Dick Grayson: Robin/ Nightwing/ Agent 37 Appreciation 2021

[Godlike13]

The basis of their bond is they are brothers and Dick mentored him when Tim was Robin and Tim was a fanboy of Dick's.

Why are they "brothers" though, and what purpose does Tim being a fan of Dick's serve. Remember Tim was coming off of Jason as Robin. Being brothers, Tim being a fan of Dick, none of this is character driven or there to serve Dick. None of that has really done anything for Dick's overall character. We saw more character growth for Dick with Damian then the entirety of Tim existence has done. Those bonds are purposely deigned for the underline purpose of getting Tim over, so that fans didn't reject him like they did Jason. Its all about Dick giving him the A-ok. That is the basis in which those bonds were built.

[WonderNight]

Well it's good seeing dick being his own man in that Batfamily book of his!

[Frontier]

Why are they "brothers" though, and what purpose does Tim being a fan of Dick's serve. Remember Tim was coming off of Jason as Robin. Being brothers, Tim being a fan of Dick, none of this is character driven or there to serve Dick. None of that has really done anything for Dick's overall character. We saw more character growth for Dick with Damian then the entirety of Tim existence has done. Those bonds are purposely deigned for the underline purpose of getting Tim over, so that fans didn't reject him like they did Jason. Its all about Dick giving him the A-ok. That is the basis in which those bonds were built.

I think it serves Dick in the sense of showing a different facets of his character and how he inspires people and what he's like with a little brother and mentoring the next Robin.

The dynamic with Damian is different but equally valid.

I think it is the opposite. Most characters that appear as much as Tim since the New 52 have been appearing in street clothes or trying to show more personal life stuff more often it feels like.

Eh...do they? I guess it depends which characters we're talking about.

Like probably the characters with solo's have more of a chance of it, but at least in the New 52 Titans I think they were in street clothes with all the times they were trying to go under the radar or hide from police.

[Pohzee]

This isn't a Tim bashing thread, but if his whole point is that he's the more grounded and normal Robin, then he's completely pointless in an era where heroes aren't allowed to have normal lives. He's really got nothing else going for him.

[Frontier]

This isn't a Tim bashing thread, but if his whole point is that he's the more grounded and normal Robin, then he's completely pointless in an era where heroes aren't allowed to have normal lives. He's really got nothing else going for him.

Can't that also play into his personality and how he reacts to stuff too?

[Pohzee]

Can't that also play into his personality and how he reacts to stuff too?

It could be but I really feel like Dick kinda covers that base well enough when he's in Dixon mode. Not exactly the same, but not different enough to merit an addition

[Ascended]

Considering how little interaction Dick and Tim have had as of late I think it's less of an attempt to sell Tim and more like re-introduce their bond and how close they are.

Haven't read the issue yet, but this rings true to me in a "general" kind of way. Tim and Dick used to be really close back in the day. And yeah, that was to help sell the idea of this then-new Robin by having Dick approve of the kid, but their bond was absolutely a major relationship for both characters during the Dixon days and remained so long after Tim became a central, beloved member of the Batfam. We've been bitching about DC ignoring most of Dick's relationships and history, well, that includes Tim.

And normally, yeah Dick's seal of approval is used to prop up Tim (among others) but there's not really any point to DC propping up Tim right now. Tim doesn't have a solo, doesn't have a regular team title, if this is an attempt to sell him then where's the product they're selling? Maybe Taylor screwed up the script, I won't know until I read it, but Tim is part of Dick's family and has every right to appear here.

This isn't a Tim bashing thread, but if his whole point is that he's the more grounded and normal Robin, then he's completely pointless in an era where heroes aren't allowed to have normal lives. He's really got nothing else going for him.

Tim absolutely has no direction or purpose. And DC's attempts to keep Tim relevant are just doing more damage. I don't know why they can't just have Tim retire for a while. The kid never wanted to be Robin forever, he's got no regular title to star in, what benefit is there to keeping him in the cape? Have him retire and appear as a supporting character in some Bat book; Tim the "civilian private detective" can do all the things Tim the "costumed hero sharing the name Robin" can do, and have more freedom in the process. At least until someone comes up with a plan for him.

[Frontier]

It could be but I really feel like Dick kinda covers that base well enough when he's in Dixon mode. Not exactly the same, but not different enough to merit an addition

I think Tim's youth and enthusiam makes the difference, and that he's a little more awkward than Dick, but I guess that depends on your perspective.

Tim absolutely has no direction or purpose. And DC's attempts to keep Tim relevant are just doing more damage. I don't know why they can't just have Tim retire for a while. The kid never wanted to be Robin forever, he's got no regular title to star in, what benefit is there to keeping him in the cape? Have him retire and appear as a supporting character in some Bat book; Tim the "civilian private detective" can do all the things Tim the "costumed hero sharing the name Robin" can do, and have more freedom in the process. At least until someone comes up with a plan for him.

Fans want to read more of their favorite character. Tim's come a long way from the point where he didn't expect this life to consume him the way he did and I think Tim as a civilian private detective without any costume wouldn't really fit anywhere. He'd basically just be Jason Bard.

[Rac7d*]

Haven't read the issue yet, but this rings true to me in a "general" kind of way. Tim and Dick used to be really close back in the day. And yeah, that was to help sell the idea of this then-new Robin by having Dick approve of the kid, but their bond was absolutely a major relationship for both characters during the Dixon days and remained so long after Tim became a central, beloved member of the Batfam. We've been bitching about DC ignoring most of Dick's relationships and history, well, that includes Tim.

And normally, yeah Dick's seal of approval is used to prop up Tim (among others) but there's not really any point to DC propping up Tim right now. Tim doesn't have a solo, doesn't have a regular team title, if this is an attempt to sell him then where's the product they're selling? Maybe Taylor screwed up the script, I won't know until I read it, but Tim is part of Dick's family and has every right to appear here.



Tim absolutely has no direction or purpose. And DC's attempts to keep Tim relevant are just doing more damage. I don't know why they can't just have Tim retire for a while. The kid never wanted to be Robin forever, he's got no regular title to star in, what benefit is there to keeping him in the cape? Have him retire and appear as a supporting character in some Bat book; Tim the "civilian private detective" can do all the things Tim the "costumed hero sharing the name Robin" can do, and have more freedom in the process. At least until someone comes up with a plan for him.

Tim doesn’t have a normal life. We have know of no life outside of heroics for a while. It would have been a good idea to let him be a civilian for a period and then have him return rebranded. We’re hitting the worst of it now that the status quo has has him in a bad spot. The original titans are now in their early thirties and the most recent in their mid to late teen. One more year and he won’t fit in the mythos.

[Vordan]

Someone else said that Dick is used to legitimise Replacement Robins. Used to prop them up and that is true. Tim and Damian the two that sort of worked have 'bonds' with Dick. Even his folks death and the emotional impact it had on poor Timmy is dragged to tie him to Dick.

Cunning strategy and it works however it's odd two Tim stans writers who got into comics at a time when this bond was strongest can't come up with a better way to reflect this bond.

Both writers give us Dick telling us how great Tim is and Tim and Dick riding trains.

That's it.


@Badou I agree. A lot of it of played off as a joke but the joke is always at Dick's expense. Taylor said on twitter that Dick is one of DC's greatest detectives etc but he's yet to show that reflected in the story.

The run so far has been lots of gorgeous art, hype, call backs, jokes and fan service. Style but not much substance. It looks good, I feel good when I read it because it's kinda familiar which is comforting but it's not actually doing anything. Dick isn't treated as the A lister that Taylor promised.

I'm a fan of the batfam but I would rather Nightwing focuses on Dick and what makes him a great hero and character.

I want Dock's ties to the greater DCU reflected in the title not just the Batfamily.

We know he's a bat now what else is he?

Welcome to Tom Taylor. It’s why I don’t generally enjoy him (ok there are other reason too which I’m sure can be guessed based on my profile pic). I’m still enjoying this run because Ric was so terrible that I’m willing to turn my brain off and just enjoy the pretty pictures, but don’t expect this to change. Taylor isn’t going to change his style now.

[Rac7d*]

Welcome to Tom Taylor. It’s why I don’t generally enjoy him (ok there are other reason too which I’m sure can be guessed based on my profile pic). I’m still enjoying this run because Ric was so terrible that I’m willing to turn my brain off and just enjoy the pretty pictures, but don’t expect this to change. Taylor isn’t going to change his style now.

Well let the arc finish first. Do you want superficial Alist status which is achieved by joining the justice league. Ex Cyborg, Jessica Cruz Naomi. Are you looking for Alist status within the fiction or real life? Do you want him to be a household name?

That can’t be achieved in a few issues. A good run is is a few years worth of issues. A list status, true status is built over time. To be honest Nightwing already on the cusp of it.

[WonderNight]

Tim doesn’t have a normal life. We have know of no life outside of heroics for a while. It would have been a good idea to let him be a civilian for a period and then have him return rebranded. We’re hitting the worst of it now that the status quo has has him in a bad spot. The original titans are now in their early thirties and the most recent in their mid to late teen. One more year and he won’t fit in the mythos.

Wait dicks in his 30s now! I thought he was in his 20s.

[WonderNight]

Nightwing will never be A list as long as his core consept and story's remains discount batman/ bat character no.12.

You what A list Nightwing, give him a core consept that can get people invested in him outside of Batman batfamily and Gotham, like Grayson did!

Agent 37= globetrotting superspy.

Nightwing=I was Robin.

[Rac7d*]

Wait dicks in his 30s now! I thought he was in his 20s.

So with Roy’s daughter now presently 11-14. That would put him and his friends their. She didn’t come from the future so natural progression is the only answer for her age.

Nightwing will never be A list as long as his core consept and story's remains discount batman/ bat character no.12.

You what A list Nightwing, give him a core consept that can get people invested in him outside of Batman batfamily and Gotham, like Grayson did!

Agent 37= globetrotting superspy.

Nightwing=I was Robin.

Cool take I can do grossly simplify it too

Nightwing = Living legacy, Universal Constant

Agent 37 = James Bond wannabe

Grayson was fun and freshs but it cut him off from the world of DC. For someone like him who is beloved by the world working is a detriment. It was the only flaw of the series but a big one. DC intelligence world is underdeveloped and limited and can expand within only one book. I feel like if Dick became a secret agent again he would end up working for Waller on then suicide Squad and no thank you on that.

Actually the true breakout out star of the Titans is probably Deathstroke. I recall him having an awful book a couple years back traveling the world and fighting a different Alist superhero every 2issues.

If I don’t preorder a new issue of Nightwing it will not be there the day after release. He is in demand as Nightwing. The only thing slowing him from reaching household status is a decent live action adaptation of him.

[Vordan]

Well let the arc finish first. Do you want superficial Alist status which is achieved by joining the justice league. Ex Cyborg, Jessica Cruz Naomi. Are you looking for Alist status within the fiction or real life? Do you want him to be a household name?

Honestly I couldn’t care less about any of that. A freaking comic isn’t going to make Dick A-List, the Titans show, Arkham games, and the Gotham Knights game are doing that. Nightwing’s comic is read by a few thousand people while millions watch the show and play the games. So when it comes to the comics all I care about is “am I enjoying this?” and with Taylor the answer is usually “no”. His style doesn’t appeal to me usually. But Ric was so bad that for once I’m willing to just follow along for now until he does something that annoys me and causes me to drop the book.

That can’t be achieved in a few issues. A good run is is a few years worth of issues. A list status, true status is built over time. To be honest Nightwing already on the cusp of it.

Dick is A-List in the eyes of the general audience even if he’s not treated as such by DC. Captain Marvel (Carol) is A-List now because of her movie and she has far fewer good comics than he does imo. He and Jason are by far the most popular non-Bruce members of the Batfamily.

Aside from that, I expect Taylor to sell well given he’s in his element writing a Batfamily member.