Doctor Doom Appreciation - 2021

[xcoijoi]

"But I have learned that any theory I may come up with will certainly turn out to be wrong"

You're way ahead of most people, who take their predictions too seriously, conveniently forget when they were wrong, and have vivid memories of the times they got it exactly right.

[Iron Maiden]

Yes, I was thinking of pre-Doom Victor. But I don’t think of him as the mastermind behind Westview, he could be introduced as a positive character, or better one of those characters that, yes, they help the heroes, but you can feel there’s something unsettling about them, that they might have some hidden personal agenda.

It would be a way of presenting the new big villain in a different way from both Loki and Thanos. Doom’s evolution could take place over several films, and an appearance in WandaVision could lead to a larger role in, for example, Black Panther 2 (I say Black Panther because it’s the movie that could most likely tack on politics and introduce Latveria). And it would be a great way to introduce the Fantastic Four, without having a family member on the screen so soon after the announcement of their own movie. Because I think Marvel is concentrating more on the FF than the X-men.

And let's not forget that Doom is a public figure on Earth, he is a head of state. He can't appear out of nowhere like Thanos did.

I think part of the problem is the MCU has existed for the movie audience for over a decade now. IMO you have a problem trying to fit Doom is because there has been no sign of him so far, and the Fantastic Four themselves. I still favor the idea that they were a part of the MCU but when Iron Man kicks things off , they have all been MIA for a while. They could do the reveal much as you say, dropping mentions and clues here and there. But I want them to arrive in the MCU in their current versions, already at full power so to speak.

I have to go back to the way we are given the backstory of "Keyser Sose" quite effectively in "The Usual Suspects".

[Reviresco]

Target has reduced the price of their Mystery Box Fantastic Four figures to $1.76, if they have any left. I picked up like 8 boxes at one Target and the other one in town didn't have any left. I got a Doctor Doom!



Also got two of the Target exclusive cursed RICHAAAAAARDS!

[Iron Maiden]

Congratulations! The Targets and Gamestops in my area have been cleaned out since last fall. So there were people other than myself looking for these! The only one I never got was the little Moloid guy. Today I just ordered the God Emperor Doom from my local Gamestop and they say it may arrive in June. I was tempted by the green speedo Marvel Legends Namor I saw at the FYE store at the mall. I have to be on the lookout for Zombie Doom Funko too. I picked up Wandavision Vision with his Halloween costume. Pretty soon they will be taking over my house!

I have variants of Sue, Ben and Johnny but they aren't in this picture. They kind of align with my Fantastic Four regular sized Funkos



Here are all the Funko Doom's I have



And here's a group shot without the mini Doom variant

[K7P5V]

Bogdanove before his art became too ugly to bare.

I hope you don't think this rendition is ugly...

[CaptCleghorn]

Iron maiden needs to clean out her mailbox so I can IM her something truly awesome!

[Iron Maiden]

Oh thanks for letting me know. I forget to clear out the old stuff sometimes. I made some room now

[Doom'nGloom]

A thought just occurred to me thinking about Cantwell's planned second arc. If Doom was on his death bed with no way of survival would he swallow his pride and make a somewhat heartfelt apology to the FF for their past clashes or would he try messing with them one last time or would he even care at that point?

[Iron Maiden]

A thought just occurred to me thinking about Cantwell's planned second arc. If Doom was on his death bed with no way of survival would he swallow his pride and make a somewhat heartfelt apology to the FF for their past clashes or would he try messing with them one last time or would he even care at that point?

I think it depends on the circumstances. I was listening to a podcast that Cantwell did a few days ago and he was of the opinion that if Reed died that there would be much weeping on Doom's part. I don't know if it would be that extreme but I think some part of him wants Reed's respect.

There was that mini series last year Avengers of the Wasteland that had a plot as you describe. SPOILERS ahead if you haven't read it...

IIRC this takes place in that alternate future of Old Man Logan. Doom is going around causing all sorts of death and destruction and there is a group of heroes that get together to stop him It turns out that Doom has inoperable, terminal cancer and he is provoking a response with his actions because he wants to die fighting and not waste away from the disease. I could see Doom desiring such a death if were dying but I don't think he would give Reed the satisfaction. I doubt Reed would or the FF themselves use lethal force anyway.

IMO there would have to a long journey for Doom's character before he could get to the point where he would forgive Reed in his own mind. And only then would he realize that he needs to also make restitution to Reed, Sue, Ben and Johnny. . It would be done in a gesture like perhaps . Reed doesn't need any money but it could be something personal. Perhaps one day, maybe a year after Doom's death a Latverian official would arrive to announce that he is supervising a delivery from the Latverian embassy. Maybe he could give his priceless art collection to them with no strings attached to do with what they wish, perhaps donate it to a museum or sell it and give the money to a charity of their choice. I was also thinking he could transfer the deed to his castle in upstate New York, the place where they had their first confrontation with "Doctor Doom". He's have to have it refurbished, fortified and assure them that there are no booby traps of course. It could be a sanctuary for the family when they want to have some privacy. He did have a villa in the south of France that we saw in Infamous Iron Man. That could be another option instead.

[CaptCleghorn]

IIRC this takes place in that alternate future of Old Man Logan. Doom is going around causing all sorts of death and destruction and there is a group of heroes that get together to stop him It turns out that Doom has inoperable, terminal cancer and he is provoking a response with his actions because he wants to die fighting and not waste away from the disease. I could see Doom desiring such a death if were dying but I don't think he would give Reed the satisfaction. I doubt Reed would or the FF themselves use lethal force anyway.

I'm pretty sure Doom would foresee the FF refusing to kill. Doom, on the other hand, could have a plan that the FF would need to stop him using enough force to NOT kill a healthy Doom, but that would end an infirm Doom's life. I doubt Doom would want Reed to get full credit for the kill and to not give the cancer credit also. He may rationalize cancer and Richards together being able to end Doom's physical existance.

[Iron Maiden]

I'm pretty sure Doom would foresee the FF refusing to kill. Doom, on the other hand, could have a plan that the FF would need to stop him using enough force to NOT kill a healthy Doom, but that would end an infirm Doom's life. I doubt Doom would want Reed to get full credit for the kill and to not give the cancer credit also. He may rationalize cancer and Richards together being able to end Doom's physical existance.

Or he could see the cancer as some kind of failing or weakness on his part and not even want to admit it.

[Prof.Chaos]

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Finally picked up a HC of Triumph and Torment and finally giving it a reread. I’m not sure if I’m reading too much into it but does anyone have a reason why Doom only heard the call of the Aged Genghis as a whisper while it was described as “loud and true” and even woke up Strange from his sleep and preventive enchantments?

[Iron Maiden]

I always thought it was showing that at that point in time he just wasn't up to Doctor Strange's Sorcerer Supreme level yet. And remember even Strange spent a good deal of time learning from the Ancient One. Doom's skills with the mystic arts were mostly self taught, primarily using his mother's books. He did get some additional training from the magician Cagliostro, as we saw in Iron Man #149 IIRC. There may have been others through the years he was trying to free his mother's soul and we just never saw them on panel. I think the time he spent getting tutored by Stephen helped to get him closer to that level. I would imagine that off panel he probably continued the learning process either by expanding his library of arcana or finding another sorcerer to learn from. And we now he got some lessons from Morgan Le Fey also, during Bendis's Mighty Avengers run.

[Prof.Chaos]

Thanks for the reply! That makes a lot of sense, I keep forgetting how early on Triumph and Torment takes place but also love the groundwork that the story establishes. Love when the Aged Genghis tells the Acolyte the story of how he meet DOOM that his reply was "you actually met the Infamous Doctor Doom..?" which I wonder if Bendis got the "Infamous" title idea from.

[Iron Maiden]

Thanks for the reply! That makes a lot of sense, I keep forgetting how early on Triumph and Torment takes place but also love the groundwork that the story establishes. Love when the Aged Genghis tells the Acolyte the story of how he meet DOOM that his reply was "you actually met the Infamous Doctor Doom..?" which I wonder if Bendis got the "Infamous" title idea from.

You know, I never thought of that. I had to go back and read that page again. I think many writers who tackle the character with their fandom already in tact would have Triumph and Torment in the collection of books. Cantwell and Hickman for sure have brought it up in interviews as part of their resume so to speak.

BTW, to those who have read it already I did finish the prose novel The Harrowing of Doom a few days ago so if anyone wants to discuss it feel free. I will probably post later.