T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2021

[BlackClaw]

the Solo, BP wow BP Crew all failed. Black panther DOES succeed... When the character is written properly. Sure he isn't pulling Batman numbers BUT, had Coates gave a isht about T'Challa and building him up, and actually knew how to write fiction, his run would of sold great even early numbers for S1 he was doing well... But he bled so many readers for poor writing that there was no stabilization.

Numbers don't lie, and as much as you want to throw excuses for why Coates isn't doing well or how this run is somehow a success. Numbers. Don't. Lie. There are plenty of other books that are doing well financially despite pirating being more prevalent. That's not why Coates run is a commercial failure.

Nothing but truth here. Plus as much excuses as they make for Coates we all know they’ll stop coming in here and by extension drop the book once the next writer decides to actually focus on developing T’Challa instead of constantly giving feats to characters from other franchises. Lmao.

[butterflykyss]

the Solo, BP wow BP Crew all failed. Black panther DOES succeed... When the character is written properly. Sure he isn't pulling Batman numbers BUT, had Coates gave a isht about T'Challa and building him up, and actually knew how to write fiction, his run would of sold great even early numbers for S1 he was doing well... But he bled so many readers for poor writing that there was no stabilization.

Numbers don't lie, and as much as you want to throw excuses for why Coates isn't doing well or how this run is somehow a success. Numbers. Don't. Lie. There are plenty of other books that are doing well financially despite pirating being more prevalent. That's not why Coates run is a commercial failure.

well let's put it this way whatever Coates did sales wise is irrelevant now as he is off the title. hopefully, what contributing factors to poor sales i believe impacted his books is not experienced by the next writer.

[Ezyo1000]

literally the second comment I saw:




I cant show you any of that but to me that is a silly thing to complain about. tchalla is a well respected hero and avenger who has saved or helped save the world many times over. why wouldn't they come to his aid at his request?

Lol scroll past that comment. Lots of praise of all these Black heroes showing up, wishing certain characters showed up. Praising how no one got overshadowed and Prodigy was THAT GUY... While ignoring T'Challa was overshadowed and it's not Prodigys book so T'Challa should be filling that role..

Why wouldn't they show up? Because it's a Wakanda level threat, 98% of these characters never showed up in this book over the last 5 Years/ have no relationship with T'Challa, he doesn't need their help, (T'Challa just repelled knulls forces and liberated Wakanda and Africa solo in RJs KiB) and if the threat is big enough to require characters like BM, then this should be an avenger level threat and this gets treated as a event.

Again all this praise is about all the black heroes showing up. Not about T'Challa, not about the power of the BP and Wakanda, not at the story, but because their favorite Black hero showed up random in a book and the title character is getting punked for very superficial feats that don't even benefit these characters. Literally take all of them out and have this just be T'Challa and Wakanda vs future Wakanda and nothing in this issue changes. People need to stop giving Coates a pass just because he is black. Hold him to the same standard priest and hudlin and RJ are held to because they earned their praise from BP fans through great storytelling and character elevation. Not showing how much disdain they have for the title character and his franchise

[MindofShadow]

WoW didn't sell based on quality.

The first 1-2 issues sold based on hype, like all first couples issues in comics, since everything is pre-ordered. These are number sold to SHOPS, not consumers. So shops have to guess and then adjust.

Once people read the book, sales collapsed.



Also, this is revisionist history. The story was marketed directly as a companion of Coates. Roxanne was another "literary" writer taking 2 characters coates introduced and expanding it.

Also, WoW wasn't announced as a mini initially. To once again cause increased sales in the first few issues. Mini's notoriously don't sell as well as ongoings, so marketing it as an ongoing artificially created a sales increase. Once again, that changed as issues came out.


Side note:

"blerds" have turned themselves into a caricature. Yeesh.

[MindofShadow]

And to be fair... maybe this is all "blerds" want.

I could be wrong. Wanting a good, 12 issue story involving the title character having an arc, good villain, good art, good character development, good action... maybe that isn't what the majority want.

Maybe I'm the weird one. If people really enjoy splash pages of heroes beating goons then... I am happy they are so easily pleased I guess lol.

I know I will never be satisfied with my favorite character throwing a dagger at someone on a splash page in a book. But then again... my favorite character doesn't have a reputation for being a background dancer shooting stuff every few issues without being the main focus......


Also something I found humorous...

BP and Ororo married: OMG, just because they are both black and popular doesn't mean they should be a couple! THIS IS FORCED!

BP has every black hero show up in Wakanda, most of which he has no prior relationship with and there are none of his white friends there: OMG THIS IS SO EPIC!!!! BLACK PRIDE!!!! BEST ISSUE EVER!!!

[Overhazard]

And to be fair... maybe this is all "blerds" want.

I could be wrong. Wanting a good, 12 issue story involving the title character having an arc, good villain, good art, good character development, good action... maybe that isn't what the majority want.

Maybe I'm the weird one. If people really enjoy splash pages of heroes beating goons then... I am happy they are so easily pleased I guess lol.

I know I will never be satisfied with my favorite character throwing a dagger at someone on a splash page in a book. But then again... my favorite character doesn't have a reputation for being a background dancer shooting stuff every few issues without being the main focus......


Also something I found humorous...

BP and Ororo married: OMG, just because they are both black and popular doesn't mean they should be a couple! THIS IS FORCED!

BP has every black hero show up in Wakanda, most of which he has no prior relationship with and there are none of his white friends there: OMG THIS IS SO EPIC!!!! BLACK PRIDE!!!! BEST ISSUE EVER!!!

Another thing I wonder is how many of these blerds are these mythical new readers that Marvel's been looking for. My brother for example, is probably a bigger blerd than I am, he loves the marvel movies, but he's never read a comic book in his life. He only knows about Shuri being BP in the comics because of memes and facebook, where bad photoshop reigns supreme.

Writers like Coates and Gay are part of this upper crust, muckety-muck group of upper-class academic black people, and that's who their writing mostly appeals to, not normal people on the ground. They love the aesthetics of Wakanda, the idea of Black Panther, him as a symbol, but not as a person, even a fictional one. They can do without T'challa the man.

[Ezyo1000]

And to be fair... maybe this is all "blerds" want.

I could be wrong. Wanting a good, 12 issue story involving the title character having an arc, good villain, good art, good character development, good action... maybe that isn't what the majority want.

Maybe I'm the weird one. If people really enjoy splash pages of heroes beating goons then... I am happy they are so easily pleased I guess lol.

I know I will never be satisfied with my favorite character throwing a dagger at someone on a splash page in a book. But then again... my favorite character doesn't have a reputation for being a background dancer shooting stuff every few issues without being the main focus......


Also something I found humorous...

BP and Ororo married: OMG, just because they are both black and popular doesn't mean they should be a couple! THIS IS FORCED!

BP has every black hero show up in Wakanda, most of which he has no prior relationship with and there are none of his white friends there: OMG THIS IS SO EPIC!!!! BLACK PRIDE!!!! BEST ISSUE EVER!!!

This. Right. Here.

You know why people are so hyped about it now though right? Because BP blew up on the MCU. So now everyone wants to get a piece of the BP pie. Thats why Storm fans pushed so hard for her to show up in the sequel, why people are so "Black Pride!!!" About Black heroes showing up in Wakanda, a place that, usually houses only a handful of heroes AT MOST, yet Coates throws a ton of them in and all of a sudden Wakanda is cool with this??

Nah they would be like "this is a Wakandan matter, we will handle this." Again it's so sad that this is what black folk's are getting hyped about. Literal scraps. Satisfied with black characters being in the background, no lines, going pew pew on some goons in a story that's utter dog isht and is literally all over the place with 1 issue left that's supposed to wrap up this 5 year series and put the all the toys back (which at this point, I would be surprised if THAT even happens) for the next writer.

It's like you said a few pages back. No one here praises JAs avengers run like it s the Golden standard and attack's anyone who doesn't like it just because T'Challa is being written well. We recognize that while T'Challa looks great in it, the story overall isn't that great and character treatment of some is lacking as well.

[BlkGldBlu]

We all wanted multiple BP franchise books and Coats attempted.
Fail but tried.
Now that he so called fleshed Wakanda out.
Maybe we can a few new ongoing BP books.
I'm still down for a Solo BP book Where Tchalla gets the shine and respect he deserves.
I still say there should be a second book that rotate between Dora's and Hatut Zeare Style missions that either sets up the next villian or expands on what ever is happening in BP. And a Third that showcase Shuri leadership role and feature Wakandian hero's Like Vibbrax or Nehzno, Flea, QDJ or Ect.

[Cville]

We all wanted multiple BP franchise books and Coats attempted.
Fail but tried.
Now that he so called fleshed Wakanda out.
Maybe we can a few new ongoing BP books.
I'm still down for a Solo BP book Where Tchalla gets the shine and respect he deserves.
I still say there should be a second book that rotate between Dora's and Hatut Zeare Style missions that either sets up the next villian or expands on what ever is happening in BP. And a Third that showcase Shuri leadership role and feature Wakandian hero's Like Vibbrax or Nehzno, Flea, QDJ or Ect.

I think that collection of short stories is a place to start. A bunch of them had endings that set up future stories.

[Ezyo1000]

We all wanted multiple BP franchise books and Coats attempted.
Fail but tried.
Now that he so called fleshed Wakanda out.
Maybe we can a few new ongoing BP books.
I'm still down for a Solo BP book Where Tchalla gets the shine and respect he deserves.
I still say there should be a second book that rotate between Dora's and Hatut Zeare Style missions that either sets up the next villian or expands on what ever is happening in BP. And a Third that showcase Shuri leadership role and feature Wakandian hero's Like Vibbrax or Nehzno, Flea, QDJ or Ect.

Coates didn't attempt it though, right from the jump he ostracized longtime fans in an interview he said explicitly that longtime fans won't like his take. Gay did the same thing straight up Said in a interview Aneka and Ayo don't need T'Challa and they can stand on their own, this was before the BP wow dropped. BP crew was talked about as a misty and Storm book. Long live the King completely sidelined T'Challa. Rise was the only book that promoted him and it's no surprise it was the most stable when it ended, had it come second in of BP wow it likely would of been an ongoing.
We should get a new Solo, a mk presents BP solo/ rise reboot and a anthology book, while goci on HZ, Shuri, DM etc

[skyvolt2000]

We all wanted multiple BP franchise books and Coats attempted.
Fail but tried.
Now that he so called fleshed Wakanda out.
Maybe we can a few new ongoing BP books.
I'm still down for a Solo BP book Where Tchalla gets the shine and respect he deserves.
I still say there should be a second book that rotate between Dora's and Hatut Zeare Style missions that either sets up the next villian or expands on what ever is happening in BP. And a Third that showcase Shuri leadership role and feature Wakandian hero's Like Vibbrax or Nehzno, Flea, QDJ or Ect.

As Ezyo said-Coates and friends did not.
Black Panther didn't show up in The Crew until issue 3?
Same with WOW.
The only spinoffs that did what it was suppose to do were Shuri and BP vs Deadpool. The IDW book did that until Vita took over.

I could be wrong. Wanting a good, 12 issue story involving the title character having an arc, good villain, good art, good character development, good action... maybe that isn't what the majority want.

Maybe I'm the weird one. If people really enjoy splash pages of heroes beating goons then... I am happy they are so easily pleased I guess lol.

I know I will never be satisfied with my favorite character throwing a dagger at someone on a splash page in a book. But then again... my favorite character doesn't have a reputation for being a background dancer shooting stuff every few issues without being the main focus......

No you are not the weird one. Here is the MAIN difference between all of US and most Blerd (or those who CLAIM to be Blerd).

Spawn, Static, Icon, Hardware, Static Shock, Cage, Steel, Luke Cage, Deathlok, Black Panther (before Coates), New Warriors, Power Man, Young Avengers Present Patriot, Batwing, The New Batman, Cyborg vol 1-2, Vixen's mini, Batman & Signal, Prodigy in New X-Men, Mr Terriffic & Jakeem in JSA, The Teriffics, Far Sector, Naomi, Riri, Ironheart, Lion Forge's Noble, Quincrible, Vita's Livewire, Resonant, The Mall, Mall, Relay, Creature Features, Miles Morales, Savage Dragon, You Bought Me the Ocean, We Are Robin, Doom, New Batman, Future State Green Lantern & Aquaman, Image's Prodigy, Excellence, Bitter Root, Black, Black AF, Falcon, Sam Wilson, War Machine 1-2, Night Thrasher, Nightwatch, Nighthawk, Starbrand & Nightmask, Michael Cray Wildstorm, Chuck Clayton, Other side of DC Universe, Green Lantern Mosaic, Unknown Solider, Men of War, Flint's Inhumans arc, Synch in Generation X, Jason Rusch, Vixen's Truth & Justice, Orlando, Shadowman, Divinity, Quantum & Woody, Strike, Reyn, Concrete Park, Sabre, Two Moons, Fence, Backstaggers, Goldie Vance, MASK, Stronghold. Farmhands, Seven Secrets, Sacred Seven, Dead Letters, final Dark Horse Alien minis and Fuse.

Books that showcased BLACK EXCELLENCE beyond splash pages. Are ANY of those Blerd reading those books?

Because if they did-they would not be jumping for joy for cameos.

[DigiCom]

So... an EPIC threat includes "Imperial Brawlers" that can be taken out by an ordinary sniper rifle?

Oh, I'm sorry.. by the "Finger of Death".

It's a good thing Fury Jr. was there! Wakanda could never come up with weapons more effective than BULLETS!

[Ezyo1000]

As Ezyo said-Coates and friends did not.
Black Panther didn't show up in The Crew until issue 3?
Same with WOW.
The only spinoffs that did what it was suppose to do were Shuri and BP vs Deadpool. The IDW book did that until Vita took over.




No you are not the weird one. Here is the MAIN difference between all of US and most Blerd (or those who CLAIM to be Blerd).

Spawn, Static, Icon, Hardware, Static Shock, Cage, Steel, Luke Cage, Deathlok, Black Panther (before Coates), New Warriors, Power Man, Young Avengers Present Patriot, Batwing, The New Batman, Cyborg vol 1-2, Vixen's mini, Batman & Signal, Prodigy in New X-Men, Mr Terriffic & Jakeem in JSA, The Teriffics, Far Sector, Naomi, Riri, Ironheart, Lion Forge's Noble, Quincrible, Vita's Livewire, Resonant, The Mall, Mall, Relay, Creature Features, Miles Morales, Savage Dragon, You Bought Me the Ocean, We Are Robin, Doom, New Batman, Future State Green Lantern & Aquaman, Image's Prodigy, Excellence, Bitter Root, Black, Black AF, Falcon, Sam Wilson, War Machine 1-2, Night Thrasher, Nightwatch, Nighthawk, Starbrand & Nightmask, Michael Cray Wildstorm, Chuck Clayton, Other side of DC Universe, Green Lantern Mosaic, Unknown Solider, Men of War, Flint's Inhumans arc, Synch in Generation X, Jason Rusch, Vixen's Truth & Justice, Orlando, Shadowman, Divinity, Quantum & Woody, Strike, Reyn, Concrete Park, Sabre, Two Moons, Fence, Backstaggers, Goldie Vance, MASK, Stronghold. Farmhands, Seven Secrets, Sacred Seven, Dead Letters, final Dark Horse Alien minis and Fuse.

Books that showcased BLACK EXCELLENCE beyond splash pages. Are ANY of those Blerd reading those books?

Because if they did-they would not be jumping for joy for cameos.

I would say rise and BP vs DP.

Shuri book turned her into a whiny brat. Claiming she was born the wrong gender and T'Challa somehow held disdain for her when they were younger because she saved him. Among other bullshit. The IDW book was bad from the drop as wel. Tried to reinforce that only Shuri was a genius and T'Challa was simply king and BP (and not a very good BP since he needed to be saved from some random miner).

I take it back, there were 4 titles that did alright for T'Challa.
Rise
BP vs DP
Soul of a machine
Sound and fury

BP Solo, BP wow, long live, Shuri, IDW, Wakanda forever, BP crew. All of those shit on T'Challa and the franchise as a whole and added nothing of benefit to the mythos

[Ekie]

As Ezyo said-Coates and friends did not.
Black Panther didn't show up in The Crew until issue 3?
Same with WOW.
The only spinoffs that did what it was suppose to do were Shuri and BP vs Deadpool. The IDW book did that until Vita took over.




No you are not the weird one. Here is the MAIN difference between all of US and most Blerd (or those who CLAIM to be Blerd).

Spawn, Static, Icon, Hardware, Static Shock, Cage, Steel, Luke Cage, Deathlok, Black Panther (before Coates), New Warriors, Power Man, Young Avengers Present Patriot, Batwing, The New Batman, Cyborg vol 1-2, Vixen's mini, Batman & Signal, Prodigy in New X-Men, Mr Terriffic & Jakeem in JSA, The Teriffics, Far Sector, Naomi, Riri, Ironheart, Lion Forge's Noble, Quincrible, Vita's Livewire, Resonant, The Mall, Mall, Relay, Creature Features, Miles Morales, Savage Dragon, You Bought Me the Ocean, We Are Robin, Doom, New Batman, Future State Green Lantern & Aquaman, Image's Prodigy, Excellence, Bitter Root, Black, Black AF, Falcon, Sam Wilson, War Machine 1-2, Night Thrasher, Nightwatch, Nighthawk, Starbrand & Nightmask, Michael Cray Wildstorm, Chuck Clayton, Other side of DC Universe, Green Lantern Mosaic, Unknown Solider, Men of War, Flint's Inhumans arc, Synch in Generation X, Jason Rusch, Vixen's Truth & Justice, Orlando, Shadowman, Divinity, Quantum & Woody, Strike, Reyn, Concrete Park, Sabre, Two Moons, Fence, Backstaggers, Goldie Vance, MASK, Stronghold. Farmhands, Seven Secrets, Sacred Seven, Dead Letters, final Dark Horse Alien minis and Fuse.

Books that showcased BLACK EXCELLENCE beyond splash pages. Are ANY of those Blerd reading those books?

Because if they did-they would not be jumping for joy for cameos.

The hard truth.
Equality comes with quality

Not with random and forced pandering.
This has historically been Marvel's problem with handling the character and in the MCU this is going to be the problem going forward with them shelving the entire story and moving on to make up their own thing without any history attached to what they're going to do

[Ezyo1000]

So... an EPIC threat includes "Imperial Brawlers" that can be taken out by an ordinary sniper rifle?

Oh, I'm sorry.. by the "Finger of Death".

It's a good thing Fury Jr. was there! Wakanda could never come up with weapons more effective than BULLETS!

Cot damn this made me laugh harder then it should of lol