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  1. #2551
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harpsikord View Post
    Jean was secondary to Quentin. I'm not just talking about Jean's husband and boyfriend, I'm talking about the fact that she only really existed in this issue to hold Quentin's hand while he basically did everything himself. We didn't even get the cool showdown between Jean and the twisted Quentin that the dialogue implied because Quentin killed it telepathically like Jean said he probably couldn't, all to show that Jean was wrong about that.



    The issue is that he probably wouldn't have done it if it was a man. He has a history, starting with Dark Phoenix, of telling these tales of women who are powerful being knocked down a peg - he does so to Jean, to Scarlet Witch, to a certain extent to Invisible Woman. And when he made his own strong female character she was mostly T & A. Also I cannot emphasize enough that his only real lasting impression on the X-Mythos is the unnecessary demonization of a strong and powerful woman that the writer and previous artist were content to allow to continue being powerful and capable and confident.
    I mean why shouldn't Jean have been secondary? These issues have largely been about Quentin and his character journey. That being said Jean stood out and practically stole the spotlight in some places.

  2. #2552
    hate cant reach you here Harpsikord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by loke13 View Post
    I mean why shouldn't Jean have been secondary? These issues have largely been about Quentin and his character journey. That being said Jean stood out and practically stole the spotlight in some places.
    It's a criticism at large of how the book focuses on characters, particularly the female characters. They don't really have any worth unless it's to prop up the character of their male counterparts. Phoebe's been used to prop up Quentin, Sage for Hank, Jean for Logan, Hank, AND Quentin.
    "We come into this world alone and we leave the same way. The time we spent in between - time spent alive, sharing, learning together... is all that makes life worth living." - Jean Grey

  3. #2553
    Astonishing Member Factor's Avatar
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    My Jean Grey redesign, using Dauterman's Gala look as a body/hair template:

    20210421_191456.jpg

  4. #2554
    Incredible Member Anodyne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by otipep_90 View Post
    Itís ridiculous that The Dark Phoenix Saga has become such a president for all Phoenix Hosts scumming to their darker urges, when clearly she Jean had been groomed to become Dark Phoenix. This reminds me of Byrneís interpolation. Them at the Phoenix Firce was malevolent spirit, when it was Mastermind all along! The Phoenix Force works better as a Cosmic Abstract, not a manipulative entity.
    As ridiculous as Precedent Trump? (Sorry; I couldn't resist.)
    Beverly Allen, the Bee--with honey and stinger.

    "If humans have souls, then clones will have them, too."--Arthur Caplan

  5. #2555
    Ultimate Member Wiccan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    My Jean Grey redesign, using Dauterman's Gala look as a body/hair template:

    20210421_191456.jpg
    Looks incredible!

  6. #2556
    Fantastic Member Conor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    My Jean Grey redesign, using Dauterman's Gala look as a body/hair template:

    20210421_191456.jpg
    Love it, great design!

  7. #2557
    Spectacular Member otipep_90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anodyne View Post
    As ridiculous as Precedent Trump? (Sorry; I couldn't resist.)
    I stand corrected.

  8. #2558
    Spectacular Member otipep_90's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    My Jean Grey redesign, using Dauterman's Gala look as a body/hair template:

    20210421_191456.jpg
    This is amazing! Reminds me of Teen Jean’s X-Men Blue costume, but without the Jamaican Flag motif. The green hip panels almost evoke the mini skirt. She should have been wearing something like this and with a change to Marvel Woman after the HoX resurrection.

  9. #2559
    Astonishing Member Factor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Looks incredible!
    Quote Originally Posted by Conor View Post
    Love it, great design!
    Thanks, guys

    Quote Originally Posted by otipep_90 View Post
    This is amazing! Reminds me of Teen Jean’s X-Men Blue costume, but without the Jamaican Flag motif. The green hip panels almost evoke the mini skirt. She should have been wearing something like this and with a change to Marvel Woman after the HoX resurrection.
    Thank you! She desperately needs a new look.
    I tried picking what I liked about several different versions. Some of my biggest influences were Portacio's X-factor look (the shoulder pads), Jim Lee's classic one from the 90s (headgear), X-men Evolution (colors, hands and the green triangle shape) and X-men Blue (the use of gold and the addition of boots similar to Quitely's NXM ones). The hip part is a nod to Asrar's Red costume, but the resemblance to the skirt wasn't lost on me haha.

  10. #2560
    Incredible Member andreikes's Avatar
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    Does Jean have a chance to participate in this program in the space that Storm talks about in S. W. O. R. D?

  11. #2561
    Astonishing Member Rang10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andreikes View Post
    Does Jean have a chance to participate in this program in the space that Storm talks about in S. W. O. R. D?
    I think that she will be on X-men, so no Sword to Jean.

  12. #2562
    Extraordinary Member DragonPiece's Avatar
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    New X-Force issue was good for Jean, I'll admit. I said Percy was only continuing to use her as a love interest for logan and clearly from this issue, that isn't the case.

  13. #2563
    Smart & Swift & Violent Kitty&Piotr<3's Avatar
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    X-Force #19 was a solid Jean issue. She wasn't the focus, but she was depicted as a capable, maybe even quite powerful and experienced, hero with the kind of calming mom influence that is often overplayed and a couple of subtle hints that maybe she is a little scarier than just "mom". That's all you can ask for.

    And did she just unquit X-Force? Thank the Bright Lady!


    Quote Originally Posted by DragonPiece View Post
    New X-Force issue was good for Jean, I'll admit. I said Percy was only continuing to use her as a love interest for logan and clearly from this issue, that isn't the case.
    Even before today's issue, the bulk of her interactions in the book have been with Beast lol
    Last edited by Kitty&Piotr<3; 04-21-2021 at 08:40 PM.
    "Cyclops loves wilted roses because they remind him of dead redheads."
    -Gail

  14. #2564
    Beware! Daedra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by otipep_90 View Post
    This is amazing! Reminds me of Teen Jeanís X-Men Blue costume, but without the Jamaican Flag motif. The green hip panels almost evoke the mini skirt. She should have been wearing something like this and with a change to Marvel Woman after the HoX resurrection.
    I so want Jean to go for the adult version of her codname, wonder woman did it, invisible woman did it and so superwoman, time for Marvel Girl to do the same

    "Can we just say that she is a chaos magic avatar and that her origin is split across the multiverse? She has no beginning, she has no end, she exists to be the improbability of the cosmos. She's neither mutant, inhuman, sorcereress or otherwise. Everything and nothing." (Anonymous)

  15. #2565
    Smart & Swift & Violent Kitty&Piotr<3's Avatar
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    The thing about Marvel Woman is that would mean Jean discovering she's a woman, which happened ages ago.

    If she can't be Jean or Phoenix and the idea is that she is hyper-femme, I would have her go with Lady Marvel.
    "Cyclops loves wilted roses because they remind him of dead redheads."
    -Gail

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