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  1. #571
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    Isn't Veranke the most prominent Skrull villain?
    Not really. She was the definition of an ''event only villain''. She barely existed outside of Secret Invasion. They can perfectly adapt Secret Invasion in the MCU without her. The motivations of the bad guys would still be the same, regardless of who's in charge. Dorrek VII probably has more to offer to the MCU than Veranke, due to his connections. The royal Skrull family is one huge element of Skrull culture that's been missing from the MCU Skrulls, so I can see why they would prefer to use him. I mean, maybe Veranke could still be in the show, just not as the leader.

    I'd argue the Skrull who's been most consistently used as a villain or antagonistic figure in the comics over the years is Kl'rt, the Super-Skrull (although he fluctuates between being a villain and anti-hero). So I guess the character could be him too. But the fact that they're casting so old for the role makes me think it's more likely to be Dorrek.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 03-02-2021 at 12:26 PM.

  2. #572
    Spectacular Member Waking Replica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    Not really. She was the definition of an ''event only villain''. She barely existed outside of Secret Invasion. They can perfectly adapt Secret Invasion in the MCU without her. The motivations of the bad guys would still be the same, regardless of who's in charge. Dorrek VII probably has more to offer to the MCU than Veranke, due to his connections. The royal Skrull family is one huge element of Skrull culture that's been missing from the MCU Skrulls, so I can see why they would prefer to use him. I mean, maybe Veranke could still be in the show, just not as the leader.

    I'd argue the Skrull who's been most consistently used as a villain or antagonistic figure in the comics over the years is Kl'rt, the Super-Skrull (although he fluctuates between being a villain and anti-hero). So I guess the character could be him too. But the fact that they're casting so old for the role makes me think it's more likely to be Dorrek.
    I've mentioned this somewhere else, but they could always just fuse R'Klll and Veranke if they HAD to have a Skrull queen be an antagonistic figure in Secret Invasion. I mean, none of us are blind to the sudden usage of Skrulls and the Kree, R'klll's return, nor Teddy and Billy's push in Empyre. Dorrek makes the most sense narrative wise too, cause you could have Talos' group be an offshoot away from the royal family, of which could be taking the roles of the villainous Skrulls, as a counter to the more peaceful earth inhabiting Skrulls.

  3. #573
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    Bruh what if the MCU tries us and the absolute fuck out of Teddy by having Talos like take the throne or some shit!! I would lose my mine that is Teddy's legacy! The gays rule space if Marvel fucks that up I swear to god!

  4. #574
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    I've mentioned this somewhere else, but they could always just fuse R'Klll and Veranke if they HAD to have a Skrull queen be an antagonistic figure in Secret Invasion. I mean, none of us are blind to the sudden usage of Skrulls and the Kree, R'klll's return, nor Teddy and Billy's push in Empyre. Dorrek makes the most sense narrative wise too, cause you could have Talos' group be an offshoot away from the royal family, of which could be taking the roles of the villainous Skrulls, as a counter to the more peaceful earth inhabiting Skrulls.
    I could see that happening... and I'd be ok with it. I don't think there is much they can do with Veranke that wouldn't already be done with R'Klll anyway (well, except for the fact that Veranke wanted Teddy to be executed while R'Klll wanted him to rule, but I'm not even sure if that's gonna be a plot point this early on in the MCU).

    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    Bruh what if the MCU tries us and the absolute fuck out of Teddy by having Talos like take the throne or some shit!! I would lose my mine that is Teddy's legacy! The gays rule space if Marvel fucks that up I swear to god!
    I mean, we don't even know if there is going to be any throne to inherit. Even if Dorrek VII ends up in the MCU, they could turn him into a generic soldier leader guy instead of a king/emperor. I do wish the royal element remains, though, because we're likely already getting the soldier/military angle coming from his Kree side of the family, so his Skrull side should be different in some way.

    And I wouldn't mind other people taking the throne right now just because it wouldn't be Teddy's time to take on a responsibility like that when he's not even introduced in the MCU. They would have to do the whole Young Avengers to New Avengers plot before even thinking of doing Empyre. It was like that in the comics too: other people like Veranke and even Kl'rt took the throne before Teddy was ready. So I don't think it would be a big deal for him to wait a little in the MCU too, as long as the story goes there eventually.
    Last edited by Drops Of Venus; 03-02-2021 at 04:57 PM.

  5. #575
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    Not really. She was the definition of an ''event only villain''. She barely existed outside of Secret Invasion. They can perfectly adapt Secret Invasion in the MCU without her. The motivations of the bad guys would still be the same, regardless of who's in charge. Dorrek VII probably has more to offer to the MCU than Veranke, due to his connections. The royal Skrull family is one huge element of Skrull culture that's been missing from the MCU Skrulls, so I can see why they would prefer to use him. I mean, maybe Veranke could still be in the show, just not as the leader.

    I'd argue the Skrull who's been most consistently used as a villain or antagonistic figure in the comics over the years is Kl'rt, the Super-Skrull (although he fluctuates between being a villain and anti-hero). So I guess the character could be him too. But the fact that they're casting so old for the role makes me think it's more likely to be Dorrek.
    I forgot about Super Skrull. However, I assumed Veranke was at least a well known Skrull villain.

  6. #576
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    Not really. She was the definition of an ''event only villain''. She barely existed outside of Secret Invasion. They can perfectly adapt Secret Invasion in the MCU without her. The motivations of the bad guys would still be the same, regardless of who's in charge. Dorrek VII probably has more to offer to the MCU than Veranke, due to his connections. The royal Skrull family is one huge element of Skrull culture that's been missing from the MCU Skrulls, so I can see why they would prefer to use him. I mean, maybe Veranke could still be in the show, just not as the leader.

    I'd argue the Skrull who's been most consistently used as a villain or antagonistic figure in the comics over the years is Kl'rt, the Super-Skrull (although he fluctuates between being a villain and anti-hero). So I guess the character could be him too. But the fact that they're casting so old for the role makes me think it's more likely to be Dorrek.
    I can't see them using Super-Skrull before the FF get introduced unless they alter his gimmick to where his powers aren't based around the Fantastic Four's (but that kind of defeats the point).

  7. #577
    Astonishing Member Drops Of Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mik View Post
    I forgot about Super Skrull. However, I assumed Veranke was at least a well known Skrull villain.
    She is well known because of Secret Invasion, but that's my point: that's the only thing she's known for. So I wouldn't call her the most prominent Skrull villain overall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I can't see them using Super-Skrull before the FF get introduced unless they alter his gimmick to where his powers aren't based around the Fantastic Four's (but that kind of defeats the point).
    I actually can see the MCU not tying the Super-Skrull stuff to the Fantastic Four, and I'd be ok with that. That is one aspect from the comics that I don't think would quite translate well to the MCU, because the reason why the Skrulls were so connected to the FF in the comics was because they had their debut in their stories. A lot of their lore was established through FF. That is not the case in the MCU, as we're gonna have at least 3 major productions that will explore the Skrull race before FF is even a thing. The Skrulls have existed in the MCU for over 3 decades, so it doesn't really make sense to me what it would take the Fantastic Four for them to be genetically altered to be better warriors. If anything, I feel like the events of Captain Marvel would be the catalyst for the creation of the Super-Skrulls in the MCU. They were a race that was persecuted and hunt down by the Kree, so what better way to fight back than to make themselves stronger? And if the race is all about changing and adapting to survive, they should be able to be more diverse in their powerset instead of the oddly specific ''we're making ourselves stronger by copying the powers of these four earthling heroes and no one else''. I think a great modern way to do that is show that they enhanced themselves to have all sorts of different powers, not just four. Make them be able to not only shapeshift into anyone, but to mimic the powers of anyone they come in contact with. I think that would actually make them the big threat that the Super-Skrulls in the comics were supposed to be back in the day. And it would make them an actual challenge for Carol, considering how powerful they hyped her up to be.

  8. #578
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    Ok I read the tie-in gotta say loved it Billy & Teddy's outfits stunning I want more of those suits going forward! Sidebar I still hate the way Tini unnecessarily limits Billy on occasions but I can tolerate it. Teddy came off very kingly which I appreciated.
    Last edited by Journey; 03-03-2021 at 04:33 AM.

  9. #579
    Spectacular Member Waking Replica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    Ok I read the tie-in gotta say loved it Billy & Teddy's outfits stunning I want more of those suits going forward! Sidebar I still hate the way Tini unnecessarily limits Billy on occasions but I can tolerate it. Teddy came off very kingly which I appreciated.
    I haven't read it yet, but on the topic of limiting Billy, I think, since Al did it too, that they're doing it because if they let him be op all the time, someone's gonna Franklin Richard's him and drain him of his powers/weaken him down the road. And I think writing him as powerful but with a few more limitations than maybe someone below his power class is their way of A) letting the story happen naturally, as I'm sure full power Billy could literally solve anything in a page or two, and B) preventing the need for a power down, which might end up being tied with like his relationship or his new status quo.

    But, like I said, I haven't read it yet so idk how much he got nerfed in this issue, so maybe I'm making excuses lmao.

  10. #580
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drops Of Venus View Post
    She is well known because of Secret Invasion, but that's my point: that's the only thing she's known for. So I wouldn't call her the most prominent Skrull villain overall.



    I actually can see the MCU not tying the Super-Skrull stuff to the Fantastic Four, and I'd be ok with that. That is one aspect from the comics that I don't think would quite translate well to the MCU, because the reason why the Skrulls were so connected to the FF in the comics was because they had their debut in their stories. A lot of their lore was established through FF. That is not the case in the MCU, as we're gonna have at least 3 major productions that will explore the Skrull race before FF is even a thing. The Skrulls have existed in the MCU for over 3 decades, so it doesn't really make sense to me what it would take the Fantastic Four for them to be genetically altered to be better warriors. If anything, I feel like the events of Captain Marvel would be the catalyst for the creation of the Super-Skrulls in the MCU. They were a race that was persecuted and hunt down by the Kree, so what better way to fight back than to make themselves stronger? And if the race is all about changing and adapting to survive, they should be able to be more diverse in their powerset instead of the oddly specific ''we're making ourselves stronger by copying the powers of these four earthling heroes and no one else''. I think a great modern way to do that is show that they enhanced themselves to have all sorts of different powers, not just four. Make them be able to not only shapeshift into anyone, but to mimic the powers of anyone they come in contact with. I think that would actually make them the big threat that the Super-Skrulls in the comics were supposed to be back in the day. And it would make them an actual challenge for Carol, considering how powerful they hyped her up to be.
    I agree. I think Skrulls actually work better with Captain Marvel than with F4, to be honest.

  11. #581
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    I haven't read it yet, but on the topic of limiting Billy, I think, since Al did it too, that they're doing it because if they let him be op all the time, someone's gonna Franklin Richard's him and drain him of his powers/weaken him down the road. And I think writing him as powerful but with a few more limitations than maybe someone below his power class is their way of A) letting the story happen naturally, as I'm sure full power Billy could literally solve anything in a page or two, and B) preventing the need for a power down, which might end up being tied with like his relationship or his new status quo.

    But, like I said, I haven't read it yet so idk how much he got nerfed in this issue, so maybe I'm making excuses lmao.
    It wasn't a major nerf it was the "oh I only have this amount of magic for the day" which she was doing in Strikeforce but I still hate it cause it's something only Tini does and not established anywhere else, when Al did it he just kinda of skirted around Billy he didn't really limit him IDK it just bugs me a little but it was still a great showing for him and Teddy so I'm not too bothered.

    Side note we never compare the false God to the Demiurge ever!! Lol

  12. #582
    Astonishing Member Dante Milton's Avatar
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    KiB:W&H sure was a Tini Howard book. I really don't care for her clunky dialogue, choppy plotting, and underwhelming action. And while I generally enjoyed how she handled Wiccan in Strikeforce, whenever she writes the boys together Billy comes off as petty. I don't mind her giving Billy limits, there wouldn't be much of a story if he could solve everything with a spell. The art was serviceable, cute faces and the Tron suits were cool.

  13. #583
    Spectacular Member Waking Replica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    It wasn't a major nerf it was the "oh I only have this amount of magic for the day" which she was doing in Strikeforce but I still hate it cause it's something only Tini does and not established anywhere else, when Al did it he just kinda of skirted around Billy he didn't really limit him IDK it just bugs me a little but it was still a great showing for him and Teddy so I'm not too bothered.

    Side note we never compare the false God to the Demiurge ever!! Lol
    Just finished reading it, enjoyed it!!! But to your point, I think I've realized how she writes Billy: she writes him like a DnD wizard, with like a limited amount of moves and abilities to use at a time, and needing time to recharge. It works well in that setting cause unlimited spells and stuff sort of defeat the experience, but I think in a format like comics, it can be a little bit of an eye roll cause other people have pulled larger deus ex machina's out of their ass before, and with much less raw power than Billy's working with. Still, the fact that we got to see Billy and Teddy get spoilers:
    magic armor was just... AHHHHHHH!!! My anime loving weeb heart loved it!!! Like, I love that Billy got his Asgardian armor and Teddy got like a royal magic form!
    end of spoilers
    Last edited by Waking Replica; 03-03-2021 at 09:05 AM.

  14. #584
    Extraordinary Member Fokken's Avatar
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    Y'all have me equally hype and whelmed with these reviews! I'm so so eager and excited for more Billy & Teddy content but also understand and echo some of the writing concerns ( ie. DnDing Billy, personality pivoting to "liven him up", etc)

  15. #585
    Astonishing Member Journey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waking Replica View Post
    Just finished reading it, enjoyed it!!! But to your point, I think I've realized how she writes Billy: she writes him like a DnD wizard, with like a limited amount of moves and abilities to use at a time, and needing time to recharge. It works well in that setting cause unlimited spells and stuff sort of defeat the experience, but I think in a format like comics, it can be a little bit of an eye roll cause other people have pulled larger deus ex machina's out of their ass before, and with much less raw power than Billy's working with. Still, the fact that we got to see Billy and Teddy get spoilers:
    magic armor was just... AHHHHHHH!!! My anime loving weeb heart loved it!!! Like, I love that Billy got his Asgardian armor and Teddy got like a royal magic form! Would've been absolutely perfect if they got a magical girl transformation, but they can only fit so much lmao
    end of spoilers
    I never played DND so it's something that goes over my head and I got no problem with people limiting Billy I just don't like this particular method cause again like him tiring out after teleports, 3 reality warps is something he's never had problems with unless it's Tini so IDK that's just me, if she continues to write him I'mma need her to do a little better. But yes the suits were amazing!!
    Last edited by Journey; 03-03-2021 at 09:09 AM.

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