Young Avengers Appreciation - 2021

[Waking Replica]

Since MCU Mar-Vell was a woman, and allied with Skrulls covertly, it wouldn't be the hugest stretch to reveal that she'd had a child in secret by a Skrull leader who died during their resistance movement (basically swapping the genders of Teddy's 616 parents, but keeping the beats intact) and had him raised on Earth by a human ally, rather than by her Skull allies on her cloaked space station (so that he could grow up having some semblance of a 'normal life' and not in hiding on a space station full of alien refugees).

She died in the 90s though, so Teddy would be WAYYYY too old in that scenario. Remember MCU is in 2023/2024 ish, so he'd need from be born 2009ish to be about the age they're probably going to leave Billy at after WV (unless they go full homophobic-pandering corporation and make him older so they never have to do BillyTeddy, but they aren't that stupid, so that's only a worst WORST case scenario). I suspect it'll be Genis/Yon-rogg as his dad, with Veranke/Anelle as his mom.

[walk]

I highly doubt they're doing that. It feels as uncreative and low-key racist and people saying Shuri should've been Ironheart. Completely different black characters are not interchangeable just because they're black. Plus, based on what the showrunner of The Falcon & The Winter Soldier is saying about the show and what it means for black representation, and considering this is the show that will allegedly introduce Eli, I don't see how revealing that he grows up to be a genocidal villain right after that will be productive to the message they're trying to send. And let us not forget, again, that Eli almost made it to Black Panther. Marvel clearly thinks of him as an important black representation. Also, how is that simplifying his origins? Eli's origins are as simple as it gets. His grandfather was the first black Captain America. He got scorned by the government and society because of it. Now Eli is a hero to honor his legacy. Adding Kang to the mix seems more complicated than simple. I don't know what they're gonna do about Iron Lad, but I doubt it will affect Eli.

I mean if Nate was black and an a actual fully formed indiviual like Shuri/Riri then your comparsion might work but yeah that's a bit of a false equivalence I'm afraid.

It's not about diminishing existing representation but rather taking aspects from a (white) character that their likely not going to use now and giving them to create a more expansive narrative for Eli that could potentially gives him much more significance and importance within the wider MCU going forward. And again it's good to explore the moral greys of life, Eli a passionate but angry young man who often let's his emotions get the better of him, having him face-off a future version of himself where he's let that anger become hate can explore a uncomofortable but sad truth about the devastating effects of racism on people and how it can turn them bitter and cruel. It also potentially make's Kang a more nuanced and tragic figure, seeing how he started as this young man with good intentions trying to fight back against injustices but somewhere along the way got lost and became an extremist and it would challenge audiences over wheather he's ultimately justfied or not.

It's good to have more representation but we should also allow these characters to have dimension and layers.

[walk]

Refreshing to see some out of the box thinking here, and not a bad idea to spice the up the character dynamics! Right now YA seems to be all about Billy, Teddy, and Tommy. It would be interesting to see a black male characters walk in that morally grey area, while having the power to be a real threat. Heck I have never seen Marvel or DC execute that well!

Well I'm glad someone enjoyed it, I mean it's all just baseless specluation but it's fun to theorycraft.

I guess people here having been thinking about a YA adaption a lot over the years and have very exact vision of how they want it to play out.

[Magmaster12]

I think it is likely that Iron Lad will be show up in some capacity, Cassie had a somewhat romantic relationship with him and why else would ancolder Kang show up in Antman 3.

[dkrook]

Well I'm glad someone enjoyed it, I mean it's all just baseless specluation but it's fun to theorycraft.

I guess people here having been thinking about a YA adaption a lot over the years and have very exact vision of how they want it to play out.

Exactly, since we all know Kang will be African American, so yeah MCU version may start out as Patriot and then, maybe some tragic event compels him to become Kang.

[gonnagiveittoya]

Idk why you assume it'll be connected to Patriot and not Ironheart

[Waking Replica]

Looks like the twins spoilers:

are still kids

end of spoilers, at least for the first part of the episode based on this teaser:

https://twitter.com/GMA/status/1362392395149692930?s=19

spoilers:

Wonder if that means we'll have to wait for the final battle to see them age up?

end of spoilers

[Drops Of Venus]

Wouldn't be surprised if McKelvie just means that because WandaVision.

Yeah, I thought about that. But it's the second time he just randomly tweeted about the Young Avengers in the same week, so IDK, I guess I just thought he might've been working on something related to the team. Or maybe WandaVision just made him think about it. But I hope it's the former, obviously.

She died in the 90s though, so Teddy would be WAYYYY too old in that scenario. Remember MCU is in 2023/2024 ish, so he'd need from be born 2009ish to be about the age they're probably going to leave Billy at after WV (unless they go full homophobic-pandering corporation and make him older so they never have to do BillyTeddy, but they aren't that stupid, so that's only a worst WORST case scenario). I suspect it'll be Genis/Yon-rogg as his dad, with Veranke/Anelle as his mom.

I never stopped to do the math, but damn, thinking about how MCU Teddy would be born when I was in my early teens makes me feel old. It's so weird thinking that I was around the same age as those characters when I got into them, and now they'll be perpetually younger than me while I continue to age. *lights a cigarette and has an early mid-life crisis*

I mean if Nate was black and an a actual fully formed indiviual like Shuri/Riri then your comparsion might work but yeah that's a bit of a false equivalence I'm afraid.

It's not about diminishing existing representation but rather taking aspects from a (white) character that their likely not going to use now and giving them to create a more expansive narrative for Eli that could potentially gives him much more significance and importance within the wider MCU going forward. And again it's good to explore the moral greys of life, Eli a passionate but angry young man who often let's his emotions get the better of him, having him face-off a future version of himself where he's let that anger become hate can explore a uncomofortable but sad truth about the devastating effects of racism on people and how it can turn them bitter and cruel. It also potentially make's Kang a more nuanced and tragic figure, seeing how he started as this young man with good intentions trying to fight back against injustices but somewhere along the way got lost and became an extremist and it would challenge audiences over wheather he's ultimately justfied or not.

It's good to have more representation but we should also allow these characters to have dimension and layers.

But Kang IS black in the MCU, so you're going by the same principle here. ''He's black, so he should be the same character as the only other black founding member of the Young Avengers.'' Even if not intentional, it still contributes to the issue of diminishing representation. There is absolutely no reason why we can't have a black Iron Lad and Patriot on the same team. They can do everything you're saying they should do with Eli, but with Nate instead. They only won't have dimension and layers if Marvel doesn't want them too. There is a lot they can do with Eli on the Captain America side of things that don't require him becoming Kang. Being the grandson of Isaiah Bradley alone can make him an important part of the MCU going forward. They just have to be creative. Merging the two black characters into one because apparently they can't think of how making them different from each other is not creative.

And by the way, Nathaniel Richards is ABSOLUTELY a fully formed individual. You are thinking of him as Iron Lad solely, but his story doesn't end there. Nathaniel Richards is ALSO Kang, Immortus, Scarlet Centurion, Rama-Tut, etc. He is one of the most classic Marvel villains. Hell, he has a larger publication history than both Riri and Shuri. He is supposed to be a descendant of Reed Richards, and possibly even Doctor Doom. Like... how is that not enough to make him interesting on his own? Again, it's all about being creative to explore all of those comic book connections.

I think it is likely that Iron Lad will be show up in some capacity, Cassie had a somewhat romantic relationship with him and why else would ancolder Kang show up in Antman 3.

There is another reason besides Cassie why Kang would be in the Ant-Man movie: time travel. But I do hope they will tease a connection between the two characters in the movie, regardless. Like, a moment where Kang recognizes Cassie and implies he knows her, and she's left confused wondering why, but he just goes like:

Idk why you assume it'll be connected to Patriot and not Ironheart

............ Kang being connected to Ironheart makes even less sense. I promise you guys, not every black person needs to be related to each other.

Looks like the twins spoilers:

are still kids

end of spoilers, at least for the first part of the episode based on this teaser:

https://twitter.com/GMA/status/1362392395149692930?s=19

spoilers:

Wonder if that means we'll have to wait for the final battle to see them age up?

end of spoilers

I figured that would be the case, based on the way the last episode ended. It wouldn't make sense for them to suddenly be different. My money is on them aging either halfway through this episode, or in the finale.

[Waking Replica]

Tangentially related to YA, but according to May solicits for GOTG, spoilers:

Looks like Teddy and Billy can't catch a break. First their honeymoon gets disrupted by an evil 90s edgelord villain, and now the alliance throne-world is being attacked. Also, looking forward to how Doom gets involved. Wonder if this is before or after his wedding lol.

end of spoilers

https://aiptcomics.com/2021/02/18/ma...solicitations/

[Journey]

Tangentially related to YA, but according to May solicits for GOTG, spoilers:

Looks like Teddy and Billy can't catch a break. First their honeymoon gets disrupted by an evil 90s edgelord villain, and now the alliance throne-world is being attacked. Also, looking forward to how Doom gets involved. Wonder if this is before or after his wedding lol.

end of spoilers

https://aiptcomics.com/2021/02/18/ma...solicitations/

I hope Teddy has them eviscerated this is his second defense of his throne with a new reign and still fragile alliance weakness can't be shown. Strikeforce established the fact Billy has no qualms killing Aliens hope Teddy gets on his level.

[Krakoa]

She died in the 90s though, so Teddy would be WAYYYY too old in that scenario. Remember MCU is in 2023/2024 ish, so he'd need from be born 2009ish to be about the age they're probably going to leave Billy at after WV (unless they go full homophobic-pandering corporation and make him older so they never have to do BillyTeddy, but they aren't that stupid, so that's only a worst WORST case scenario). I suspect it'll be Genis/Yon-rogg as his dad, with Veranke/Anelle as his mom.

I'm expecting older than 2009ish -- something more like 18-22, similar to what they're going for with Cassie and Kate. And remember anyone can be blipped so he could be born as early as 2004ish and still be 15. Still would be way too old if he was Mar-Vell's kid though, she actually died in 1989, since Captain Marvel takes place in 1995 and Mar-Vell died 6 years prior to the main events of the film. I think the best route is Mar-Vell's grandkid.

[Drops Of Venus]

The new America Chavez: MITUSA solicit is pretty ominous.

AMERICA CHAVEZ: MADE IN THE USA #3 (Of 5)
KALINDA VAZQUEZ (W) • CARLOS GÓMEZ (A) • Cover by SARA PICHELLI
VARIANT COVER BY BETSY COLA
WHERE’D YOU GO, AMERICA?
The face of America’s mysterious tormentor is revealed — and while whom America sees is shocking, to say the least, it’s what they say that will shake the foundations of everything she knows. And then? It’s just a matter of whether or not to believe them…
32 PGS./Rated T+ …$3.99

You can tell by the hands of the person holding her face that they seem to be from the same place she is, based on the glowing stars on their wrists, just like hers. Why do I get the feeling it's gonna end up being one of her moms? I hope they don't pull a Kate on her and make one of her moms be evil.

Tangentially related to YA, but according to May solicits for GOTG, spoilers:

Looks like Teddy and Billy can't catch a break. First their honeymoon gets disrupted by an evil 90s edgelord villain, and now the alliance throne-world is being attacked. Also, looking forward to how Doom gets involved. Wonder if this is before or after his wedding lol.

end of spoilers

https://aiptcomics.com/2021/02/18/ma...solicitations/

That explains why they join the Guardians. It also makes me wonder just how long their staying on the team will be. Are they there just until the Guardians help them with whatever the Alliance needs help with? Will they stay beyond that?

By the way, Marvel posted this new article about Billy and Tommy, probably to promote WandaVision: https://www.marvel.com/articles/comi...-in-the-comics

[Journey]

All is lost!! *Cackles maniacally* WV Spoilers

spoilers:

My poor Minimoffs are probably dead and IDK how to process it!!! Agatha's song fucking slaps BTW!! Sidenote today's WV commercial had implications of Wanda's whole nexus being status, to the point I think Billy's whole Demiurge thing could become a thing in the MCU aswell maybe even be addressed in Dr Strange.

end of spoilers

[MasterOfMagnetism]

All is lost!! *Cackles maniacally* WV Spoilers

spoilers:

My poor Minimoffs are probably dead and IDK how to process it!!! Agatha's song fucking slaps BTW!! Sidenote today's WV commercial had implications of Wanda's whole nexus being status, to the point I think Billy's whole Demiurge thing could become a thing in the MCU aswell maybe even be addressed in Dr Strange.

end of spoilers

Your reactions in the WandaVision thread had me cackling, girl.

Anyway I'm starting to get scared that the reason that we still don't know who's playing teenage Billy is... because teenage Billy hasn't been cast yet.

[Journey]

Your reactions in the WandaVision thread had me cackling, girl.

Anyway I'm starting to get scared that the reason that we still don't know who's playing teenage Billy is... because teenage Billy hasn't been cast yet.

Honestly if he hasn't I'm cool with that I really enjoy the current versions of Billy and Tommy if they got aged up offscreen or killed the story would feel incomplete for me.