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  1. #601
    Fantastic Member Sneakronicity's Avatar
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    I haven't posted anything here yet about the show, but I have been watching, and personally I have found I like each episode more than the previous one.

    The first episode I wasn't a fan of. Too much focus on Kate, almost all of Clint's scenes with the family which I very vocally loathe, made it something I didn't really enjoy. I also really hated how they gave all the good Clint/Lucky material to Kate. I did love that they're showing his grief over losing Natasha, and that carries through the show though, and I'm very glad they dropped two episodes that first week so I didn't have to be disappointed for a full week.

    Episode 2 put more focus on the Clint/Kate dynamic, and gave Clint some good moments on his own, like the LARP scene.

    Episode 3 was definitely my favourite so far. spoilers:
    The fight in the warehouse was awesome and really showed Clint's skills, and I thought it was a nice touch showing how he's just learning a little sign language and relying so heavily on the hearing aid. Echo was pretty badass, and the car chase scene was just so much fun! The Clint/Kate dynamic continues to be my favourite part, I think they have amazing chemistry. Clint's phone call also was a great bit of acting from Renner. He's really a great actor when he's given good material to work with (I'm also currently watching Mayor of Kingstown and he's excellent in that). I'm definitely miffed that we still have zero backstory for Clint, and that a lot of his character feels like it's being shifted to Kate instead, but for what they have to work with after everything the MCU already messed up, I am thoroughly enjoying this show for now.
    end of spoilers

  2. #602
    Astonishing Member gonnagiveittoya's Avatar
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    You can hide the face but you can't hide that fucking voice even in just a chuckle, Marvel. spoilers:
    Welcome back, Uncle Fisk
    end of spoilers

  3. #603
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonnagiveittoya View Post
    You can hide the face but you can't hide that fucking voice even in just a chuckle, Marvel. spoilers:
    Welcome back, Uncle Fisk
    end of spoilers
    Yeah, that chuckle definitely gave him away.

  4. #604
    I hate Christmas Matternativ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chicago_bastard View Post
    Wait, you didn't like the trick arrow mayhem? The spoilers:
    Pym arrow
    end of spoilers was something else

    That said, due to its focus on action it was probably the worst episode to watch on a smartphone.
    Nah that was great but I lumped that together with the action scenes in general being very solid.
    "̶l̶̶e̶̶t̶'̶s̶̶ ̶̶h̶̶a̶̶v̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶o̶̶m̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶f̶̶u̶̶n̶̶,̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶b̶̶e̶̶a̶̶t̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶.̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶ ̶̶w̶̶a̶̶n̶̶n̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶a̶̶k̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶r̶̶i̶̶d̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶o̶̶n̶̶ ̶̶y̶̶o̶̶u̶̶r̶̶ ̶̶d̶̶i̶̶s̶̶c̶̶o̶̶s̶̶t̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶"
    "Let's have some fun, this riff is sick. I wanna mosh around in the Circle Pit!"

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  5. #605
    Incredible Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    I was very disturbed by the murder flashback scene. I find it hard to believe that Clint did a background check on all of those people he killed and decided they were all individually bad enough to die. Unless it's a fakeout and it turns out Kazi (or someone else) used a fake Ronin costume to kill them. But Clint didn't deny that Ronin did it, so I don't know.

    Aside from that (how did you enjoy the play, Mrs. Lincoln?), I found it a solid episode. I loved the action scenes (and I don't usually) and the chemistry between the Hawkeyes. I also thought it was cute how they used the "nine years old and spoiled rotten" line from the comics.

  6. #606
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I was very disturbed by the murder flashback scene. I find it hard to believe that Clint did a background check on all of those people he killed and decided they were all individually bad enough to die. Unless it's a fakeout and it turns out Kazi (or someone else) used a fake Ronin costume to kill them. But Clint didn't deny that Ronin did it, so I don't know.
    I guess it depends on how far they're willing to go with how murderous Ronin was and the human cost of that.

    Although Daredevil was framed for the murder in the comics to make Echo into an antagonist, so there is precedence.

  7. #607
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I was very disturbed by the murder flashback scene. I find it hard to believe that Clint did a background check on all of those people he killed and decided they were all individually bad enough to die. Unless it's a fakeout and it turns out Kazi (or someone else) used a fake Ronin costume to kill them. But Clint didn't deny that Ronin did it, so I don't know.

    Aside from that (how did you enjoy the play, Mrs. Lincoln?), I found it a solid episode. I loved the action scenes (and I don't usually) and the chemistry between the Hawkeyes. I also thought it was cute how they used the "nine years old and spoiled rotten" line from the comics.

    He went nuts. They showed it in endgame. They said he was a problem. Hawkeye broke. And he has a lot to live down. Its a great turn for his character. The family man who turned into a killer.

  8. #608
    Incredible Member chicago_bastard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    I was very disturbed by the murder flashback scene. I find it hard to believe that Clint did a background check on all of those people he killed and decided they were all individually bad enough to die. Unless it's a fakeout and it turns out Kazi (or someone else) used a fake Ronin costume to kill them. But Clint didn't deny that Ronin did it, so I don't know.
    How was the scene different from the Endgame scene where he was killing Yakuza left and right?
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

  9. #609
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Just saw the third episode as well. Really liked how the show drew that connection between Hawkeye and Echo. The story beats and character work were really on point.

    As for the action, well, it looked a little choppy to me, a little underwhelming. However, I get it. This isn't a Marvel movie, it's a Disney Plus series. And I will say that those scenes were creative. It was cool to see Clint's, Kate's, and Maya's skills. That long take car chase was pretty cool. And it was nice to see all of those trick arrows.
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  10. #610
    Incredible Member OOTCS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chicago_bastard View Post
    How was the scene different from the Endgame scene where he was killing Yakuza left and right?
    Maybe I'm remembering it incorrectly, but I thought that in the Yakuza scene, he was knocking out the henchmen and we only saw clear killing when it came to the leader, whose crimes he seemed to know of personally. In this scene, we saw the sword going in and out with all the henchmen.

  11. #611
    Incredible Member chicago_bastard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OOTCS View Post
    Maybe I'm remembering it incorrectly, but I thought that in the Yakuza scene, he was knocking out the henchmen and we only saw clear killing when it came to the leader, whose crimes he seemed to know of personally. In this scene, we saw the sword going in and out with all the henchmen.
    The majority of the scene shows just a wall from outside and leaves it to the imagination what exactly he is doing inside. But before he enters the building we do see him incapacitate three men with shuriken and since he hits lethal parts like the heart or the eye we can safely assume they are dead.

    There was also the scene of Rhodey telling Natasha that Clint left a room full of dead bodies in Mexico so I was always under the impression that he was killing everyone on his "missions".
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

  12. #612
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chicago_bastard View Post
    The majority of the scene shows just a wall from outside and leaves it to the imagination what exactly he is doing inside. But before he enters the building we do see him incapacitate three men with shuriken and since he hits lethal parts like the heart or the eye we can safely assume they are dead.

    There was also the scene of Rhodey telling Natasha that Clint left a room full of dead bodies in Mexico so I was always under the impression that he was killing everyone on his "missions".
    Clint went full season-1 Oliver Queen.

  13. #613
    I hate Christmas Matternativ's Avatar
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    As brutal as these scenes are I'll say there is a bit of a disconnect for me given that the avengers have been shown slaughtering henchefolk left right and center in the past in the MCU.
    "̶l̶̶e̶̶t̶'̶s̶̶ ̶̶h̶̶a̶̶v̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶o̶̶m̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶f̶̶u̶̶n̶̶,̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶h̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶b̶̶e̶̶a̶̶t̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶s̶̶ ̶̶s̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶.̶̶ ̶̶i̶̶ ̶̶w̶̶a̶̶n̶̶n̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶t̶̶a̶̶k̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶a̶̶ ̶̶r̶̶i̶̶d̶̶e̶̶ ̶̶o̶̶n̶̶ ̶̶y̶̶o̶̶u̶̶r̶̶ ̶̶d̶̶i̶̶s̶̶c̶̶o̶̶s̶̶t̶̶i̶̶c̶̶k̶̶"
    "Let's have some fun, this riff is sick. I wanna mosh around in the Circle Pit!"

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  14. #614
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matternativ View Post
    As brutal as these scenes are I'll say there is a bit of a disconnect for me given that the avengers have been shown slaughtering henchefolk left right and center in the past in the MCU.
    I think there's a general disconnect between the tone and style of the MCU and the level of violence/casual killing we actually see in the movies that they don't really dwell on.

  15. #615
    Incredible Member chicago_bastard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matternativ View Post
    As brutal as these scenes are I'll say there is a bit of a disconnect for me given that the avengers have been shown slaughtering henchefolk left right and center in the past in the MCU.
    Guess the difference is that the Avengers killing people was a side result on mandated missions by SHIELD or afterwards the World Security Council. The goal wasn't killing people, it was stopping Hydra or preventing terrorists from acquiring biological weapons. So when these guys opened fire on the heroes they sorta had it coming, whereas Clint's sole goal was to murder people and he wouldn't stop even if they surrendered.

    I do agree though that the contrast would work better if they had established some kind of no kill rule as in the comics.
    Tolstoy will live forever. Some people do. But that's not enough. It's not the length of a life that matters, just the depth of it. The chances we take. The paths we choose. How we go on when our hearts break. Hearts always break and so we bend with our hearts. And we sway. But in the end what matters is that we loved... and lived.

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