Barbara Gordon: Batgirl/Oracle Appreciation 2021

[Restingvoice]

Isn't that where we got Venom Babs?

Yes, but it turned out she never used Venom, just bulked out

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Well, the "founding Batgirl" can be debated by some:

And she can do quite a lot of "leading" operating behind a keyboard and directing their action, just like a football coach doesn't have to be on the field and in the middle of all the plays in order to map out strategies and direct things.

I guess we'll have to patiently just wait and see.

That’s Bat-Girl, side-kick of the original Batwoman who was later repurposed into Kate Kane. They aren’t the same character, as Bette operated as more of a Robin. Batgirl was an equal ally.

But that’s the point: she -isn’t- Batgirl behind the computer and she’s hardly interacting in the same way with either the scenario than she does as Batgirl. She’s dependant on people just pointing things out and making second-hand observations rather than interacting with it herself to put the pieces together. Whatever she can do behind a computer she can also do on the field nowadays. The only thing is: she doesn’t get any of the extended interaction with the outside world, none of the theatrics or even interaction with anyone other than the two other, less independent Batgirls. She’s just there to scold them when they don’t do what she could have easily done herself.

[Frontier]

Oracle serves a different narrative purpose than Babs as Batgirl does.

I'm fine with it in the context of how it's being used so far but I can understand preferring Babs solo as Batgirl doing Batgirl things, but there's a place for both in my opinion.

I hope we get to see more of her bonding with Cass and Steph moving forward.

[sorboares]

What I don't like is that Babs as Oracle we hardly see. She makes an appearance here n there but we see her on one panel here and there. That's not enough for me.
Thats why I miss Babs as Batgirl. I miss seeing her being in a main role, the star and I miss her obviously in her Batgirl outfit.

[Frontier]

What I don't like is that Babs as Oracle we hardly see. She makes an appearance here n there but we see her on one panel here and there. That's not enough for me.
Thats why I miss Babs as Batgirl. I miss seeing her being in a main role, the star and I miss her obviously in her Batgirl outfit.

I feel like she's appearing more in other books than she would as Batgirl at least, but I guess that's me being invested in Batfamily connectiveness .

I think we'll get more leading role Babs in Nightwing and Batgirls.

[sorboares]

I feel like she's appearing more in other books than she would as Batgirl at least, but I guess that's me being invested in Batfamily connectiveness .

I think we'll get more leading role Babs in Nightwing and Batgirls.

Yes she is appearing in more books but only for a panel or two which isn't enough for me. At least in her Batgirl book we had her in the entire book. I am hopeful for the Nightwing book and really hope Babs has a major role as Batgirl and as Oracle.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Oracle serves a different narrative purpose than Babs as Batgirl does.

I'm fine with it in the context of how it's being used so far but I can understand preferring Babs solo as Batgirl doing Batgirl things, but there's a place for both in my opinion.

I hope we get to see more of her bonding with Cass and Steph moving forward.

Exactly, and that narrative purpose is dull as dishwater, especially when the other characters just do not offer what she does. It might not bother you, but this is a major step down for her in terms of what we know that she can do and who she can be.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

I feel like she's appearing more in other books than she would as Batgirl at least, but I guess that's me being invested in Batfamily connectiveness .

I think we'll get more leading role Babs in Nightwing and Batgirls.

Which is the divide we seem to be facing: you don’t seem to concerned with Babs herself as you do the other characters and what she offers for them, but to those of us who prefer BABS, well.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Yes she is appearing in more books but only for a panel or two which isn't enough for me. At least in her Batgirl book we had her in the entire book. I am hopeful for the Nightwing book and really hope Babs has a major role as Batgirl and as Oracle.

It’s not enough for me either, but it’ll be especially egregious if they don’t even let her be Batgirl in a BATGIRLS book, how is that fair?

Because the thing is: Oracle and Batgirl don’t do the same thing. That was the point of Oracle’s creation...but tech and mobility equipment have marched on now. If they blended the approach? Awesome, yes! But they don’t seem interested in doing that. It’s one or the other and...unfortunately, one tends to offer a bit more independence.

[Domino_Dare-Doll]

Oracle serves a different narrative purpose than Babs as Batgirl does.

I'm fine with it in the context of how it's being used so far but I can understand preferring Babs solo as Batgirl doing Batgirl things, but there's a place for both in my opinion.

I hope we get to see more of her bonding with Cass and Steph moving forward.

There is a place for both; the problem is, we’re not getting both. We’re getting one and two substitutes.

[MajorHoy]

. . . Because the thing is: Oracle and Batgirl don’t do the same thing. That was the point of Oracle’s creation...

I thought the point of Oracle was to take a BROKEN CHARACTER (Barbara being crippled as a result of The Killing Joke) and to give her a new role / life / purpose as Oracle.

Have you ever read any of those Suicide Squad issues by Ostrander and Yale when Barbara first became Oracle? (Just curious.)

[Digifiend]

Are we sure we're even getting a Batgirls book? Could it be Birds of Prey instead, I wonder? Huntress said that Babs being at the computer reminded her of the Birds. The other Batgirls could easily be incorporated into that team alongside Huntress and Black Canary.

[Frontier]

I think Tynion outright mentioned there was a Batgirls book coming.

Yes she is appearing in more books but only for a panel or two which isn't enough for me. At least in her Batgirl book we had her in the entire book. I am hopeful for the Nightwing book and really hope Babs has a major role as Batgirl and as Oracle.

But for lack of a Batgirl solo book I feel like it makes sense how they're approaching it and I feel like she'll have a leading role in a Batgirls book.

Exactly, and that narrative purpose is dull as dishwater, especially when the other characters just do not offer what she does. It might not bother you, but this is a major step down for her in terms of what we know that she can do and who she can be.

I've felt that about some of her depictions as Batgirl post-New 52 to be honest, but I'm also coming at it as someone who grew up with Batgirl in media and Oracle in the comics so I guess I just view it differently.

Which is the divide we seem to be facing: you don’t seem to concerned with Babs herself as you do the other characters and what she offers for them, but to those of us who prefer BABS, well.

I'm a Babs fan but I'm also a fan of other characters, so ideally I'd like to see them all doing well and playing off each other.

It’s not enough for me either, but it’ll be especially egregious if they don’t even let her be Batgirl in a BATGIRLS book, how is that fair?

Because the thing is: Oracle and Batgirl don’t do the same thing. That was the point of Oracle’s creation...but tech and mobility equipment have marched on now. If they blended the approach? Awesome, yes! But they don’t seem interested in doing that. It’s one or the other and...unfortunately, one tends to offer a bit more independence.

Again, I feel like she'll still end up appearing as Batgirl within the Batgirls book. We really don't have a lot of information about it.

They're two separate identities. I feel like she's been depicted as being fairly independent as Oracle in the past, so I don't think it's inherently an issue with the Oracle identity.

There is a place for both; the problem is, we’re not getting both. We’re getting one and two substitutes.

I don't view Cass and Steph as substitutes, and if she still appears as Batgirl moving forward doesn't that mean we'll be getting both?

[MajorHoy]

from JLA Secret Files & Origins #2 (August 1998)

[km_sus]

That one loose strand of hair style was a real good look for Babs.