Tim Drake: Robin, Red Robin, Drake Appreciation 2021

[Frontier]

I think Tim is relatively Post-Crisis Tim.

[Digifiend]

Tim's New 52 origin was overwritten in Rebirth Detective Comics, so yes, he's definitely the original 90s version at this point.

[Dataweaver]

I agree that he's the original version at this point. With that said, Death Metal brought everything into continuity, which includes Tim's New 52 origin and adventures — as in, he remembers them as well as his 90s origin, as does everyone else who was involved. Still, I think that Tim identifies with the 90s origin more than the New 52 one; his characterization in Urban Legends #4 certainly aligns better with the pre-Flashpoint Tim than with the N52 one.

And “everything's back in continuity” also addresses the matter of whether or not the Red Robin series happened. Like everything else, it did. And with that in mind, I won't mind one bit of this story arc ends with Tim deciding to go back to being Red Robin and picking up right where the last issue of that series left off. While I have some problems with his characterization in the latter half of that series, it's still a much better place for him to be than “Damian's substitute”.

[Konja7]

I agree that he's the original version at this point. With that said, Death Metal brought everything into continuity, which includes Tim's New 52 origin and adventures — as in, he remembers them as well as his 90s origin, as does everyone else who was involved. Still, I think that Tim identifies with the 90s origin more than the New 52 one; his characterization in Urban Legends #4 certainly aligns better with the pre-Flashpoint Tim than with the N52 one.

And “everything's back in continuity” also addresses the matter of whether or not the Red Robin series happened. Like everything else, it did. And with that in mind, I won't mind one bit of this story arc ends with Tim deciding to go back to being Red Robin and picking up right where the last issue of that series left off. While I have some problems with his characterization in the latter half of that series, it's still a much better place for him to be than “Damian's substitute”.

"Everything's back in continuity" is just a way to say they will take what they want from old continuity, while they ignore everything what they don't want. I really doubt they will mention New52 origin and adventures again.

They will also invent stories that never happened like Red X being a past identity for Dick.

[Dataweaver]

"Everything's back in continuity" is just a way to say they will take what they want from old continuity, while they ignore everything what they don't want. I really doubt they will mention New52 origin and adventures again.

They will also invent stories that never happened like Red X being a past identity for Dick.

In practice, you're right. But the idea behind it is that, for all we know, the Mr. and Mrs. Drake of the N52 origin story are out there somewhere in a witness protection program.

Mind you, I have no interest in seeing them again; but if the writing team decides that they could do something with that, Infinite Frontier has given them permission to do so.

As for Nightwing and Red X: my view of it is that Doomsday Clock ended with a revision to the timeline that was barely explored before Death Metal happened, which gives some leeway to introducing “stories that never happened”. Another example of this is Wonder Woman being the first superhero to debut in WWII, as told in her 80-year anniversary special.

[CPSparkles]

I think Urban Legends Tim is close to pre-flashpoint but he's not pre flashpoint Tim

Urban Legends Tim Is younger than pre-flashpoint Tim, Started his hero journey after Damian. [Damian became Robin at 10 and is now 14, Tim joined at 13 spent a year training and became Robin at age 14. He is currently 16] which is likely why they went with him being a substitute for Damian.

Tim's age means that RR didn't happen.

[KrustyKid]

I think Urban Legends Tim is close to pre-flashpoint but he's not pre flashpoint Tim

Urban Legends Tim Is younger than pre-flashpoint Tim, Started his hero journey after Damian. [Damian became Robin at 10 and is now 14, Tim joined at 13 spent a year training and became Robin at age 14. He is currently 16] which is likely why they went with him being a substitute for Damian.

Tim's age means that RR didn't happen.

I agree. This current Tim seems far less driven, and above all else unsure of himself. Quite the opposite of Pre-52 Tim

[Dataweaver]

On the age thing, I think it's more likely that when rebirth retcon Damian to being 13, it also retconned his age when he was introduced to Bruce to 12. As for Tim's age, we don't know what it is at the moment. For all we know, he was reverted to 19 at the end of Death Metal. Unless you can provide citations stating otherwise?

[SixSpeedSamurai]

I agree. This current Tim seems far less driven, and above all else unsure of himself. Quite the opposite of Pre-52 Tim

Pretty much Pre-OYL Tim.

[Dataweaver]

Pretty much Pre-OYL Tim.

In a lot of ways, yeah. In other ways, he's very definitely post-OYL, such as the whole “Tim Wayne” thing. I chalk up his bring more unsure of himself as a result of what he's been through, and quite possibly just an opening arc thing until he decides what he wants to do with himself.

[KrustyKid]

In a lot of ways, yeah. In other ways, he's very definitely post-OYL, such as the whole “Tim Wayne” thing. I chalk up his bring more unsure of himself as a result of what he's been through, and quite possibly just an opening arc thing until he decides what he wants to do with himself.

Which feels nothing like Tim at the end of the 'Red Robin' series. This seems to be just another take on him.

[Dataweaver]

As I said, he's been through things since then.

[KrustyKid]

As I said, he's been through things since then.

Things that never tied to his Red Robin run. I'm definetly not getting vibes this current Tim went through the events of 'Red Robin'. As I noted before, this Tim lacks drive and clearly has no direction for what he wants to do. That's not even remotely close to his pre-52 Red Robin counterpart who had a set plan and ambition to see everything through. Perhaps once this story concludes, he'll be somewhere closer to that, but as of now.. I just don't see it.

[Dataweaver]

In the Rebirth Detective Comics run, he went through with those ambitions — with disastrous results. So of course he's not going to be where he was at the end of Red Robin. As you say (and as I've said), that could change by the end of this Urban Legends story arc. But I can see how he could get to where he is now from where he was then, considering what's happened in between.

[KrustyKid]

In the Rebirth Detective Comics run, he went through with those ambitions — with disastrous results. So of course he's not going to be where he was at the end of Red Robin. As you say (and as I've said), that could change by the end of this Urban Legends story arc. But I can see how he could get to where he is now from where he was then, considering what's happened in between.

That was different in the Tec run. Everything Tim did there was regulated to Gotham, while in Red Robin he was more proactive(leaving the city to confront problems that would ultimately end up on the doorstep of the city). Secondly, Tim wasn't really all in on the mission, pretty clear by the fact he was planning on hanging it all up to pursue his schooling before his.. apparent death. While the two Tims share some similarities at the core, they are vastly different when it comes to their priorities.