Dora Milaje are based on the historical all-female army in what is now Benin Republic. The "Dahomey Amazons" is what they were called.

They were all legally married to the King of Dahomey. I learnt they were supposed to make a movie about them.

That's nice. Instead of movies about slavery and "black terror", filmakers should make movies about really interesting concepts like these.

But I digress...please carry on guys.

[Username taken]

Movie and Geek culture YouTuber John Campea said that he thinks killing off T'Challa in the MCU is stupid because the character is too important and should be recast. He's against the petition though because it's basically a waste of time(my words). The studios don't have to listen to us fans.

It goes without saying.

Ending T'Challa's story because the man playing him died is pretty terrible.

How many black superheroes are on-screen that they are taking away arguably the most prominent one?

[skyvolt2000]

Movie and Geek culture YouTuber John Campea said that he thinks killing off T'Challa in the MCU is stupid because the character is too important and should be recast. He's against the petition though because it's basically a waste of time(my words). The studios don't have to listen to us fans.

And we don't have to go see the movie.

Which if it under performs-they better NOT say a word to the fans. That petition is giving you a heads up and they should be thankful that is ALL they are seeing. I am sure WB wants a do over with the Snyder Cut and all the toxic mess it released and that is NOT counting Ray Fisher's mess.

[CosmiComic]

It goes without saying.

Ending T'Challa's story because the man playing him died is pretty terrible.

How many black superheroes are on-screen that they are taking away arguably the most prominent one?

Tbh, not that many. MCU is getting a few more, but considering how many White superheroes there are, probably not enough.

[Besouro]

Re: the Dora Milaje.

There was some discussions about them a couple of pages back.

The Dora Milaje are based on the historical all-female army in what is now Benin Republic. The "Dahomey Amazons" is what they were called.

They were all legally married to the King of Dahomey. I learnt they were supposed to make a movie about them.

That's nice. Instead of movies about slavery and "black terror", filmakers should make movies about really interesting concepts like these.

But I digress...please carry on guys.

The Dahomey Amazons were NOT married to the king.....I request you share your sources of this info that says otherwise.

[MindofShadow]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I remember that Chadwick's brother was more against the idea of killing off T'Challa than he was for recasting the role. And according to him he felt that although he didn't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist, he felt like the proverbial "they" don't want to see a black male king character. I found it gross that he was even asked such a question in the first place because it allows his mind to go places it shouldn't, and he was asked a question framed in a certain way when no official information was out and when Chadwick was only gone for some months.

Eh, it is still his brother. Assuming they weren't estranged, he would be way more emotionally involved in Chadwicks death than any actor or industry person. His opinion has to mean a lot.

I also think many of you who are for a recast have failed to acknowledge that "We will not be recasting the role of T'Challa in 'Black Panther 2'" is not the same thing as "We will be killing off T'Challa and he will never be used in the MCU ever again," because these can be two separate discussions. "We will not be recasting the role of T'Challa in 'Black Panther 2'" could mean holding that off because the character simply won't be present in the sequel, a recast in a later film, or the worst case scenario of killing him off. Marvel hasn't said anything specific, but we've all assumed the worst for some reason.

I think it is fair to assume the worst in this regard. But a lot more people in here have more hope than I do....

unless the movie is in the 5 year gap. That changes everything imho.

This thing is not a movement at all, and for context everything listed there is what the Snyder Cut movement had and even that needed a global pandemic to succeed.

Which I am glad about, even as team recast. That Snyder crap was and is toxic as hell and just promotes more toxicity like DM'ing death threats to actors. F all that noise, I'd rather T'challa be buried forever than be associated with people like that.

Only way T'challa maybe comes back is if BP2 goes way under whatever the new expectaions of big movies is. Which is why voting with wallet is all that matters, not petitions and youtube videos. If the movie underperforms and merch doesn't sell like they want... T'chalal will be back.

But, I'm not as emotionally invested anymore liek a lot of people are here lol. I gave up haha.


And I do think it is really weird they haven't even name dropped Black Panther in Fal/WS. Feels like they went out of their way not too. But whatever.