House of Almerac Maxima Appreciation 2021

[Tzigone]

I want to say Almerac's established as using cloning technology and gene manipulation (but I don't recall the story that said it so I could be wrong), but as far as failed Kryptonian clones go I doubt Maxima would put much stock in earth's efforts and Conner. Compared to what Almerac can do, earth's cloning tech is likely incredibly primitive.

I meant that in regards to Maxima II as both Superman's offspring and a disappointment, not Kon.

[Robanker]

How important is it to each of you that the emnity remain long-term? I hadn't really thought as much about it before - it really depends on the role you want her to have (and whether she's on Earth or not as you kind of need an excuse for her not going back to home planet, IMO)

I think she considers him the way many do a failed relationship (even though they weren't in one, I think Max probably would view everything as an extension of herself or Almerac) so she probably wouldn't have any active hatred for him... But he could press her buttons more effectively than most. Like if he sent her a Christmas card of his family including his son? She'd take it as a dig at her. But does she think of him as some ******* who spurned her? Not really. He's more the one who got away and she has more important things to do than devote time or energy to that... But Max is petty and can hold a grudge. I think she could be driven to anger if something was dug up, but it'd have to be instigated-- she doesn't knowingly have any resentment. Any she still holds would be over her pride if anything. It's not "someone else can't have him" so much as "oh, so you're going to be smug about having offspring, are you? Saying I'm not good enough? Almerac isn't good enough?" It's not so much about jealousy as it is about her pride in herself and Almerac. Everything with Maxima is about how it relates to her or Almerac, at least in my pitch, and that's where the central drama with her daughter would come into play.

I don't like the idea for cloning because, yeah, it makes the entire "give me babies" thing moot and then Nu Max has no reason to exist since her entire character is predicated on coming from a dynasty of breeders and she's gay with no desire to breed. It's incongruous with how Almerac is established. More importantly, it makes OG Max come across as some sex-crazed looney who could have stolen some of Clark's DNA but was chasing him for months at least to get him to shag her instead. Bad look in the 90s and bad look now. I'm not saying her trying to have his kid is going to win any feminism awards, but not every character (especially villains) needs to be a perfectly upstanding, moral creature and a lot of Max's motivation does come from her desire to strengthen their empire through admittedly barbaric means. Perhaps rudimentary gene manipulation is fine, so they could ensure normally incompatible DNA strains may bond more effectively and generate offspring between normally incompatible species... But I don't like the idea of them just being able to slam DNA together and create life because it more or less invalidates the one constant about Almerac we know about.

[Thor-Ul]

I think she considers him the way many do a failed relationship (even though they weren't in one, I think Max probably would view everything as an extension of herself or Almerac) so she probably wouldn't have any active hatred for him... But he could press her buttons more effectively than most. Like if he sent her a Christmas card of his family including his son? She'd take it as a dig at her. But does she think of him as some ******* who spurned her? Not really. He's more the one who got away and she has more important things to do than devote time or energy to that... But Max is petty and can hold a grudge. I think she could be driven to anger if something was dug up, but it'd have to be instigated-- she doesn't knowingly have any resentment. Any she still holds would be over her pride if anything. It's not "someone else can't have him" so much as "oh, so you're going to be smug about having offspring, are you? Saying I'm not good enough? Almerac isn't good enough?" It's not so much about jealousy as it is about her pride in herself and Almerac. Everything with Maxima is about how it relates to her or Almerac, at least in my pitch, and that's where the central drama with her daughter would come into play.

But this aspect of her personality is born from a sense of responsability or it comes from a narcisistic attittude? She considers Almerac as something she have to protect or is for her a personal propierty, along with his inhabitants? I mean, Max is indeed a ruler and the stronger from her world, used to get what she wants, whatever it was, because, for her it was always it was her right. But with Superman she found someone who tells her no and don't kneel to her will, he was her first defeat. And that was a wound for her ego and even make her look weak before others candidates for the throne...
You know, it is right. Almerac could be potentialy be a good take of game of thrones in space, with a leader who could be considered a gray character, either hero, antihero or occasional villian, akin to Namor and Black Adam.

[Robanker]

But this aspect of her personality is born from a sense of responsability or it comes from a narcisistic attittude? She considers Almerac as something she have to protect or is for her a personal propierty, along with his inhabitants? I mean, Max is indeed a ruler and the stronger from her world, used to get what she wants, whatever it was, because, for her it was always it was her right. But with Superman she found someone who tells her no and don't kneel to her will, he was her first defeat. And that was a wound for her ego and even make her look weak before others candidates for the throne...
You know, it is right. Almerac could be potentialy be a good take of game of thrones in space, with a leader who could be considered a gray character, either hero, antihero or occasional villian, akin to Namor and Black Adam.

It's both. She was raised since birth knowing she was a cut above all the peasantry, she comes from a seat of power and inherits it and she never lost. It's as much about her pride in herself and from her position as Almerac's monarch.

[Will Evans]

Maxima making simulacra was always a power of hers.

Just make it so that new lesbian Maxima is her strongest simulacra that gained independence and sentience and broke free from her.

Now you have younger and older Maxima explained.

[Prime]

I just literally googled "Maxima DC" and it showed that classic Maxima talking about Maxima. So I assume they are related right?

[Robanker]

I just literally googled "Maxima DC" and it showed that classic Maxima talking about Maxima. So I assume they are related right?

Orlando, seemingly tired of people asking about OG Max, had someone who resembled Old Max show up, whine about being the real Maxima and getting sent away in the same issue of Supergirl. It was pretty much a "suck it, fanboys. Your Max is gone."

[Ascended]

It's both. She was raised since birth knowing she was a cut above all the peasantry, she comes from a seat of power and inherits it and she never lost. It's as much about her pride in herself and from her position as Almerac's monarch.

Took the words right out of my mouth.

As for the cloning thing....I agree that it does put a weird strain on the breeding angle, and I might be misremembering Almerac using cloning tech to begin with. Though it would also depend on how extensive their cloning tech is; it might not be at the "I got some of Superman's spit on this napkin, now put his baby in a tube!" level. There might also just be some cultural bias involved; maybe they believe clones are only good for a work/labor force, or don't have souls, or can't be trusted, or whatever. Not just anybody gets to be a royal, and maybe clones aren't a viable option for Maxima while the peasantry are able to make use of them. I know I've read something about this but I'd have to dig to find it.

But Almerac does definitely engage in some genetic manipulation/enhancement, I'm (mostly) positive I remember that part right, and it's used in the royal breeding program (pretty sure, anyway).

[Robanker]

Took the words right out of my mouth.

As for the cloning thing....I agree that it does put a weird strain on the breeding angle, and I might be misremembering Almerac using cloning tech to begin with. Though it would also depend on how extensive their cloning tech is; it might not be at the "I got some of Superman's spit on this napkin, now put his baby in a tube!" level. There might also just be some cultural bias involved; maybe they believe clones are only good for a work/labor force, or don't have souls, or can't be trusted, or whatever. Not just anybody gets to be a royal, and maybe clones aren't a viable option for Maxima while the peasantry are able to make use of them. I know I've read something about this but I'd have to dig to find it.

But Almerac does definitely engage in some genetic manipulation/enhancement, I'm (mostly) positive I remember that part right, and it's used in the royal breeding program (pretty sure, anyway).

I like the idea of them embracing genetic manipulation (especially to nurture naturally unstable reproductions in their twisted tradition) but cloning... Maybe something rudimentary but not sophisticated enough to create life... Like organs and possibly replacement limbs to graft on for wounded soldiers. It can't be a total hellscape, after all.

I'll be honest, my pitch is pretty much a big retcon and rebuild, but ultimately I just think any way you slice it, cloning has to be dealt with delicately on Almerac or their culture breaks... Hey, maybe that's a tool for the insurgency to use...

Sidebar, I've talked about design immutables and Max's (like Red Sonja) to me revolves around her hair. The same way Sonja never looks right of her hair isn't either in motion or a bit unkempt, Max looks wrong if her hair isn't HUGE, and ideally wavy or curly. I was looking at Nu Max and more than anything else, that's the part of her design that's missing. She's got the right hair color, her costume isn't too far from a Max costume, yeah she's orange but really it's the hair.

Okay and the scowl.

I wish I liked Nu Max more but she really does feel like Maxima in name only.

[Eyeswithoutaface]

If we go with the Minimax as daughter of Superman, you are forgetting than there is no need of intimate relationship to conceive an offspring. Ask Conner Kent. An space civilization like Almerac could had left behind natural gestation centuries ago. Maybe Maxima even never was pregnant and every almeracian is born from gestation chambers. (We don't know too much about Almerac, to be honest). Maybe Maxima got a blood sample of Superman to create her heir who has been a dissapointment and now needs a new sample.

I think it's a fair point that an advanced civilization like Almerac would be familiar with how technology can provide an alternative answer for continuing the bloodline. However, Almeracians are fans of technology up to a certain point.

- We know for example that bearing children is something sacred on Almerac based on Maxima's reaction to Star Sapphire giving birth. So by chance, the matriarchal component of the star-spanning empire has proven to be a successful adaptation to the environments that they take over. Gestation chambers or birthing matrix technology would certainly be viewed with major skepticism because it's relatively unproven over a long period of time.
- Maxima mentioned that her own line extends back over thousands of years as her family forged a rich empire throughout their galaxy. The science that has been a key to the success of Almerac is much heavier on the evolutionary biology side and through selective breeding.
- Part of the mating selection process involves a longstanding convention of having prospects duel to the death without a lot of advanced weaponry, so physical strength and endurance are preferred traits. Maxima's reaction to Superman's gladiatorial feats in Mongul's Warworld follows that pattern. When Maxima first propositioned Superman in Action Comics, and when Ultraa showed up in Justice League Quarterly, Maxima talked a lot about how Almeracians prioritized fecundity and rich genetic stock.

By contrast, the archenemy of the Almeracians are the Krenon who have no qualms with using any kind of technology as a means to adapt. The Krenon provide a challenge to the Almeracians' conception of power and strength because they prefer more devious forms of warfare rather than straightforward combat. De'Cine, the prince of Kreno who was arranged to marry Maxima in two separate story-lines to bring about a tenuous alliance between Almerac and Kreno is a good example. Even though De'Cine was at the head of a powerful empire, Maxima instinctively loathed the grotesquely misshapen Prince of Kreno. Meanwhile, De'Cine's real plot was to use Almerac's custom of selecting a worthy mate against them by marrying Maxima to undermine the Almeracian establishment.

[Thor-Ul]

Maxima making simulacra was always a power of hers.

Just make it so that new lesbian Maxima is her strongest simulacra that gained independence and sentience and broke free from her.

Now you have younger and older Maxima explained.

That could be the easist (and better) explanation. But I don't need to explain why also is a risky one.

Orlando, seemingly tired of people asking about OG Max, had someone who resembled Old Max show up, whine about being the real Maxima and getting sent away in the same issue of Supergirl. It was pretty much a "suck it, fanboys. Your Max is gone."

Oh, yes, he double down on Minimax as the real Maxima on every book he wrote. I don't like to use the concept, but it seemed like a personal agenda for him to stablish.

I think it's a fair point that an advanced civilization like Almerac would be familiar with how technology can provide an alternative answer for continuing the bloodline. However, Almeracians are fans of technology up to a certain point.

- We know for example that bearing children is something sacred on Almerac based on Maxima's reaction to Star Sapphire giving birth. So by chance, the matriarchal component of the star-spanning empire has proven to be a successful adaptation to the environments that they take over. Gestation chambers or birthing matrix technology would certainly be viewed with major skepticism because it's relatively unproven over a long period of time.
- Maxima mentioned that her own line extends back over thousands of years as her family forged a rich empire throughout their galaxy. The science that has been a key to the success of Almerac is much heavier on the evolutionary biology side and through selective breeding.
- Part of the mating selection process involves a longstanding convention of having prospects duel to the death without a lot of advanced weaponry, so physical strength and endurance are preferred traits. Maxima's reaction to Superman's gladiatorial feats in Mongul's Warworld follows that pattern. When Maxima first propositioned Superman in Action Comics, and when Ultraa showed up in Justice League Quarterly, Maxima talked a lot about how Almeracians prioritized fecundity and rich genetic stock.

By contrast, the archenemy of the Almeracians are the Krenon who have no qualms with using any kind of technology as a means to adapt. The Krenon provide a challenge to the Almeracians' conception of power and strength because they prefer more devious forms of warfare rather than straightforward combat. De'Cine, the prince of Kreno who was arranged to marry Maxima in two separate story-lines to bring about a tenuous alliance between Almerac and Kreno is a good example. Even though De'Cine was at the head of a powerful empire, Maxima instinctively loathed the grotesquely misshapen Prince of Kreno. Meanwhile, De'Cine's real plot was to use Almerac's custom of selecting a worthy mate against them by marrying Maxima to undermine the Almeracian establishment.

I remember the appearance of De'Cine on the Armaggedon annual, but not another appearance. I need to check that.
ANd considering than the gladiatorial aspect of Superman is going to be seen again, wouold had been an excellent way to reintroduce the more classic version of Maxima.

[Robanker]

Yeah, Orlando really did just want to make sure his Maxima was the only one who mattered and how dare anyone want the OG back.

[Prime]

Orlando, seemingly tired of people asking about OG Max, had someone who resembled Old Max show up, whine about being the real Maxima and getting sent away in the same issue of Supergirl. It was pretty much a "suck it, fanboys. Your Max is gone."

Wait what? They'd seriously pulled that ah*t?? What kind of bs is that?

[Prime]

Yeah, Orlando really did just want to make sure his Maxima was the only one who mattered and how dare anyone want the OG back.

Hmm they could always retcon that anyway?

[Robanker]

Wait what? They'd seriously pulled that ah*t?? What kind of bs is that?

Welcome to character shilling, bud.

Hmm they could always retcon that anyway?

They could but Nu Max has to stay. Erasing one of your lesbian characters to reinstate a heterosexual one who was demanding the male protagonist's baby is a minefield the company wants to avoid. Hell, that creator would get ripped apart on Twitter alone. It's why all my plans for Max, should I ever get to work on her (I won't) involve Nu Max.