Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2021

[Mercury]

These little continuity blind spots irk me. What does Claremont call this then...





It's not like this was some random obscure issue like a Marvel Team-Up...the Phalanx Covenant was an X-Book line wide crossover.

I'm with Havok83, Omega_DCD: What is the discrepancy here?

[DarkMagnus]

jajajajaja awesome weon🇨🇱🇨🇱

Yes I’m from Chile!! Glad to see a fellow chilean X-Men fan

Bakan qlao

We better stop speaking chilean spanish (the worst spanish)

[Omega_DCD]

I dont get it. whats the problem?

I'm with Havok83, Omega_DCD: What is the discrepancy here?

She says "I might even be able to teach him a thing or two about the art of psychic combat"...not only does she sound unsure(Jean's telepathic experience and skills far exceed Cable's, so of course she could teach him things), but it also reads as if she has never done exactly that, when she has, as shown in the Phalanx covenant scene posted.

Furthermore there have been various Cable/X-Men/X-Force issues throughout the 90s with Scott recommending that Nathan train with Jean telepathically, especially after that mindlink with Reignfire/Sunspot unlocked some of his old Askani memories. They may have not all been combat lessons, but she still clearly gave him direct field training.

Is it just me?

[loke13]

She says "I might even be able to teach him a thing or two about the art of psychic combat"...not only does she sound unsure(Jean's telepathic experience and skills far exceed Cable's, so of course she could teach him things), but it also reads as if she has never done exactly that, when she has, as shown in the Phalanx covenant scene posted.

Furthermore there have been various Cable/X-Men/X-Force issues throughout the 90s with Scott recommending that Nathan train with Jean telepathically, especially after that mindlink with Reignfire/Sunspot unlocked some of his old Askani memories. They may have not all been combat lessons, but she still clearly gave him direct field training.

Is it just me?

Eh it doesn't irk me Cable is written consistently as being inexperienced when it comes to using his psychic powers so imo this lines up with that.

[Phoenixx9]

Is it just me?

No, it is not. I have often seen this and thought about it.

Why do all of these characters (and some fans) think that they are all more powerful, more experienced and more battle ready than Jean? Jean has been an X-Man, fighting since her mid-teens. True, her telepathy was unlocked a few years later, that is still many years in battle over all other telepaths, whether they used their own in personal living or not. When Xavier released Jean's TP, she was immediately operating at a high level. If Marvel (and those fans) want a low-level telepath, they can pick any of the others including their favorite to be it, because it ain't Jean Grey!

[Omega_DCD]

Eh it doesn't irk me Cable is written consistently as being inexperienced when it comes to using his psychic powers so imo this lines up with that.

The issue isn't Cable's experience level, but the fact that the scene ignores precedent that Jean has taught Cable "a thing or two" about psychic combat. She took him on his maden voyage to the Astral Plane...she caution him not to get swept up in the rush, she showed him how to seize memories and moments of triumph as a source of strength and use it to attack, etc.

I mean, just because this era is the first time Jean and Cable were on a team together doesn't mean it's the first time they've had significant moments together.

[Havok83]

I dont think it ignores anything. I took it as even though she has trained with him before she could still be able to teach him one or more things. She didnt exhaust her knowledge base when it came to him

[WallStreeter]

No, it is not. I have often seen this and thought about it.

Why do all of these characters (and some fans) think that they are all more powerful, more experienced and more battle ready than Jean? Jean has been an X-Man, fighting since her mid-teens. True, her telepathy was unlocked a few years later, that is still many years in battle over all other telepaths, whether they used their own in personal living or not. When Xavier released Jean's TP, she was immediately operating at a high level. If Marvel (and those fans) want a low-level telepath, they can pick any of the others including their favorite to be it, because it ain't Jean Grey!

Because they know she is more powerful and capable than their favorite character, so they just want to trash her online

Though it’s silly.

Just because a character can be someone doesn’t make them the better character.

[Phoenixx9]

Because they know she is more powerful and capable than their favorite character, so they just want to trash her online

Though it’s silly.

Just because a character can be someone doesn’t make them the better character.

Exactatiously.

A character is not loved (should not be loved) just because of power level, but by all of the things that make up that character.

Silly people do silly things.

[Mercury]

She says "I might even be able to teach him a thing or two about the art of psychic combat"...not only does she sound unsure(Jean's telepathic experience and skills far exceed Cable's, so of course she could teach him things), but it also reads as if she has never done exactly that, when she has, as shown in the Phalanx covenant scene posted.

I honestly, I read that as her thinking sarcastically to herself.

Furthermore there have been various Cable/X-Men/X-Force issues throughout the 90s with Scott recommending that Nathan train with Jean telepathically, especially after that mindlink with Reignfire/Sunspot unlocked some of his old Askani memories. They may have not all been combat lessons, but she still clearly gave him direct field training.

I don't doubt you, but I would have to see these particular instances to comment on them. However, it wouldn't surprise me if they, once again, resorted to undermining her capabilities, which have been established and re-established over the years as being second to none. There's almost a need to knock her down a few pegs, either to compensate for what the Dark Phoenix did or to uplift other characters that are not at her level of power.

[Omega_DCD]

I dont think it ignores anything. I took it as even though she has trained with him before she could still be able to teach him one or more things. She didnt exhaust her knowledge base when it came to him

That "still" would have been correct and add much needed context, but without it....ugh.

I honestly, I read that as her thinking sarcastically to herself.



I don't doubt you, but I would have to see these particular instances to comment on them.

I will look through my scans and gather them

[Del torro]

So... How do they reconcile Adult Cable being a novice telepath and needing Jean to train him in Astral combat, with all the Telepathy feats and Experience kid cable got when he was around. (yet at the same time cable was trained by the askani in psychic combat, so why would he be so inexperienced in Astral combat)

I feel like they should have mind wiped the kid when they sent him back (set up a timer like with the O5, to bring back his memories when he's older).
Adult Cable didn't know that Scott and Jean were Redd and slym dayspring that raised him, didn't know he was their son and thought he was a clone of stryfe.

Urgh, there are too many plot holes and messy paradoxes in the whole cable timeline. It's best not to worry about stuff and just ignore it.

[Devaishwarya]

All Jean was thinking in that first panel was "Have a little more faith in me, Cable...I know a thing or two more about this "mind-war stuff" that may surprise you".
Underscoring that she is indeed experienced enough to successfully execute the plan.

[Omega_DCD]

So... How do they reconcile Adult Cable being a novice telepath and needing Jean to train him in Astral combat, with all the Telepathy feats and Experience kid cable got when he was around. (yet at the same time cable was trained by the askani in psychic combat, so why would he be so inexperienced in Astral combat)

I feel like they should have mind wiped the kid when they sent him back (set up a timer like with the O5, to bring back his memories when he's older).
Adult Cable didn't know that Scott and Jean were Redd and slym dayspring that raised him, didn't know he was their son and thought he was a clone of stryfe.

Urgh, there are too many plot holes and messy paradoxes in the whole cable timeline. It's best not to worry about stuff and just ignore it.

I think at some point in his many wars and battles, Cable just gets disinterested in his psionic powers(beyond the bare minimum of just holding the T.O. Virus at bay) and leans heavily into his Guns’N’Ammo style. Without use, those powers and skills wane drastically, until he eventually works at building them up again

All Jean was thinking in that first panel was "Have a little more faith in me, Cable...I know a thing or two more about this "mind-war stuff" that may surprise you".
Underscoring that she is indeed experienced enough to successfully execute the plan.

Fair enough take, it just would have worked better for me if it was tweaked a bit into “…after all, who was it that taught you a thing or two about psychic combat?”…but I can see I’m in the minority so I won’t belabor the point. Scans incoming soon just to finish up

[Omega_DCD]

I don't doubt you, but I would have to see these particular instances to comment on them.

First Cable is stubborn after Scott tries to get him to work with Jean. Downplays his own abilities and prefers to stick to his guns, in a manner of speaking