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  1. #1096
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    I think the uneven art sabotaged Namor the First Mutant. I don't think we got the announced 'named' artist, Olivetti, whether you like him or not, on more than two issues in row. Artwise, we did get some great covers, with Jae Lee, Mayhew's great Betty Dean WWII cover, and Phil Noto.
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  2. #1097
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doombot View Post
    As much as I love Jae Lee, covers aren't enough for me. When the interior art sucks, which it did, no cover can save the book. I'm glad Lee did those covers, but they're the only memorable thing about that storyline to me. Cynically, imo, turning Tha-Korr into a literal monster instead of a less than ideal King & parent is not the best way to explore that relationship. I wish someone would have made a story with elements that had a more serious look at how Tha-Korr's feelings and attitude would have affected Namor's view of himself and the world.
    I agree the art was mess for the interior, however I feel like the storyline was one of the last few times we got a good focus on Namor/Atlantis with some new worldbuilding for it's time, I really enjoy the implications of magic/blood lines because it's a call back to the Lee/Harras run where the blood of royals was the key to certain kinds of magic. It's not a perfect comic series by any means but I would take it again over Invaders 2019 storyline about Namor which I felt ended really badly, and I was not a fan of Namor trying to change everyone and claiming it was his idea instead it being the manipulations of Machan. For me First Mutant was a sleeper comic, like I had to read it a few times to get a better appreciation for it, bad art can really harm a comic series. However the whole magic system, Krang being a heelturn and thus a constant threat to Namor in court, was certainly something that could have been used as a launch into something better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reviresco View Post
    I think the uneven art sabotaged Namor the First Mutant. I don't think we got the announced 'named' artist, Olivetti, whether you like him or not, on more than two issues in row. Artwise, we did get some great covers, with Jae Lee, Mayhew's great Betty Dean WWII cover, and Phil Noto.
    As we spoke about before Rev, I really feel they only throw Namor a comic series once every 10 years or so just to be able to keep the copyrights or whatever, and I honestly hate how Marvel Office politics affect the comics, I'm willing to bet they tried to bury/hurt the comic before it was even released. I'm just really happy/surprised by how beautiful King in Black was, it's just a comic series that I feel was a great addition to the lore and not to mention I barely had any complaints other than it was too short, lol. I kept hoping it would be picked up for a longer run where we would get more of Namor's adult ongoing adventures.
    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  3. #1098
    Astonishing Member Panic's Avatar
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    Okay guys, if they did a new Namor series, who would be your choice for artist? And what kind of look do you favour for Namor?

  4. #1099
    Mighty Member Thor-El's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panic View Post
    Okay guys, if they did a new Namor series, who would be your choice for artist? And what kind of look do you favour for Namor?
    The look, the one from his iconic cover from the 60s of course, that has inspired the very few available statues and Namor Bowen bust.



    For artist since we cannot have Bill Everett, John Buscema or Gene Colan then someone that will respect and draw that iconic Namor and be faithful to the character without feeling he has to redesign or "improve". I would love to see DC Action Comics and JLA artist Doug Mahnke. Second choice would be Ed McGuinnis, Liam Sharp or Ariel Olivetti.

    My art main influences are Richard Corben, Frank Frazetta and John Buscema. For old school comic book heroes with an edge check out my patreon

  5. #1100
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panic View Post
    Okay guys, if they did a new Namor series, who would be your choice for artist? And what kind of look do you favour for Namor?
    lol, I actually answered this just yesterday so I'm gonna put my same answer here. For a creative team for a ongoing Namor solo series I would have:


    1. Busiek - writer, Dewey & Scharf - art, Farrell - colors , the same team as King in Black: Namor. Seriously if you haven't read that mini series I highly rec it.

    2. Jae Lee - art, Pak - writer, Guimaraes - colors, I would love to see this combination since I enjoyed each of their works.

    3. Anka - art, Simone - writer, Farrell - colors, they would make a great team!

    For these three teams I would want a high stakes underwater story full of Atlantean Court intrigue and mystery, as well as some really moving character moments for Namor and his cast. The most important thing is keeping Namor in the ocean, in atlantis, and building up the underwater mythos, we need lots of old and new supporting cast to come back. There is so much one can do just within the Atlantean court, secret alliances, betrayals, etc. throw in some magic and monsters and you literally can have stories for years.

    I would love covers from many different artists, Alex Ross, Simone Bianchi, etc. but my current dream is for Russell Dauterman to make one of his "all the outfits they ever wore" covers for Namor, like he does with the X-Men.

    4. Becky Cloonan - writing/art - I loved one of their Namor comics and I feel they would do a great job! For Cloonan I would want a remake/update/new Super Villain Team Up, so just a comic series/mini series featuring Doom & Namor being themselves. This would be a more comedy duo/frenemies comic series and I would love a long one but would be happy to get 12ish issues.

    I love their comic in strange tales, so this is really based off of that.




    As for what look I favor for Namor, now I love A LOT of artists, and would be very pleased with anyone so long as it looks good but I think Namor's best modern character design is by Phil Briones from the 2007 mini series. Now that is a Namor I believe could be a fast swimmer and still pack a mean punch. I really enjoyed this series alot however my one major issue was of course the whole Kamar reveal/ending.

    briones.jpg
    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  6. #1101
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El View Post
    The look, the one from his iconic cover from the 60s of course, that has inspired the very few available statues and Namor Bowen bust.



    For artist since we cannot have Bill Everett, John Buscema or Gene Colan then someone that will respect and draw that iconic Namor and be faithful to the character without feeling he has to redesign or "improve". I would love to see DC Action Comics and JLA artist Doug Mahnke. Second choice would be Ed McGuinnis, Liam Sharp or Ariel Olivetti.

    Yes! I love all of these Namor looks. I especially love the last one the most!

    Thor-EL---What a great new Avatar pic! (I know it is one of your Namor figure renditions you create.) Very coolio.
    [Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El 10-15-2020 12:32 PM]


    "Jason Aaron should know there is already a winner of the Phoenix Force and his name is Phoenixx9."

  7. #1102
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImperiusWrecked View Post

    As for what look I favor for Namor, now I love A LOT of artists, and would be very pleased with anyone so long as it looks good but I think Namor's best modern character design is by Phil Briones from the 2007 mini series.

    briones.jpg
    IW, good find. I love this Namor look!
    [Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El 10-15-2020 12:32 PM]


    "Jason Aaron should know there is already a winner of the Phoenix Force and his name is Phoenixx9."

  8. #1103
    Mighty Member Thor-El's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    Yes! I love all of these Namor looks. I especially love the last one the most!

    Thor-EL---What a great new Avatar pic! (I know it is one of your Namor figure renditions you create.) Very coolio.
    Thank you Phoenixx9! The third image is Doug Mahnke's.

    Heres wishing you and all my Atlantean brothers and sisters a Happy Thanksgiving!

    My art main influences are Richard Corben, Frank Frazetta and John Buscema. For old school comic book heroes with an edge check out my patreon

  9. #1104
    Extraordinary Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El View Post
    Thank you Phoenixx9! The third image is Doug Mahnke's.

    Heres wishing you and all my Atlantean brothers and sisters a Happy Thanksgiving!

    Ah, that Doug Mahnke has Namor drawn most excellently.

    Thank you so much! A Happy Thanksgiving to you!

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone!
    [Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El 10-15-2020 12:32 PM]


    "Jason Aaron should know there is already a winner of the Phoenix Force and his name is Phoenixx9."

  10. #1105
    Incredible Member Doombot's Avatar
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    Here's a challenge for the group:

    How do you turn someone onto Sub-Mariner stories and Namor as a character? The hypothetical subject is someone who enjoys comics, but has only been exposed to the general modern era. The oldest books the person will explore are the 90's "Age of Apocalypse". Anything beyond that time is considered "too old" with "crappy art". On top of this, with a narrow view of Marvel history, mostly viewed through the "X-books" the person is generally hostile to Namor, seeing him as the guy who sometimes shows up in X-books and is usually just seen as a pompous asshole. Any other views of Namor are the stereotype of "lame fish-guy with silly wings on his feet." The "classic" greater Marvel Universe of the Fantastic Four, Namor, Invaders etc, is seen as lame and flat, not worth exploring.

    What would you expose this person to? A top 5 reading list?

  11. #1106
    Citizen of Atlantis ImperiusWrecked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doombot View Post
    Here's a challenge for the group:

    How do you turn someone onto Sub-Mariner stories and Namor as a character? The hypothetical subject is someone who enjoys comics, but has only been exposed to the general modern era. The oldest books the person will explore are the 90's "Age of Apocalypse". Anything beyond that time is considered "too old" with "crappy art". On top of this, with a narrow view of Marvel history, mostly viewed through the "X-books" the person is generally hostile to Namor, seeing him as the guy who sometimes shows up in X-books and is usually just seen as a pompous asshole. Any other views of Namor are the stereotype of "lame fish-guy with silly wings on his feet." The "classic" greater Marvel Universe of the Fantastic Four, Namor, Invaders etc, is seen as lame and flat, not worth exploring.

    What would you expose this person to? A top 5 reading list?
    I do this alot with my blogs/accounts, I post regular content of Namor, art, comics, metas, etc. I answer questions from non and anonymous followers/finders of my blog with as much in detail reference to whatever story they are asking about, or character question they ask about with as much real comic references as I can. I act as a resource for all Namor content and make events like Namor week, as well as comic edits/fanvids/fanfics whenever I have time. I do all this because when I got into Namor before finding this community I really had no set place to search for any new or old info about him, so many comic panels I see online were unreferenced so it would take me ages to track down issues etc. I try to be on top of new Namor appearances and let people know whether the book is worth the buy or not so they don't waste money on cameo appearances where he doesn't talk. I've given my top comics in guide lists many times, I created a streamlined important issues to read for every era beginner guide. I hope to keep updating in the future. Also I commission fan art of Namor, namorxcharacter ships from various artists to help boost the fan artist community.



    I generally give them my beginner comic guide but if they asked for top 5 comic recs to learn more about Namor as a character:

    1. Marvels Snapshot: Sub-Mariner (2020)
    2. Sub-Mariner Comics 70th Anniversary Special (2009)
    3. Marvel Comics Presents (1988) #33
    4. Marvel Comics Presents (2019) #1
    5. King in Black: Namor
    "No one should ever question where my allegiance lies." - Namor of Atlantis

  12. #1107
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El View Post
    Heres wishing you and all my Atlantean brothers and sisters a Happy Thanksgiving!

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenixx9 View Post
    Thank you so much! A Happy Thanksgiving to you!

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone!
    Belated Thanksgiving wishes to everyone! Hope everyone had a great holiday.

    LOVE that Scott Kolins panel, Thor-El! Excellent choice!
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  13. #1108
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panic View Post
    Okay guys, if they did a new Namor series, who would be your choice for artist? And what kind of look do you favour for Namor?

    Like Thor-El, I think I appreciate Big John Buscema's Namor the most.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El View Post
    The look, the one from his iconic cover from the 60s of course, that has inspired the very few available statues and Namor Bowen bust.

    I also like this particular era of Jae Lee's Namor. His 90s Namor is a bit too extreme for me and his modern Namor is a bit too ... stylized for me. But this era, from Inhumans and FF1234 and Cap Ice arc is perfect.




    Also love Checcetto's Namor, even if he is a bit emo.



    Basically, I like artists that draw a sleek and sexy Namor. ; p
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  14. #1109
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panic View Post
    Okay guys, if they did a new Namor series, who would be your choice for artist? And what kind of look do you favour for Namor?
    As for who would be my present choice for a new Namor series ... I'd have to think more about that. Besides doing Namor himself justice, I think his book requires someone who can WOW folks with world building, like Carlos Magno -- even if I'm not as fond of his Namor. Plus, it would have to be a name artist to get sales.

    Off the top of my head, I'm going to have to go with a post I saw here years ago ... Mukesh Singh, if he takes his time like in Grant Morrison's 18 Days. His figures are pretty, and his worlds are stunning. How that would translate to comic panels ... I'm not so sure.

    https://mukeshsingh.myportfolio.com/18-days





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  15. #1110
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doombot View Post
    Here's a challenge for the group:

    How do you turn someone onto Sub-Mariner stories and Namor as a character? The hypothetical subject is someone who enjoys comics, but has only been exposed to the general modern era. The oldest books the person will explore are the 90's "Age of Apocalypse". Anything beyond that time is considered "too old" with "crappy art". On top of this, with a narrow view of Marvel history, mostly viewed through the "X-books" the person is generally hostile to Namor, seeing him as the guy who sometimes shows up in X-books and is usually just seen as a pompous asshole. Any other views of Namor are the stereotype of "lame fish-guy with silly wings on his feet." The "classic" greater Marvel Universe of the Fantastic Four, Namor, Invaders etc, is seen as lame and flat, not worth exploring.

    What would you expose this person to? A top 5 reading list?
    Ahhhh! Too many decisions for me.

    Let's see ...

    If this X-fan likes the teen X-books, I'd recommend KiB Namor.

    As X-fans, wouldn't they have been exposed to Kieron Gillen's Namor from his run on the X-books? He was awesome there, if also somewhat ... arrogant.

    The Greg Pak and Fred VanLente Herc arc Atlantis vs Amazons -- just a fun, fun, story.

    While not 616, I'd also recommend Greg Pak's What If Sub-Mariner Were Raised on the Surface World. Very angsty and Outsider.

    I'd also recommend Sub-Mariner Revolution from 2007, even though there are elements I don't care for there.

    Maybe the Illuminati books / series, if only because Namor was constantly in conflict with the same character that the X-Men are, i.e. the Avengers, the FF, etc.
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