Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2021

[Wiccan]

It doesn't really require omega-level TK. Rachel did it a few times in X-Men Gold. Also, Jean not being omega in TK is simply because Exodus is like slightly above her... It doesn't mean she's any weaker than she was before.

[Grinning Soul]

It doesn't really require omega-level TK. Rachel did it a few times in X-Men Gold. Also, Jean not being omega in TK is simply because Exodus is like slightly above her... It doesn't mean she's any weaker than she was before.

You may be right. It really varies from writer to writer.

I guess some writers just don't realise the feat it actually is to rearrange atoms/molecules. I'm just guesstimating here.

[Wiccan]

You may be right. It really varies from writer to writer.

I guess some writers just don't realise the feat it actually is to rearrange atoms/molecules. I'm just guesstimating here.

I feel like the biggest reason it's that it's just both cool and convenient for characters to be able to change into their costumes instead of having them fight with civilian clothes, cut the scene for them to change, or have them in uniform at all times.

Not related to telekinesis and mutants, but in the MCU it feels like a ton of characters can just change into costume with their powers... Wanda, Vision, Thor, Loki, Strange. Tony could also just have the suit "grow" around him instead of putting it on, etc.

[Devaishwarya]

I feel like the biggest reason it's that it's just both cool and convenient for characters to be able to change into their costumes instead of having them fight with civilian clothes, cut the scene for them to change, or have them in uniform at all times.

Not related to telekinesis and mutants, but in the MCU it feels like a ton of characters can just change into costume with their powers... Wanda, Vision, Thor, Loki, Strange. Tony could also just have the suit "grow" around him instead of putting it on, etc.

Yupp. Storm can do it with her electricity. It really isn't as "awesome" or "original" a feat as some think it is. Personally, while it can look "so cool!" I always found it to be a waste of panel and story space.

[Grinning Soul]

I feel like the biggest reason it's that it's just both cool and convenient for characters to be able to change into their costumes instead of having them fight with civilian clothes, cut the scene for them to change, or have them in uniform at all times.

Not related to telekinesis and mutants, but in the MCU it feels like a ton of characters can just change into costume with their powers... Wanda, Vision, Thor, Loki, Strange. Tony could also just have the suit "grow" around him instead of putting it on, etc.

It's very practical in terms of costume indeed. But if you allow it as actual molecular/atomic re-arrangement, it gets harder to justify other issues the character may encounter. Atomic manipulation at that level is a ridiculous power to have if you think of the broad applications: you'll never suffocate, die of thirst or hunger, temperature around you is whatever you choose, you can build whatever you want, transform lead to gold, nothing prevents you from re-arraging your whole body, so you would be able to change your appearance at will, etc... And depening on the scale you can implement that? Whoa...

So... I think Hickman being a bit more science fiction oriented has thought about it and that's why most characters wouldn't have access to that power. Maybe not even Exodus. But again: it's a guesstimate.

[Devaishwarya]

Question:
Based on what's actually written in-story...

Should Jean be able to hone her telekinesis to the point where it's on par with her OL telepathy?
Going by what we've seen the PF accomplish with her TK, I say, "Yes".

[Grinning Soul]

Question:
Based on what's actually written in-story...

Should Jean be able to hone her telekinesis to the point where it's on par with her OL telepathy?
Going by what we've seen the PF accomplish with her TK, I say, "Yes".

I think so. I don't think the Force gives her anything she doesn't already have. I think it just boosts her current levels. Besides, both powers are generated by the same mind, the separation between telekinesis and telepathy is probably more theoretical than practical for someone whose mind can do both. So I don't see why one should be more limited than the other (one could be easier for her to use than the other, so it would be a matter of skill, not talent).

At the same time, I think it was a deliberate choice they made and we'll probably not see her developing her tk further while those current creators are in charge.

[Devaishwarya]

Unstable molecules within the fabric that are responsive to the power applied to "destabalise" and change them. For most, it's not actual molecular transmutation in the strictest sense.

[Grinning Soul]

Unstable molecules within the fabric that are responsive to the power applied to "destabalise" and change them. For most, it's not actual molecular transmutation in the strictest sense.

Exactly: writers can always come up with some pseudo-scientific explanation and limit the power. But it's kinda BS if you think about it... if fabric has those "unstable molecules", why doesn't any other matter in the liquid or solid state? Unless the fabric is special, of course.

So, sure, we have to accept whatever silly explanation they'd give us. But I think it's less likely we'll get something like this nowadays. It really depends on the writers, though.

[Omega_DCD]

Jean has telekinetically transferred her clothes/costumes a few times...in Alaska when she's helping Scott recuperate and she first reveals her wearing the Phoenix costume

And in an issue with her, Scott and Nate Grey and they end up battling the two M'Kraan Crystal guardians...

Given her power levels currently, even with her TK not being considered Omega level, she was able to deconstruct those telefloronics on a molecular level in X-Force, so it's within her scope.

[Devaishwarya]

I believe it was Reed Richards who invented unstable molecules as an application specifically in costume design when the F4 initially got their powers. As a means to 'explain' why his costume stretched, Sue's costume turned invisible, and Johnny's could withstand his intense heat.

[Grinning Soul]

Jean has telekinetically transferred her clothes/costumes a few times...in Alaska when she's helping Scott recuperate and she first reveals her wearing the Phoenix costume

And in an issue with her, Scott and Nate Grey and they end up battling the two M'Kraan Crystal guardians...

Given her power levels currently, even with her TK not being considered Omega level, she was able to deconstruct those telefloronics on a molecular level in X-Force, so it's within her scope.

In the X-Force she didn't work on her own, though. So I don't know what was her doing and what was Black Tom's (or even Sage).

But it's true: in that X-Man issue, she changes into her uniform from one panel to another and Scott doesn't. So it's probably her tk stuff. But, back then, they had plans for her to actually be with the Phoenix. And, indeed, regardless of that plot, she was already with the Phoenix: she had had a fragment with her since Inferno.

The question is: can she do it without the Force? I think so. But I don't think the current writers agree.

[Grinning Soul]

I believe it was Reed Richards who invented unstable molecules as an application specifically in costume design when the F4 initially got their powers. As a means to 'explain' why his costume stretched, Sue's costume turned invisible, and Johnny's could withstand his intense heat.

Yes, it was. But that's what I meant: if those unstable molecules are actually the special ones Reed created (instead of simply molecules which are not stable - which usually are very reactive on their own), then it's something you could use to justify the usage for those specific clothes made of that fabric. But it would be limited to the amount of molecules... you wouldn't be able to change from a bikini to a maxi dress, for instance (unless you were wearing a really thick bikini).

[Daedra]

This is what I was referencing with my previous comment

[Phoenixx9]

This is what I was referencing with my previous comment

Yes, Jean is capable of telekinetically transforming her clothing even without Phoenix Power.