Natasha Romanov: Black Widow Appreciation 2021

[OOTCS]

I think that right now, Bucky and Natasha are at the same point in their relationship that Bobbi and Clint were at the end of Widowmaker -- they're not together, but they're still close, and they both acknowledged that the feelings were still there, but it just wasn't the right time. It's basically up to whichever creative team comes next to decide what they want to do with the characters. In Bobbi and Clint's case, Clint was picked up by Fraction, who turned him into the kind of person who doesn't really do relationships, and he hasn't quite recovered from that. Kelly Thompson is still writing Natasha for at least another arc or two, and the vibe I got from this arc was that she doesn't want to write Nat in a romantic relationship right now. (Not to mention the fact that she said something in an interview a few days ago implying that she didn't want to tie Natasha exclusively to either Bucky or Clint.) We'll see what happens 1-3 years down the line.

spoilers:

Furthermore she literally told Bucky in his face that the guy she was brainwashed into loving for three months made her feel emotions she never experienced before. That's obviously including her relationship with Bucky.

end of spoilers

I'm pretty sure she was talking about the baby, not the guy (or at least not independently of his relationship to her via the baby). Although they didn't acknowledge the fact that Natasha had a stillborn daughter back in the 40s and that she still thinks about her.

[SlimJ87D]

I actually got the opposite out of their dialogue. To me this was spoilers:

their official break-up. Didn't she tell him she would blame him for taking her family from her whenever she sees him, albeit knowing it's not his fault? I interpreted that as them parting ways for some time. Furthermore she literally told Bucky in his face that the guy she was brainwashed into loving for three months made her feel emotions she never experienced before. That's obviously including her relationship with Bucky. Would she tell him that if she wanted to resume their relationship? The ending also indicates she's going solo with Yelena as her sidekick.

end of spoilers

Due to the delays caused by the pandemic I don't think we can really tell how appearances in different books are supposed to relate to timewise. That said I don't think Coates had informations about what would happen in Natasha's book when he wrote his arc, so I wouldn't read too much into rather unimportant cameos in his book. His run clearly takes inspiration from Brubaker's run so my guess is that he's using more or less the same supporting cast without intending bigger implications for the wider MU for them.

The way I read it is she just needs time.

At some point she's going to have to realize those were programmed memories and that happiness is false. Just like when people take the drug ecstasy and get a extreme rush of dopamine, it's a fake artificial happiness.

Nat was probably only happy because she had a entire fake story and life where she was a normal person and.had no BW background. But again, all that is fake happiness.

I agree with you about the inconsistencies between different books, but at least other writers still make them a important part in each other's lives. Bucky has appeared in nearly every solo run she has had, so he's definitely one of her normal supporters and cast members now.

To me I think they're on a break so that she can mourn.

[chicago_bastard]

I'm pretty sure she was talking about the baby, not the guy (or at least not independently of his relationship to her via the baby). Although they didn't acknowledge the fact that Natasha had a stillborn daughter back in the 40s and that she still thinks about her.

Yeah she's using the plural so she means both of them but that doesn't change the point that their loss is the most devastating thing that happened to her according to Kelly's dialogue. I mean she had lost Bucky before, so that speaks volumes.

The way I read it is she just needs time.

At some point she's going to have to realize those were programmed memories and that happiness is false. Just like when people take the drug ecstasy and get a extreme rush of dopamine, it's a fake artificial happiness.

Nat was probably only happy because she had a entire fake story and life where she was a normal person and.had no BW background. But again, all that is fake happiness.

I agree with you about the inconsistencies between different books, but at least other writers still make them a important part in each other's lives. Bucky has appeared in nearly every solo run she has had, so he's definitely one of her normal supporters and cast members now.

To me I think they're on a break so that she can mourn.

I have the feeling that Kelly Thompson is dead serious about Nat truly loving this fake family more than anything else and won't let her come to the conclusion you mentioned, so as long as Kelly stays on the book I doubt that we'll see Nat in a relationship with Bucky or someone else.

[Matternativ]

I'm more than happy with at least one arc that doesn't deal with that stuff at all tbh.

To me the dialogue read more like a "goodbye" than anything else, really and then there is the part were Thompson came up with hers and Clint's daughter Katie so if she was to make a definite call on this I doubt it would end in Bucky's favour but I very much doubt she will make such a call in the first place.
I don't really have a horse in that race anyway.
I like her and Clint as a team but I'm take it or leave it on the romance and I don't at all care what's happening between her and the Buckster.

What IS important to me is that it seems we'll get Nat being on the heroic path again going forward.
I always preferred her as Avenger over her as a Punisher lite.

[jebsib]

Is this still a clone of the original Natasha - who died during Secret Empire?

[OOTCS]

Is this still a clone of the original Natasha - who died during Secret Empire?

Yes. Going forward, assume that's the case.

As far as relationships go, I doubt the writer of a particular book has the final say on what long-term relationships to put their characters into when it comes to high-profile characters like the Black Widow, especially ones who are currently featuring in the MCU.

[chicago_bastard]

I'm more than happy with at least one arc that doesn't deal with that stuff at all tbh.

To me the dialogue read more like a "goodbye" than anything else, really and then there is the part were Thompson came up with hers and Clint's daughter Katie so if she was to make a definite call on this I doubt it would end in Bucky's favour but I very much doubt she will make such a call in the first place.
I don't really have a horse in that race anyway.
I like her and Clint as a team but I'm take it or leave it on the romance and I don't at all care what's happening between her and the Buckster.

What IS important to me is that it seems we'll get Nat being on the heroic path again going forward.
I always preferred her as Avenger over her as a Punisher lite.

Best solution for that Nat shipper war would be that Bucky and Clint get together at last. I mean that constant banter clearly indicates hidden emotions between them

Meanwhile Kelly talked about the new villain for the next arc: https://comicbook.com/comics/news/bl...elly-thompson/

Not excited. One of the best female villains of the MU was totally wasted in the first arc and now we get some nobody who will most likely turn out forgettable.

[SlimJ87D]

Yeah she's using the plural so she means both of them but that doesn't change the point that their loss is the most devastating thing that happened to her according to Kelly's dialogue. I mean she had lost Bucky before, so that speaks volumes.



I have the feeling that Kelly Thompson is dead serious about Nat truly loving this fake family more than anything else and won't let her come to the conclusion you mentioned, so as long as Kelly stays on the book I doubt that we'll see Nat in a relationship with Bucky or someone else.

I'm not trying to guess what Kelly will do in her story, just reflecting on the current situation and how I feel about it.

She can care and feel for them, but that doesn't change the fact that a false memory and programming is just a band-aid to escape her reality. There's no going back to living that fake life unless if she can wipe her memories of her past life which is again, another band-aid.

[Godlike13]

Interesting start to a series, but I see what it did. It cleaned the slate and established a new motivation going forward. I dug it. It also gave some closure to Bucky and Nat but left it open enough for others to revisit. Leaning on the tragedy of it by making Bucky her sin eater.

[Matternativ]

Is this still a clone of the original Natasha - who died during Secret Empire?

Of course.

Yes. Going forward, assume that's the case.

As far as relationships go, I doubt the writer of a particular book has the final say on what long-term relationships to put their characters into when it comes to high-profile characters like the Black Widow, especially ones who are currently featuring in the MCU.

That was my default interpretation of how that works but then you have stuff like Hopeless run on Spider-woman where Jess got a child and partner which she got to keep.

Best solution for that Nat shipper war would be that Bucky and Clint get together at last. I mean that constant banter clearly indicates hidden emotions between them

Meanwhile Kelly talked about the new villain for the next arc: https://comicbook.com/comics/news/bl...elly-thompson/

Not excited. One of the best female villains of the MU was totally wasted in the first arc and now we get some nobody who will most likely turn out forgettable.

That seems to be popular thing on twitter at least haha.

Inb4 it's actually Bobby and Bucky who are meant to be

To bring it back to Tasha:

I actually like the new villain so far.
If Thompson succeeds in conveying that cult leader personality vibe all is set for a fresh and more unique black widow tale.

[SlimJ87D]

Interesting start to a series, but I see what it did. It cleaned the slate and established a new motivation going forward. I dug it. It also gave some closure to Bucky and Nat but left open enough for others to revisit. Leaning on the tragedy of it by making Bucky her sin eater.

I didn't read it as closure, it didn't read like she burned a bridge, she's going through all these thoughts following the stages of depression. Near the end, Bucky points out to her that she needs to allow herself to process these things because she hasn't taken that time.

But I don't see how someone going through the shock that she's currently going through can come to any rational closure about anything. Edit: Even Nat knows that, based off of the dialogue I copied below. End Edit.

If anything, I think it showed how important Bucky is to her. He's been continuously watching over her even after their relationship ended due to a mind wipe of him. And she trusted and relied on him to keep one of her biggest secrets.

What that showed me wasn't closure, it was a "hey let me process this all before we can discuss what 'we' are."

Edit: Lets highlight some key dialogue that happened here.

Bucky: ... But there are times when I cling to the hope that someday you and I--

Natasha: I know. Me too... Maybe someday I'll feel differently about us, about everything. but right now all I can see is them.

Bucky follows up by pointing out to her that she needs to actually take time to mourn to start the healing process, and she allows herself to start just that.

[Godlike13]

While it didn’t burn the bridge, I think it did close it for this series. At least for the time being. I believe that was the intent. She didn’t kill it, but it did establish a position for the time being. They are having Nat start fresh. They culled the old villains, settled things with previous love interest, and are launching her on a new path, with a new motivation, and a new look even.

[Frontier]

I just realized that the status quo of Natasha and Yelena working together matches the movie dynamic.

[SlimJ87D]

While it didn’t burn the bridge, I think it did close it for this series. At least for the time being. I believe that was the intent. She didn’t kill it, but it did establish a position for the time being. They are having Nat start fresh. They culled the old villains, settled things with previous love interest, and are launching her on a new path, with a new motivation, and a new look even.

Yeah, but as comic readers we know that revamping characters with new volumes and issue #1s happens a lot in comics XD.

I just realized that the status quo of Natasha and Yelena working together matches the movie dynamic.

Cinergy... A Disney made term.

[Darthfury78]

I think that right now, Bucky and Natasha are at the same point in their relationship that Bobbi and Clint were at the end of Widowmaker -- they're not together, but they're still close, and they both acknowledged that the feelings were still there, but it just wasn't the right time. It's basically up to whichever creative team comes next to decide what they want to do with the characters. In Bobbi and Clint's case, Clint was picked up by Fraction, who turned him into the kind of person who doesn't really do relationships, and he hasn't quite recovered from that. Kelly Thompson is still writing Natasha for at least another arc or two, and the vibe I got from this arc was that she doesn't want to write Nat in a romantic relationship right now. (Not to mention the fact that she said something in an interview a few days ago implying that she didn't want to tie Natasha exclusively to either Bucky or Clint.) We'll see what happens 1-3 years down the line.



I'm pretty sure she was talking about the baby, not the guy (or at least not independently of his relationship to her via the baby). Although they didn't acknowledge the fact that Natasha had a stillborn daughter back in the 40s and that she still thinks about her.

I like to see Kelly Thompson do a Spider-Man and Black Widow story arc that would tie into Madam Hydra...