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  1. #2311
    Wanda & Ribrianne~4~Life! CJStriker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Yep. Totally agree with you dude. WandaVision was the perfect vehicle to AVOID all the baggage from the comic books. But no, they had to make Wanda go on yet ANOTHER redemption arc in the MCU. I wouldn't say she was absolutely villainized, but it didn't paint in her in a positive light at all and makes me worry what kind of stuff she's gonna do in Doctor Strange 2. And I love it how in these threads that all of a sudden posters who want Wanda to at least make an effort to make amends for what happened in Westview are now called haters and non-fans!
    Why and Who is calling you haters and non fans?!

    That’s not how things should be discussed when debating between fans that love a character.
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS!
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  2. #2312
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daedra View Post
    I saw it called the burgundy witch costume
    That's a great description! She's the Burgundy Witch. I think it's a beautiful costume.

  3. #2313
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CJStriker View Post
    Why and Who is calling you haters and non fans?!

    That’s not how things should be discussed when debating between fans that love a character.
    Sorry CJStriker, I wasn't talking about you. You definitely haven't implied that I'm a hater and non-fan. All I'm saying is that I WANT Wanda to care about the people of Westview. I'm REALLY hoping she does something to help the folks living there in future MCU installments. It's not as sexy as blasting demons, but it's no less heroic. I thought the show was brilliant in the first eight episodes. Sure it sometimes meandered and outright stalled, but I loved what it was trying to do. I just felt that it didn't really nail the ending. Ironically, the more Marvel-y it got at the end the more the quality started to drop in my opinion. The quality of the VFX started to become hit or miss, the writing got sloppier and the overall design and art direction got corny.

    The design of the Witch cave was super corny and plastic-looking. And Agatha her witch look was also just a bit silly looking with the blown-out hair and crazy eyes. The writing around Wanda being both the hero and villain got confusing and sloppy. As was the writing around Monica randomly getting powers and not really caring about it. Is she still powered now that the Hex is gone? Even with these complaints, I think ONE more episode would have helped immensely. This show really needed it.
    Last edited by Albert1981; 03-08-2021 at 11:03 AM.

  4. #2314
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    I feel the problem was she wasn't perhaps apologetic enough.

  5. #2315
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I feel the problem was she wasn't perhaps apologetic enough.
    Not saying she has to get down on her hands and knees and beg for forgiveness or even turn herself in to SWORD authorities. But that was one weird ending to the show. One I think that damaged it.

  6. #2316
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Not saying she has to get down on her hands and knees and beg for forgiveness or even turn herself in to SWORD authorities. But that was one weird ending to the show. One I think that damaged it.
    yeah, I mean, SWORD itself is crooked, but a general apology towards the town after the battle would be good.

  7. #2317
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    yeah, I mean, SWORD itself is crooked, but a general apology towards the town after the battle would be good.
    Yeah, that would have quieted a lot of criticism about the finale. I think Wanda stopping what she was doing WAS heroic, but I just wish the show didn't make it clear that she KNEW what she was doing. Like I said before, this series tried to make her out to be a hero AND a villain, and it just confused audiences I think. It confused me a lot of the times. And I think A LOT of people watching the show will NOT understand Wanda's last words about Billy and Tommy choosing her to be their mom. It's just too weird. It was too comic book-y.

  8. #2318
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Yeah, that would have quieted a lot of criticism about the finale. I think Wanda stopping what she was doing WAS heroic, but I just wish the show didn't make it clear that she KNEW what she was doing. Like I said before, this series tried to make her out to be a hero AND a villain, and it just confused audiences I think. It confused me a lot of the times. And I think A LOT of people watching the show will NOT understand Wanda's last words about Billy and Tommy choosing her to be their mom. It's just too weird. It was too comic book-y.
    I don't mind the weirdness or comic bookiness. That's what I'm here for! But I agree on the inconsistency of her being villainous and heroic.

  9. #2319
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I don't mind the weirdness or comic bookiness. That's what I'm here for! But I agree on the inconsistency of her being villainous and heroic.
    Oh, I understand that! But as I've posted elsewhere, non-comic book readers will be wondering what the hell did Wanda say that for?! I think the MCU is helped by toning down some of the weirdness. Comic books can be very strange sometimes. The inconsistency of Wanda being a villain and a hero is something they got from the comic books. Something I wish they would have NEVER included in this show. I will say I liked the whole Ship of Theseus conversation. It was interesting and intelligent. Most importantly, it was not pretentious or pompous.

  10. #2320
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I feel the problem was she wasn't perhaps apologetic enough.
    Respectfully, she really explained it very plainly when talking to Monica.

    "It wouldn't make a difference how they see me" (paraphrasing, sorry)

    And, again respectfully, she's not entirely wrong. For many (if not all ) of the Westview Residents, Wanda is their captor and torturer -- and it would be difficult to empathize with her in their position.

    And I believe that since Wanda recognizes this -- that what she did, intentional or not, caused so much pain and grief and fear, she's likely not going to change anyone's mind in that moment -- fresh off of "releasing" them.

    And remember, MCU Wanda is telepathic. She can likely feel how they feel and see into their minds and recognize that its probably for the best that she leave asap than linger as further reminder of their trauma.

    Felt very real to me.

  11. #2321
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    Respectfully, she really explained it very plainly when talking to Monica.

    "It wouldn't make a difference how they see me" (paraphrasing, sorry)

    And, again respectfully, she's not entirely wrong. For many (if not all ) of the Westview Residents, Wanda is their captor and torturer -- and it would be difficult to empathize with her in their position.

    And I believe that since Wanda recognizes this -- that what she did, intentional or not, caused so much pain and grief and fear, she's likely not going to change anyone's mind in that moment -- fresh off of "releasing" them.

    And remember, MCU Wanda is telepathic. She can likely feel how they feel and see into their minds and recognize that its probably for the best that she leave asap than linger as further reminder of their trauma.

    Felt very real to me.
    That's true. I guess I'm wondering what she could do to make things better, but maybe she can't do anything.

  12. #2322
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Im fine with the way the show ended. Wanda has always been flawed. She was introduced as a villian in this franchise. Her actions in CW caused alot of people to get killed and served as the catalyst for the heroes fighting. Her love for Vision helped her start over and was part of her redemption and losing him led to her losing her way. She set things right at the end of this series but still remains very flawed. It makes her human and relatable and I commend the writers for not taking the easy way out with her. She's not all the way good or bad but very much a gray character, albeit broken one

  13. #2323
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    That's true. I guess I'm wondering what she could do to make things better, but maybe she can't do anything.
    At least, not IMMEDIATELY following the restoration of Westview.
    Perhaps somehow someway down the line, but "making things better" with an entire town you inadvertently held captive? Probably a "TOO SOON" moment.

  14. #2324
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fokken View Post
    At least, not IMMEDIATELY following the restoration of Westview.
    Perhaps somehow someway down the line, but "making things better" with an entire town you inadvertently held captive? Probably a "TOO SOON" moment.
    You're right. I feel bad for the residents of Westview, but I'm not sure who could help them.

  15. #2325
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    Im fine with the way the show ended. Wanda has always been flawed. She was introduced as a villian in this franchise. Her actions in CW caused alot of people to get killed and served as the catalyst for the heroes fighting. Her love for Vision helped her start over and was part of her redemption and losing him led to her losing her way. She set things right at the end of this series but still remains very flawed. It makes her human and relatable and I commend the writers for not taking the easy way out with her. She's not all the way good or bad but very much a gray character, albeit broken one
    Well, I still hope they make her a more mature and responsible character in DS2 without letting her fucking shit up for the sake of the narrative of others.
    I kinda hope she became the nuanced take on "dark magic", like power is just power, it depends on the intent of the wielder. Dark magic is more dangerous, thus requiring more mastery and skill.

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