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  1. #121
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    Superbro isn't just a rookie Superman. I think it's the way Geoff Johns portrayed Superman in the first arc of the new52 Justice League. I mean the first encounter between Superman and Batman is Superman just coming out of nowhere, sucker punching Hal Jordan which throws him 4 blocks away, then asking Batman "What can you do?" and strangling Bruce while interrogating him and saying "Talk before I won't let you", to which Bruce responds "I'm trying to". This Batman is actually more in control and reasonable than Superman. That's Superbro for me. One of the dumbest takes there is. Jon Kent could possibly become this way yes. An egocentric impulsive punk who does whatever he wants without caring about what other people think or even thinking they deserve an expanation for why their house blew up. Or in other words, an *******

    https://comicnewbies.com/wp-content/...g-new-52-2.jpg
    Last edited by Alpha; 01-16-2021 at 05:03 PM.

  2. #122
    Astonishing Member LordUltimus's Avatar
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    The problem is that, like many characters in the New 52, the various characters had no consistency whatsoever between titles. The Superman in Justice League was not the same character in Action Comics was not the same character in Superman was not the same character in Superman Unchained, etc.

  3. #123
    Extraordinary Member Prime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordUltimus View Post
    The problem is that, like many characters in the New 52, the various characters had no consistency whatsoever between titles. The Superman in Justice League was not the same character in Action Comics was not the same character in Superman was not the same character in Superman Unchained, etc.
    He has a point here. For me Superbro was the one we saw in AC with Grant Morrison and Greg Pak.

  4. #124
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Superbro isn't just a rookie Superman. I think it's the way Geoff Johns portrayed Superman in the first arc of the new52 Justice League. I mean the first encounter between Superman and Batman is Superman just coming out of nowhere, sucker punching Hal Jordan which throws him 4 blocks away, then asking Batman "What can you do?" and strangling Bruce while interrogating him and saying "Talk before I won't let you", to which Bruce responds "I'm trying to". This Batman is actually more in control and reasonable than Superman. That's Superbro for me. One of the dumbest takes there is. Jon Kent could possibly become this way yes. An egocentric impulsive punk who does whatever he wants without caring about what other people think or even thinking they deserve an expanation for why their house blew up. Or in other words, an *******

    https://comicnewbies.com/wp-content/...g-new-52-2.jpg
    They were trying to play the cop.They were trying to "bring him in".He heard them trying to box him in.That moment with neck thing was an attempt at dry humor.He was in the moment and losing patience.That Superman doesn't have good memories or relation with the cops.You were just expecting superbro to behave like superman you are familiar with,that may have libertarian tilt or even conservative one.This guy isn't.The guy who is more of a hifflepuff captain marvel figure.This guy is based on goldenage superman.Then after that, hal did the unholy sin of chaining superman.That's how you get him pissed.Hey!he cares to do something.He care enough to be seen making mistakes,unlike saint superman.Rather than sit at home while playing with his wife.If ego was driving force for clark's action,he would be flexing it.He wouldn't be running from good cops.If there is an authority,they need to prove they are legitimate.it's simple as that.Superman is pretty easy to understand.Also,unlike jackass that sitsup at the high tower in mount olympus and who has caused more collateral damage than new52 ever could(new52 justice league also suck.).That clark used to stick around to take the hate from anyone that had legitmate grievances and hate.Help in any manner he can to rebuild.He wouldn't just fly off.(he couldn't.He was a leaping guy and very much grounded)Superman in general lives in fairyland,where everyone worships him at the alter.All he has to do is come out stop a helicopter and a damsel from falling.give some platitudes about hope.Also,If clark kent superman wants to be an authority figure that controls people.He can.But,he will need to prove his worth.
    Also,find it wierd that the rich guy in a batcostume doing whatever he wants isn't accussed of being a punk.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 01-16-2021 at 10:07 PM.
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  5. #125
    Leftbrownie Alpha's Avatar
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    I have outlined my prefered version of Superman in other threads. It's ok for you not to remember, but don't straw man this argument. I never argued for a passive Superman, or a libertarian conservative one (and I can't imagine a libertarian being very passive). I believe he would have a conservative view on family, but I doubt he would believe in god, or be anti abortion, and he absolutely would agree that authority figures should be held accountable for their actions and that a systematic abuse of people both informally and through laws and business practices should be addressed in a radical way. But one of the worst ways to do this is using force and violence on humans.

    Hal Jordan says "I'm gonna restrain and interrogate Superman and his response is to use his super strength to sucker punch Green Lantern blocks away". This is literally everything that we complain about police brutality, that it isn't a proportionate response to the crime. And you are defending Superman strangling people and threatening to kill them based on wild AND INCORRECT assumptions that they are involved in a previous attack? This portrayal of Superman reminds me a whole lot of those cops that strangled George Floyd, more than the BLM protesters. And my point is precisely that Batman is shown to be a very abusive and violent person, and in this story Superman is far more violent and abusive than Batman.

    And are you really claiming that "an authority needs to prove they are legitimate" while arguing for Superman doing everything he thinks is right? What legitimacy does HE have? Cops have to go through tests and interviews before they get to public service, and they can be fired. Neither of these things mean they are actually good but at least it's a process. Superman wasn't chosen or tested by anyone. He just decides that he is wise enough to decide what's best for everyone.
    Last edited by Alpha; 01-17-2021 at 08:47 AM.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robanker View Post
    Stop that. You know that doesn't fit the narrative of DC hating Jon Kent and any content they give is objectively a dumpster fire.

    For some fans, Jon was forever to be a ten year-old and Robin's sidekick. I liked him more as a kid and wanted a few more years of that, but ultimately there's been good moments with him since the age-up. I love Jon. I think he's great. Shame that seems to be a taboo opinion.
    What's your problem? It's fine if you like aged-up Jon, but you don't have take this kind of attitude with people who are understandable frustrated. It doesn't mean we're biased or irrational. I wanted Jon to move forward to, but not with an age-up and not missing all the great moments we should have gotten on the way to him becoming 17.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    I'm more of a Fairy Tail, MHA, and Hunter X Hunter kinda guy, myself. I respect One Piece but I just..can't get into it. Which is a shame cuz it clicks almost all the usual check boxes for stuff that I'm into.
    I'm a huge One Piece fan myself, but I would never recommend the anime to anyone. It's just too slow paced, especially once you get to Ennis Lobby. The manga is the way to go, but of course that can be intimidating too.

    I have actually been just getting into Fairy Tail myself, and though I do have some issues with it, I have been finding it to be generally enjoyable. Though I just got to a huge run of filler, so that's killed momentum some.
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  7. #127
    Ultimate Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    What's your problem? It's fine if you like aged-up Jon, but you don't have take this kind of attitude with people who are understandable frustrated. It doesn't mean we're biased or irrational. I wanted Jon to move forward to, but not with an age-up and not missing all the great moments we should have gotten on the way to him becoming 17.



    I'm a huge One Piece fan myself, but I would never recommend the anime to anyone. It's just too slow paced, especially once you get to Ennis Lobby. The manga is the way to go, but of course that can be intimidating too.

    I have actually been just getting into Fairy Tail myself, and though I do have some issues with it, I have been finding it to be generally enjoyable. Though I just got to a huge run of filler, so that's killed momentum some.
    Yeah, 1000+ chapters of One Piece (not an exaggeration) means probably around twice as many anime episodes.

    But I got burned out on One Piece awhile back. Got to the "Not Feudal Japan" arc, and just couldn't stick with it anymore. And I'll admit, Luffy is not my favorite character in it; but Sanji and Zoro (always think about the Mexican masked bandito first when I hear the name) were my favorites.

  8. #128
    Astonishing Member Blue22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    I have actually been just getting into Fairy Tail myself, and though I do have some issues with it, I have been finding it to be generally enjoyable. Though I just got to a huge run of filler, so that's killed momentum some.
    Fairy Tail's final arc has A LOT of issues (so did Bleach and Naruto's for that matter). But, as a whole, I think the series gets an unnecessarily bad rap. It is a very basic, by the books shounen but most of its problems are things that have always been prevalent in the genre. They aren't things that are exclusive to just Fairy Tail and yet that's the series that is always singled out for them.

    To keep things slightly on topic, Fairy Tail is a lot like kid Jon. Very simple, sometimes to a fault. Not the most thought provoking thing out there. But it still has a shitload of heart and is always a joy to read/watch. And that's really all I need. Something that I can have fun with.
    Last edited by Blue22; 01-17-2021 at 12:35 PM.

  9. #129
    Ultimate Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Fairy Tail's final arc has A LOT of issues (so did Bleach and Naruto's for that matter). But, as a whole, I think the series gets an unnecessarily bad rap. It is a very basic, by the books shounen but most of its problems are things that have always been prevalent in the genre. They aren't things that are exclusive to just Fairy Tail and yet that's the series that is always singled out for them.

    To keep things slightly on topic, Fairy Tail is a lot like kid Jon. Very simple, sometimes to a fault. Not the most thought provoking thing out there. But it still has a shitload of heart and is always a joy to read/watch. And that's really all I need. Something that I can have fun with.
    Honestly, that's the main thing I look for in comics. And I suppose Fairy Tail, at least early on, hits those notes. So did Dragon Ball, being light-hearted, simple, but fun. Not comparing kid Goku with real Jon though, very different characters, those two.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    Yeah, 1000+ chapters of One Piece (not an exaggeration) means probably around twice as many anime episodes.

    But I got burned out on One Piece awhile back. Got to the "Not Feudal Japan" arc, and just couldn't stick with it anymore. And I'll admit, Luffy is not my favorite character in it; but Sanji and Zoro (always think about the Mexican masked bandito first when I hear the name) were my favorites.
    Yeah, since the crew entered the New World, Oda has had a lot of trouble balancing the cast and giving all the Straw Hats development (one of my favorites Robin has been stuck in the backseat since 2008). The Dressrosa arc was a particularly big offender in this regard. Still, there's been some good stuff recently. The Whole Cake Island arc was great, but it helped that one was so Straw Hat-centric. Personally, I hope after Wano, there's time for a simpler arc just focusing on the Straw Hats.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Fairy Tail's final arc has A LOT of issues (so did Bleach and Naruto's for that matter). But, as a whole, I think the series gets an unnecessarily bad rap. It is a very basic, by the books shounen but most of its problems are things that have always been prevalent in the genre. They aren't things that are exclusive to just Fairy Tail and yet that's the series that is always singled out for them.

    To keep things slightly on topic, Fairy Tail is a lot like kid Jon. Very simple, sometimes to a fault. Not the most thought provoking thing out there. But it still has a shitload of heart and is always a joy to read/watch. And that's really all I need. Something that I can have fun with.
    I've just gotten past the time skip and I do know what you mean. The arcs tend to be simplistic (go here, fight this guy and his henchman), but the characters are fun. The one thing that drives me crazy involves Erza. She's great. I love her character, but the fact that she is stronger than Natsu keeps getting the writer into trouble when mapping out these arcs. Erza has to be sidelined in some way, so that Natsu can fight the big bad. It gets repetitive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    Honestly, that's the main thing I look for in comics. And I suppose Fairy Tail, at least early on, hits those notes. So did Dragon Ball, being light-hearted, simple, but fun. Not comparing kid Goku with real Jon though, very different characters, those two.
    Oh yeah, if Jon were to be compared to any Dragon Ball character, Gohan or Goten would be more apt.
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  11. #131
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    Hal Jordan says "I'm gonna restrain and interrogate Superman and his response is to use his super strength to sucker punch Green Lantern blocks away". .
    That's exactly what a guy who got literally tortured by these authorities would do.Worse,simply for existing as an alien.deal with it.Yeah! i am.Clark was already fighting monster.these guys just showed up out of nowhere trying to play the cop.Oh!please,if clark was really strangling batman he wouldn't able to talk.period. And he was really threatning,bruce and hal would have broken bones.Yeah! riiiight,an alien that was tortured reacting angrly to someone trying to "interrogate" him reminds of you a cop.The space cop and crazy guy in batcostume that decide not talk and barge in is "victim".In which world?

    yes,i am.because that superman ain't an authority.And Never claimed to be one.like you said,he isn't chosen by anyone.He chose being superman on behalf of himself .He doesn't have onus to prove his worth.He isn't legal.But,he has the freedom to choose that and to take action,bare any consequences.Whatever he does, isn't representative of anyone.But,having said that if people begin to see a champion in superman.If they want to follow him as the authority figure(keep in mind,clark is gonna do whatever he thinks is right.That includes actions that can be seen as against them).That's because his actions would have been welcomed at some level.Thereby proving his legitmacy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    Yeah, 1000+ chapters of One Piece (not an exaggeration) means probably around twice as many anime episodes.

    But I got burned out on One Piece awhile back. Got to the "Not Feudal Japan" arc, and just couldn't stick with it anymore. And I'll admit, Luffy is not my favorite character in it; but Sanji and Zoro (always think about the Mexican masked bandito first when I hear the name) were my favorites.
    You got burned by one piece at wano?I can understand fishman island.But,wano?That is just wierd.Especially,since zoro is smack dab in the middle of the conflict.Ever since zhou,one piece has been awesome for me.People's preferences i guess.I am a luffy fan all the way.I like sanji as well.Zoro is big cliche for me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue22 View Post
    Fairy Tail's final arc has A LOT of issues (so did Bleach and Naruto's for that matter). But, as a whole, I think the series gets an unnecessarily bad rap. It is a very basic, by the books shounen but most of its problems are things that have always been prevalent in the genre. They aren't things that are exclusive to just Fairy Tail and yet that's the series that is always singled out for them.

    To keep things slightly on topic, Fairy Tail is a lot like kid Jon. Very simple, sometimes to a fault. Not the most thought provoking thing out there. But it still has a shitload of heart and is always a joy to read/watch. And that's really all I need. Something that I can have fun with.
    Every series has problems.Fairy tail just doesn't redeem itself for a lot of people.Bleach is about a guy dealing with grief.Naruto is about the journey of an orphan with nothing..Regardless of what,people were invested in that premise.Fairy tail is just all over the place for me.As for kid jon being simple,things need to rampup and down.Otherwise,you are doing the samething again and again.People are gonna tune out and get bored.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 01-17-2021 at 08:53 PM.
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  12. #132
    Ultimate Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    Yeah, since the crew entered the New World, Oda has had a lot of trouble balancing the cast and giving all the Straw Hats development (one of my favorites Robin has been stuck in the backseat since 2008). The Dressrosa arc was a particularly big offender in this regard. Still, there's been some good stuff recently. The Whole Cake Island arc was great, but it helped that one was so Straw Hat-centric. Personally, I hope after Wano, there's time for a simpler arc just focusing on the Straw Hats.

    Oh yeah, if Jon were to be compared to any Dragon Ball character, Gohan or Goten would be more apt.
    Gohan moreso, at least early on. Before Jon's age up.

    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    You got burned by one piece at wano?I can understand fishman island.But,wano?That is just wierd.Especially,since zoro is smack dab in the middle of the conflict.Ever since zhou,one piece has been awesome for me.People's preferences i guess.I am a luffy fan all the way.I like sanji as well.Zoro is big cliche for me.
    My biggest issue with Oda, is that he makes arcs go on way too long. Unnecessarily at times too. Some of the arcs just got to the point where I wanted them to end, but they just wouldn't.

  13. #133
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackalope89 View Post
    My biggest issue with Oda, is that he makes arcs go on way too long. Unnecessarily at times too. Some of the arcs just got to the point where I wanted them to end, but they just wouldn't.
    Yeah!i guess pacing can be an issue.Especially if you are an anime only viewer.But then,one piece was always slow.with pro being that It is fleshed out.For me,it is fun ride and adventure .A world to get lost in with all kinds of people,when you have a spare moment.I usally,had this binge reading thing with one piece.I take break.i was hooked to the romance and the adventure itself than some payoff.So i never felt pacing problem from the get go.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 01-17-2021 at 11:29 PM.
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  14. #134
    Ultimate Member Jackalope89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manwhohaseverything View Post
    Yeah!i guess pacing can be an issue.Especially if you are an anime only viewer.But then,one piece was always slow.with pro being that It is fleshed out.For me,it is fun ride and adventure .A world to get lost in with all kinds of people,when you have a spare moment.I usally,had this binge reading thing with one piece.I take break.i was hooked to the romance and the adventure itself than some payoff.So i never felt pacing problem from the get go.
    Oh, I gave up on the anime back when the Marineford arc was going. Not to mention, I'm a binge reader too.

  15. #135
    Ultimate Member sifighter's Avatar
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    I’m not afraid to say that Jon was a better Superman in the DCeased Dead Planet finale then he was in Superman of Metropolis. He gets a lot of good moments in it.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
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