Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2021

[rhaenylis]

She’s got an intelligence ranking close to 0. What crap! Why even bother with these stupid cards.

Jean is luckier than Lorna who has only 2 despite having a PhD in geophysics and Rogue who has only 1

[Grinning Soul]

Jean is luckier than Lorna who has only 2 despite having a PhD in geophysics and Rogue who has only 1

Rogue's intelligence score was probably a mistake and I expect they'll correct it (her intelligence is set as 2 or whatever is the average in other places). As for Lorna, I don't know. Maybe 2 is appropriate. Having PhD (or being any type of scientist) doesn't require you to possess above the average intelligence, after all. It does require a lot of work and dedication.

[rhaenylis]

Rogue's intelligence score was probably a mistake and I expect they'll correct it (her intelligence is set as 2 or whatever is the average in other places). As for Lorna, I don't know. Maybe 2 is appropriate. Having PhD (or being any type of scientist) doesn't require you to possess above the average intelligence, after all. It does require a lot of work and dedication.

I know but she has also been reported as being highly intelligent a few times (and Havok who has done the same studies is considered smarter)

[Grinning Soul]

I know but she has also been reported as being highly intelligent a few times (and Havok who has done the same studies is considered smarter)

Well, when you have a scale that goes up to 7, 2 is the average and anything bellow that is thrown in the same category, things get a little wonky, right?

What we would consider above-average is still probably part of the category 2 in that weird scale. That's why I said that *maybe* 2 is appropriate for Lorna.

Having the degree doesn't mean much in terms of intelligence, though. If Hank had studied the same thing as Lorna, would that make Lorna a genius?

The point is, maybe she's indeed 3. But it's not because she has a PhD.

[Phoenixx9]

She’s got an intelligence ranking close to 0. What crap! Why even bother with these stupid cards.

It is not zero. Jean has an Intelligence rank of 3. Granted, it should be 4.

[Spiderfan001]

Rogue's intelligence score was probably a mistake and I expect they'll correct it (her intelligence is set as 2 or whatever is the average in other places). As for Lorna, I don't know. Maybe 2 is appropriate. Having PhD (or being any type of scientist) doesn't require you to possess above the average intelligence, after all. It does require a lot of work and dedication.

It is not zero. Jean has an Intelligence rank of 3. Granted, it should be 4.

She said she didn't get an A, so may be she just passed.Have we seen her be smart?Although it's Leah so maybe it's unreliable.

Spider-man's a 4 and he has constantly held his own against Iron-man(Hacked his systems 4 times on seperate ocassions) and Reed(hacked his inhibitor collar, defused bomb that Reed and Tony couldn't etc.) in smarts.Both have admitted he's smart af , along w/ people like Banner,Blue Marvel,Hank Pym(said he was much smarter than him) and Beast.He should be a 5 minimum going 6.He has the feats to back all this up.

These rankings are incredibly unreliable.Although does Jean have some smarts Idk about, because 3 as an avg. makes sense.If she does then it's a 4.

[jmc247]

She said she didn't get an A, so may be she just passed.Have we seen her be smart?Although it's Leah so maybe it's unreliable.

The Lorna rank of 2 from the 90s was incorrect even for what they were saying in the comics back then.



But, there is a disconnect between saying a character is intelligent and showing they are intelligent. I give much more credit to writers who show instead of tell. Only maybe two writers actually showed Lorna to be worthy of a 4.

[Grinning Soul]

Mercury posted the actual scale before and it goes like this:

Intelligence:

1 - Bellow Normal
2 - Normal
3 - Above Average
4 - Gifted
5 - Genius
6 - Super-genius
7 - Omniscient


On top of human intelligence being difficult to define/measure on its own, like I said, it's a weird scale so it's hard to use it.

It's possible that what we would consider in the real world as "above average" is still part of tier 2.

I don't have any problem with Lorna being at 3. I just don't know if she should be, because I don't know what they consider "intelligence". If it's simply IQ, then, according to the panel jmc247 shared, than she should be at 3 indeed.

As for Spidey, 4 seemed appropriate at some point of his history. They kept making him more and more intelligent throughout the years, though, so maybe they need to revise that.

But since this thread is about Jean, let's talk about her: I think tier 3 for her is perfect, when we consider a broader idea of human intelligence that includes other forms of intelligence such as existential, intrapersonal, interpersonal, verbal, naturalist etc...

[Spiderfan001]

The Lorna rank of 2 from the 90s was incorrect even for what they were saying in the comics back then.



But, there is a disconnect between saying a character is intelligent and showing they are intelligent. I give much more credit to writers who show instead of tell. Only maybe two writers actually showed Lorna to be worthy of a 4.

Oh okay, so it's canon but most writers are unaware and thus it gets ignored.

[Mercury]

You can be mad at someone saying Marvel doesn't care about Jean (they clearly don't), but unfortunately, you are not entitled to have your opinion mandated as everyone else's.

True. But we can note when a "fan" continually derides and degrades a character and question why they do it. In addition to some of the untoward things you have posted regarding Jean (e.g, the racism comment, saying she will "never" be redeemed as a character, minimizing her current canon, etc.), her history, her role, look at your signature quotes... 😂🤣😂🤣 Not only does it become tiring to read the constant negativity, but it's also a source of puzzlement. It's like, why waste the time writing about a character if all you're going to do is **** on them. I mean, by all means, do you. In a sense, I sometimes thrive on the negativity because it gives me cause to highlight what I love about this character and why I think she is undeniably central to the X-Men mythos.

Jean is luckier than Lorna who has only 2 despite having a PhD in geophysics and Rogue who has only 1

That is so gross and totally inaccurate. I'm sorry, but if you've managed to earn a Ph.D., you are above average intelligent.

The Lorna rank of 2 from the 90s was incorrect even for what they were saying in the comics back then.



But, there is a disconnect between saying a character is intelligent and showing they are intelligent. I give much more credit to writers who show instead of tell. Only maybe two writers actually showed Lorna to be worthy of a 4.

Aside from confirming her high level of intelligence, that panel is terrible 😂🤣😂🤣

[Mercury]

On a random note, here are my favorite Jean looks, Dauterman style:

[Mercury]

[Mercury]

That time Mephisto referred to Jean's soul as "valuable and unique" and "a rare and wondrous example of [the human soul]."

[Devaishwarya]

She’s got an intelligence ranking close to 0. What crap! Why even bother with these stupid cards.

Her Intelligence is three. It would help if one knew how to read the graph.

[Mercury]

Her Intelligence is three. It would help if one knew how to read the graph.