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  1. #4141
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    How does Scott or Hope stay thr same strength when small but become stronger when big?

    I do think rules need to be set for magic, but MCU science can be just as insane.

  2. #4142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Probability010 View Post
    How come Magneto didn’t her what Wanda says about him? He is standing right there and the canopy isn’t even closed yet!

    Maybe he can’t read her speech-bubble because it’s pink
    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    It was if all of the men were talking over Wanda. They gave the pink bubble to the lone woman. Magneto was like, just get out of here, lol.
    Ohhh This is Fun, I am Glad you Enjoyed that Panel and that Scene, Means allot be talking about such moments in Wanda's History that are rarely talked about or even known, it is So Cool!

    AS for that moment, My Guess as to Why Magneto did not hear it is that as I heard long ago, Maybe it was Linkara or someone like him said this, but Comic Book Panels are just moments in time captured for the reader, so by that talk they are still in motion, we just got to use our Imaginations, fill in the blank space to what the followthrew actions are likely.

    So You can see Pietro lowering the Top of the Plane like vechile down and it is likely Wanda said what she said while that was happening and Magneto just did not hear it all cause of that top closing over them, that is my theory.

    But I also like to have fun with an obscure moment like this and think Magneto fully heard Our Wanda and did not say anything to Avoid any more conflict with her and her brother cause he already knows they don't like him, so arguing with ever word with Wanda at times is just futal in the Longrun, Wanda is a Very Open and Opiniated Lady and when she sticks to a view of talk she is not easy to backdown when she is really into it, Love Wanda for that! ;-)
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS!
    I Speak The Words We Made Into MAGIC!
    Let THEIR Power Augment Our OWN! To Strike ONE BLOW From Our HEARTS and SOULS – From ALL THAT WE ARE!
    Let The CALL Go Forth --
    AVENGERS! ASSEMBLE!"


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  3. #4143
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    How does Scott or Hope stay thr same strength when small but become stronger when big?

    I do think rules need to be set for magic, but MCU science can be just as insane.
    Some rules and limitations need to exist, otherwise a character is just reduced to a plot device. Even Reed Richards levels of technology have some basic limitations - if Dr. Doom traps him in a force bubble with nothing but his birthday suit, he's not really going to be able to do much. The same can't necessarily be said of Dr. Strange and the Scarlet Witch. Even "Can do dang near everything" technology still has the basic premise of technology, which comes with all sorts of assumptions and basic rules. Magic, when it's just "Can do dang near everything magic," doesn't have quite the level of assumption attached to it. Leastways when no one bothers to explain even the basic rules. What I'm trying to say is that science fiction can get away with a LOT of things in ways that fantasy can't.
    Last edited by Albert1981; 04-13-2021 at 08:16 PM.

  4. #4144
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    Well, Wanda and Strange have never even shared a scene in the MCU yet, so we can only speculate on their relationship or the differences between his approach to magic and hers.

    What little we know about MCU Wanda's magic is that it's similar to the kind of magic we see on sitcoms like "Bewitched" -- instead of something that's taken seriously with clearly-defined rules, it's just "wave your hands and do stuff" magic, and she doesn't need a formal spell to do it. The limitation is that spells can often backfire, and they can't be fixed once they've been cast.

    Maybe they will create more serious rules for her, or maybe they'll play off the difference between Strange's serious, quasi-scientific magic and her goofy sitcom magic.

    It's just hard to do a serious discussion of magic and its rules in a Scarlet Witch thread, because her powers change definition with literally every writer, and being a fan of the character is accepting that her powers are whatever the plot needs them to be. Her powers aren't unlimited, but they are undefined.

  5. #4145
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    Well, Wanda and Strange have never even shared a scene in the MCU yet, so we can only speculate on their relationship or the differences between his approach to magic and hers.

    What little we know about MCU Wanda's magic is that it's similar to the kind of magic we see on sitcoms like "Bewitched" -- instead of something that's taken seriously with clearly-defined rules, it's just "wave your hands and do stuff" magic, and she doesn't need a formal spell to do it. The limitation is that spells can often backfire, and they can't be fixed once they've been cast.

    Maybe they will create more serious rules for her, or maybe they'll play off the difference between Strange's serious, quasi-scientific magic and her goofy sitcom magic.

    It's just hard to do a serious discussion of magic and its rules in a Scarlet Witch thread, because her powers change definition with literally every writer, and being a fan of the character is accepting that her powers are whatever the plot needs them to be. Her powers aren't unlimited, but they are undefined.
    I think I have a vague understanding of MCU magic. Loki specializes in shapeshifting and illusions (and as Raye reminded me on the Loki thread, that came from artifacts like the Casket and the scepter). Apparently he's copying Wanda and Agatha now by shooting laser beams from his hands (which I think takes away from her magical identity). Doctor Strange is an awesome reality warper due to his exposure to the Dark Dimension. Wanda is basically a baseball pitcher with red fireballs as her fastballs. I pretty much gave up on having Wanda have consistent powers in the comic books. It's just too confusing for me to track down what she did and when she did it. But I think the movies and shows should definitely streamline her abilities. And Strange's. And Loki's. And I think that requires SOME form of a magical system. No matter how vague and ill-defined it might be. I WOULD like to discuss it here, but maybe it wouldn't be appropriate because it is kind of esoteric and probably really boring to a lot of the posters here.
    Last edited by Albert1981; 04-13-2021 at 08:34 PM.

  6. #4146
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    I think the magic in the MCU has so far been at least as fairly defined as the science.

  7. #4147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I think the magic in the MCU has so far been at least as fairly defined as the science.
    So far yes. But I'm wondering will things get outta control in Strange 2. I'm looking forward to the surrealness and trippiness, but if they go overboard things could go south...Fast. I'm somewhat confident in Feige and company because they've been SO tentative in introducing magic into the MCU, so I don't think they will take things too far. But yeah, I've seen plenty of fantasy shows and movies fail because writers didn't know how to portray magic properly. I definitely don't want that happening in the MoM.

  8. #4148
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    I suspect, with how guarded they've been so far, Marvel Studios will be mostly consistent in MoM and beyond. I'm more expecting the weirdness to come from alternate universes than crazy magic.

  9. #4149
    Astonishing Member Albert1981's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I suspect, with how guarded they've been so far, Marvel Studios will be mostly consistent in MoM and beyond. I'm more expecting the weirdness to come from alternate universes than crazy magic.
    Yeah, that's what I'm hoping. The MCU has been pretty grounded thus far. Even in its use of magic. And I think that's a GOOD thing, even though there has been some nerfing going on. It hasn't hurt Loki's, Strange's and Wanda's popularity any...So far.

  10. #4150
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    Well, Pym particles don't seem to have many rules either, tbh.
    Matt Fraction actually explained their full use in his FF run as part of Scott Lang's revenge against Doom for killing Cassie.
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  11. #4151
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    I don't want them to be too nerfed though. Just not too powerful either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ravin' Ray View Post
    Matt Fraction actually explained their full use in his FF run as part of Scott Lang's revenge against Doom for killing Cassie.
    Oh, I haven't read that one. So how do they get stronger?

  12. #4152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albert1981 View Post
    Yeah, that's what I'm hoping. The MCU has been pretty grounded thus far. Even in its use of magic. And I think that's a GOOD thing, even though there has been some nerfing going on. It hasn't hurt Loki's, Strange's and Wanda's popularity any...So far.
    Good to see you Back on the Thread Albert1981, Missed You!

    I honestly feel the MCU has so far done a good job slowing incresing the power levels with each movie and each new project over the years, making bigger and bigger levels of powers seem Mind-Blowing, but not just get out of Jail Free Cards that can do anything just for the plot levels yet. Even with the Infintity Stones, one of the most broken Powers in all Media, they seem to have their limits to a degree as well at times in the MCU and only went as far as to WOW the Imaginations of Viewers and Veteran Fans alike, but did not seem like their powers where all over the place. Their seems to be unspoken and unworded laws given to how power levels of powers seem to work, increasing but not broken yet and that is a delicate line to walk.

    So Far I am not too afraid of the MCU Breaking it with Magic Yet, their seems to be written Laws to how far powers can go and while Wanda is at a point of Major Levels of power, it is limited still by her will, imagination, training and values in how to use them. So Great Powers will seem to come when they are needed I feel but like comics have a way to balance the Universe so that even Street Level Heroes have an important place in the plot and skills the bigger guns don't, the MCU and Comics in general seem to do that well.
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS!
    I Speak The Words We Made Into MAGIC!
    Let THEIR Power Augment Our OWN! To Strike ONE BLOW From Our HEARTS and SOULS – From ALL THAT WE ARE!
    Let The CALL Go Forth --
    AVENGERS! ASSEMBLE!"


    Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff ~~ From Avengers #689!

    Come Join and Learn about Wanda Maximoff at: The Scarlet Witch Appreciation Thread 2021!

  13. #4153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I think the magic in the MCU has so far been at least as fairly defined as the science.
    I like to think of it as Scientific Factors and Equations like phyics and mathmatics are, you build what you can do on Magic on More Lessons and elements of the Universe and what each of those elements can do like Summon Magic Like Doctor Strange or Chaos Magic of Creation by Wanda, each has a power and level of power that is unique to its own Skillset, but has to depend of factors to make them work like Spellbooks, archan objects, spell creation, summoning, ruins and stuff like that and what each can do uniquely to the others.
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS!
    I Speak The Words We Made Into MAGIC!
    Let THEIR Power Augment Our OWN! To Strike ONE BLOW From Our HEARTS and SOULS – From ALL THAT WE ARE!
    Let The CALL Go Forth --
    AVENGERS! ASSEMBLE!"


    Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff ~~ From Avengers #689!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I don't want them to be too nerfed though. Just not too powerful either.


    Oh, I haven't read that one. So how do they get stronger?
    I think when characters are nerfed cause writters fear writing power is when you get worse writing cause those characters don't feel like themselves and are brought downwards to forcefully and the story is to base on those factors then anything else.

    When you have writers and creators not afraid of writting power, it leaves the imaginatoin open to the possiblies on what they can greatly do and not limiting it like the other way I talked about before, the nerfing, but they want to have their stories with power make sense, not just be a few magic words can do anyting as plot armor, so they build structure to these levels and with their imaginations being so free to create, it can be anything but with structure and rules to make it work and feel it has a base to it.
    "By Earth and Sky, By Craft and Hex -- By The Past and The Future – I Call HOPE Forth From The DARKNESS!
    I Speak The Words We Made Into MAGIC!
    Let THEIR Power Augment Our OWN! To Strike ONE BLOW From Our HEARTS and SOULS – From ALL THAT WE ARE!
    Let The CALL Go Forth --
    AVENGERS! ASSEMBLE!"


    Scarlet Witch/Wanda Maximoff ~~ From Avengers #689!

    Come Join and Learn about Wanda Maximoff at: The Scarlet Witch Appreciation Thread 2021!

  15. #4155
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    One idea I think is to have potentially dangerous consequences of characters using extreme power, sorta like what happened in WandaVision. I think it also helps if characters can't use their powers indefinitely, but have to slow down to recharge at some points.

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