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  1. #4216
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sdawg View Post
    I think Claremont said it best when he talked about his criticism of the pair. Without a solo book for Storm (or even a joint book) it's hard to put fair balance that is respectful to both characters.

    Claremont said. "Does Ororo become a supporting character in T’Challa’s book? Does T’Challa become a supporting character in Ororo’s book? How do you strike a balance between them?

    This of course has nothing to do with the shit show that went on related to Storm in the XBooks but it hits back to my original post on why I have issues with the pair. It isn't about the writers.

    Actually, it makes me question, has there ever been a marriage between two powerhouse characters of different brands? I mean, when I think of Scott and Jean, or Reed and Susan, they were in the same book. Any other big pair that I can think of already had their own books and solo support. This is the first situation I can think of like this. Am I wrong?
    I actually didn't understand his point. Does it being "hard" means its not doable? Also what realistic expectations should a reader have when reading a book titled "Black Panther" where Storm is included? To expect her to be the star or not be secondary to me is unrealistic. Also, how does Claremont feel Ororo has been treated in the xbooks? The question i asked you previously regarding a storm defining story was to make the point that hypothetical questions regarding her use in black panther isn't necessary because those points apply to how she has always treated in the xbooks. What story has given storm proper balance that was written by the xoffice?

    She took a backseat to Cyclops and Logan during Schism, she took a backseat to Logan when he was headmaster of the Jean Grey school, when she was leader she was a wreck over Logan so still took a backseat to him there emotionally, she took a backseat to kitty when she turned over leadership of the xmen to her after IvX, she took a backseat to Jean in Xmen Red where Jean used connections specific to storm in working towards making a mutant nation, and now she still is letting Xavier/Magneto direct her place in the world, while recently getting out of a story where she was taking a backseat to kitty/emma. She's been a perpetual supporting character in xmen often times simply just serving as wallpaper adding nothing to the story. So why is it all of a sudden a bad thing when she is in a relationship to T'Challa that her being a supporting character would persist? Its the status quo if we are using her time with the xmen as a standard.

    For me a good writer could make their relationship work. I thought Coates had a healthy balance between the two, she appeared occasionally and she was given nice moments. All in all, I just can't wrap my head around the position they can't work because one would be a support to the other because in the case of ororo that has been her role in the xmen since the early 2000s.
    Last edited by butterflykyss; 05-21-2021 at 12:21 AM.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, THE REGENT OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  2. #4217
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    I actually didn't understand his point. Does it being "hard" means its not doable? Also what realistic expectations should a reader have when reading a book titled "Black Panther" where Storm is included? To expect her to be the star or not be secondary to me is unrealistic. Also, how does Claremont feel Ororo has been treated in the xbooks? The question i asked you previously regarding a storm defining story was to make the point that hypothetical questions regarding her use in black panther isn't necessary because those points apply to how she has always treated in the xbooks. What story has given storm proper balance that was written by the xoffice?

    She took a backseat to Cyclops and Logan during Schism, she took a backseat to Logan when he was headmaster of the Jean Grey school, when she was leader she was a wreck over Logan so still took a backseat to him there, she took a backseat to kitty when she turned over leadership of the xmen to her, she took a backseat to Jean where Jean used connections specific to storm in making her mutant nation, and now she still is letting Xavier/Magneto drive her place in the world, while recently getting out of a storyvwhere she was taking a backseat to kitty/emma. She's been a perpetual supporting character in xmen often times simply just wallpaper adding nothing to the story. So why is it all of a sudden a bad thing when she is in a relationship to T'Challa?

    For me a good writer could make their relationship work. I thought Coates had a healthy balance between the two, she appeared occasionally and she was given nice moments. All in all, I just can't wrap my head around the position they can't work because one would be a support to the other because in the case of ororo that has been her role in the xmen since the early 2000s.
    The point for me is that Storm needs her own space and that if she had her own space it wouldn't be hard. I don't think anyone reads or expects Black Panther to be about Storm. That is exactly what the problem is. Storm needs her own space.

    I clearly understood your reasons for the question and I don't understand why the question was important given the point I was making. I have continuously stated that the X Offices weren't doing what they should have been with the character. I also argue that having Storm's other sole space as a secondary character in BP doesn't fit the type of character she is. I don't know what you think I'm trying to say because you keep trying to hoist up the BP book and point out its role in Storm's development and I have consistently agreed with the point.

    I'm also saying just because you're in one bad relationship doesn't make walking into another bad relationship better. Whether she is a secondary character in XMEN or BP it doesn't work for a character of her status period. I keep saying this. It's not about writers, it's about recognizing her impact as a ICON for the company period lol
    Last edited by Sdawg; 05-21-2021 at 02:14 AM.

  3. #4218
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stormultt Divine View Post
    "More goddess than mutant ".

    Period.
    Claremont wasn't joking when he said pheonix was made to put jean on storms level. He really does believe she is universal level.... We Stan a king believes truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sdawg View Post
    YES! This is my point!
    Like marvel has been given mana by the gods to literally make their most prominent hero a woman of colour they didn't even have to do kivh she is already a very high profile charachter most people know who storm is ar at least can recognise her carol (no offense) was much more interesting as Ms marvel. But I guess that worked out since we got Kamala in the end. Storm has significance she is a cultural icon and she is the most published female comic book charachter of all time. All they need to do is simply push her but, nope! That simply can't be done.

  4. #4219
    Extraordinary Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chief12d View Post
    I think Ewing would do great things with Storm. Not only is there more room to explore Storm's powers in a space setting, but there's also the chance to see her deal with larger threats that test her heart and soul. I'd also want to see how her dynamic with Brand is different from Magneto's.

    Yea and to be clear I don't think all of the books I mentioned are bad. Hellions is great and I like X-Force even though there's no prominent POC characters lol. SWORD is one of my favorite books right now. But let's not act like there's been some seismic shift in how the writers have constructed the current X-Men status quo in terms of diversity. It's still white men at the undisputed top when it comes to narrative and just a bunch of white women and handful of white gay characters thrown in to spruce things up.

    I'm not complaining too much because these are mostly white creators making comics for an audience that's mostly white, I accept this as a fan. But don't insult my intelligence by hyping up your diverse lineups or "big plans" for a non-white character when it's not supported with a history of relevant story influence or consistent focus. That said I trust Hickman but I'm fully prepared for Storm's story to just be whatever she does in Planet-Size.
    very true and i have been pretty much on the same page but i can't even act like we are not in may and have solitics through august and she is not even a member of a team let alone has a direction to go in. Even planet sized x-men whatever happens there seems to be Magneto's idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtynun View Post
    Then do it create a fan comic exploring storm in the way you see her..trust me most storm fans will thank you for it. Sometimes you got to bring the mountain to Mohammed and if the xoffice us just gonna do lipservice we might as well do what we need to do.
    you got a co- writer, lets go.l i usually only show my under 20 minute stuff here.

    myxmexantheon1.jpg
    myxmen.jpg
    marauders1.jpg

    Not a single one of those took me longer than 30 minutes so a script and me actually using reference i can do it quicker and it will look better. i'm an art/business double major in that while i was going to school for business i made sure i took like life drawing, and had enough credits that i could graduate in either field if i wanted. lol. i played it smart kind of since as a child you know you always hear theres no money in art. lol

    Oh and i already own clip studio ex so this baby can be all digitial and ready to go. lol

    some more throw away art.

    nysannemen2.jpg

    shuri1.jpg

    so basically, let's go! lol.

    stormx23.jpg
    nysstorm y1.jpg
    ororojean3.jpg
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    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

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  5. #4220
    Super Moderator Tenebrae's Avatar
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    Constantly talking isn't necessarily communicating

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  6. #4221
    Incredible Member rhaenylis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenebrae View Post
    This is absolutely gorgeous

  7. #4222
    Incredible Member Alphaxman's Avatar
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    I can't get twitter at work (and I don't have twitter) so I can't post the pic, BUT I LOVE IT!!!!!!!
    I wish Adam Kubert's rarely used 2nd Revolution costume wasn't cut off (it one of the gems). Yet Alan Davis' bore - with all of its variants - were rightly cut off.
    In order of love:
    1) Original
    2) Outback
    3) Jim Lee's (silver not white)
    4) Anka (X-Force female X-Men team)
    5) Current
    6) Asgardian Goddess
    7) 2nd Revolution look
    8) Dowson's (Storm limited series)
    9) X-Treme (with braids)
    10) AoA
    11) 1st Revolution look (black and purple)
    12) Punk (Never a fan)
    13) Ultimate
    14) Alan Davis sash with lightning bolt cape
    15) Alan Davis inspired bathing suit
    --) X-Men training uniform
    X) white Astonishing monstrosity
    Last edited by Alphaxman; 05-21-2021 at 08:46 AM.

  8. #4223

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alphaxman View Post
    I can't get twitter at work (and I don't have twitter) so I can't post the pic, BUT I LOVE IT!!!!!!!
    I wish Adam Kubert's rarely used 2nd Revolution costume wasn't cut off (it one of the gems). Yet Alan Davis' bore - with all of its variants - were rightly cut off.
    I agree. That one was neat. Overall this is great though; our gurl looks goodt!
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  9. #4224
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sdawg View Post
    The point for me is that Storm needs her own space and that if she had her own space it wouldn't be hard. I don't think anyone reads or expects Black Panther to be about Storm. That is exactly what the problem is. Storm needs her own space.

    I clearly understood your reasons for the question and I don't understand why the question was important given the point I was making. I have continuously stated that the X Offices weren't doing what they should have been with the character. I also argue that having Storm's other sole space as a secondary character in BP doesn't fit the type of character she is. I don't know what you think I'm trying to say because you keep trying to hoist up the BP book and point out its role in Storm's development and I have consistently agreed with the point.

    I'm also saying just because you're in one bad relationship doesn't make walking into another bad relationship better. Whether she is a secondary character in XMEN or BP it doesn't work for a character of her status period. I keep saying this. It's not about writers, it's about recognizing her impact as a ICON for the company period lol
    1. We agree there. Storm should be and can appear in multiple titles while being allowed her own space. As I've said if Wolverine can manage it why not Storm? Being featured in black panther won't inhibit her from carrying a solo book. What truly inhibits her having her own space are tthe xoffices.


    2. Those questions again were to demonstrate what creators can do with a character if they are interested in doing so. BP creators have managed to give her more development than her home office because they genuinely are invested in the character. What is the xoffice excuse for why we are going into the summer of 2021 and their big plans for storm still haven't materialized? Her sole space should be managed by a solo book, not an xmen team book or appearances she makes in other titles including black panther. That responsibility lies with the xoffices and any excuse for why that hasn't happened other than the X-offices not greenlighting that project is a scapegoat.


    3. Agreed and that comes from management. Her being used in black panther should not inhibit management's decision to support a solo title for her.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, THE REGENT OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  10. #4225
    Extraordinary Member jwatson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenebrae View Post
    That sure is a pretty picture. Made me hit the drawing board.

    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

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  11. #4226
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    So with her being on the variant for sword do we think this is where she will end up?
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, THE REGENT OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  12. #4227
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    So with her being on the variant for sword do we think this is where she will end up?
    it seems that this is where things are going, she already has two variants for S.W.O.R.D, it would be strange if she didn't appear in the book.

  13. #4228
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeraldOfStorm View Post
    it seems that this is where things are going, she already has two variants for S.W.O.R.D, it would be strange if she didn't appear in the book.
    if she doesn't get a solo beung written by al would be the next best thing for me. I forgot about the other variants too thanks.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, THE REGENT OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  14. #4229
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    1. We agree there. Storm should be and can appear in multiple titles while being allowed her own space. As I've said if Wolverine can manage it why not Storm? Being featured in black panther won't inhibit her from carrying a solo book. What truly inhibits her having her own space are tthe xoffices.


    2. Those questions again were to demonstrate what creators can do with a character if they are interested in doing so. BP creators have managed to give her more development than her home office because they genuinely are invested in the character. What is the xoffice excuse for why we are going into the summer of 2021 and their big plans for storm still haven't materialized? Her sole space should be managed by a solo book, not an xmen team book or appearances she makes in other titles including black panther. That responsibility lies with the xoffices and any excuse for why that hasn't happened other than the X-offices not greenlighting that project is a scapegoat.


    3. Agreed and that comes from management. Her being used in black panther should not inhibit management's decision to support a solo title for her.
    I think this is why I'm not understanding this discussion. My point was never about writers creating development for a character. I was only commenting on how the current structure does not fully support Storm in the way that it should regardless of who is writing her and how that creates issues in handling the two powerhouse characters with the care they should receive. My answer to your first question about Coates, and my recognition for his work clearly shows that I believe writers CAN write her well and all other things pertaining to her. But that isn't my issue nor what I was discussing that from the start.

  15. #4230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenebrae View Post
    I love this too. My only issue is that it's the same pose and expression over and over again lol. But that's nitpicking, I do love it.

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