Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2021

[andreikes]

Cassandra Nova is joining the Marauders... So the ending of X-Men Red is finally getting picked up (for better or worse).

Will Jean get involved

Steve Orlando posted on his twitter

https://twitter.com/thesteveorlando/...40053609889807

[Grinning Soul]

I am currently reading Soule's run and watching season 3. I love Daredevil. He is becoming my favorite character this days. I will check that issue again. Was that Bendis's run?
I am not sure I understand what you are trying to say (not you need to I will read the issue and come back to you) until I read that issue but they way I see it. This era(Krakoa) has been a lot ambiguous about these relationships. Logan doesn't open up as person so it kinda works for him but it also works against to character progress. Percy didn't really made any progress with that.

Matt Murdock is my favourite Marvel character. And I say that without being afraid of being murdered here because it's unfair to compare him with Jean due to panel time alone. He's always had his solo book and he wasn't kept dead for 20+ years. :)

Anyway, yes: that's from Bendis run. Back then, Bendis' writing had some quirks, but they hadn't become clutches yet. Plus, I think Maleev's art is superb in that run.

Percy's scene doesn't work for me in many levels. I'll try to keep it short, but if you want to talk more in-depth about it, I'd prefer to do it on a PM, all right?

1) Looking from the perspective of the writer, it seems kinda unfocused. What was his goal there (ideally, every scene should have at least one goal)? Show Quentin's struggle? Have Jean offer herself some advice? Have her suggest him to talk to Logan? It seems he tried to do all of them but, in such short scene, it might have been a little too ambitious.

2) Jean's characterization was a problem for me. I agree with what Cranger was saying. It'd make more sense for her to talk about her romantic experiences when it comes to fighting and making up and if so, bringing up Logan is just weird because we never saw them fighting per se (other than some outbursts of irritation), let alone under a romantic circumstance. If she was talking about friendships, she didn't need to mention Logan either. In my opinion, that's what read as very indulgent from Percy's part, therefore, it feels more like fanfiction. As great as fanfictions can be, they're mostly indulgent endeavors. They're not professional by definition.

3) Then Percy forces Logan into the conversation a second time and it seems too much out of the blue (and again: indulgent). If Quentin had, for instance, said something like: "No offense, Jean, but I don't want to talk about my romantic problems with you" or Jean had volunteered it herself as: "Look, Quentin, you're not alone. If you don't feel comfortable talking about it with me, try Logan. Being team-mates creates a bond you might not be aware of yet. Besides, he's actually a great friend you can always count on". Something like that would feel more natural to the conversation and it would achieve the same goal. You get what I mean?

Anyway, if you'd like to keep on this subject, maybe we should take it to PMs? I really don't want to derail too much the other topics and most posters seemed to have moved on already.

[Kitty&Piotr<3]

Will Jean get involved

Steve Orlando posted on his twitter

https://twitter.com/thesteveorlando/...40053609889807

A rare instance of non-Cyclops-related Jean Grey canon being acknowledged! I wouldn't expect her to be involved, as I imagine he is just saying Red informs Nova's appearance in his book. It's awesome of him to acknowledge Red.

[Mercury]

A rare instance of non-Cyclops-related Jean Grey canon being acknowledged! I wouldn't expect her to be involved, as I imagine he is just saying Red informs Nova's appearance in his book. It's awesome of him to acknowledge Red.

I think he’s going to reference it. We’ll see.

[BESTXMAN]

Will Marvel ever let Jean be more than just the girl that the protagonists fight over? Being more than just the girlfriend of the leader? Being more than the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback?

[Grinning Soul]

Will Marvel ever let Jean be more than just the girl that the protagonists fight over? Being more than just the girlfriend of the leader? Being more than the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback?

Okay. I have to ask. Are you serious or are you just trolling?

[Kitty&Piotr<3]

Will Marvel ever let Jean be more than just the girl that the protagonists fight over? Being more than just the girlfriend of the leader? Being more than the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback?

Lol not anytime soon, unless they bring back Scemma.

[Grinning Soul]

Lol not anytime soon, unless they bring back Scemma.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but last time the "protagonists" fought over her was during Schism. While Jean was dead (not exactly a detriment to her character growth, was it?). And Scott was in a relationship with Emma.

Then Scott tried to enraged Logan by mentioning understanding her better after AvX. But they didn't actually fight.

[Mercury]

Will Marvel ever let Jean be more than just the girl that the protagonists fight over? Being more than just the girlfriend of the leader? Being more than the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback?

She has always been much more than that. In fact, I don't think she has ever been relegated to "just the girl that the protagonists fight over...the girlfriend of the leader...the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback." What I have noticed, however, amongst certain fans and detractors alike, are blatant attempts to overlook her actual history as relayed in the comic books and ignore how she has been and is currently regarded, i.e., as Xavier's first student, discoverer of Scott Summers, and a self-sacrificing founding member of the original X-Men, founder of the original X-Factor, and founder and co-leader of the current X-Men.

This irritates me to no end.

[Mercury]

And please, save me the "I'm just pointing out that they're not doing her character justice" bullshit because that doesn't require ignoring and mischaracterizing Jean's long and varied history and reducing it to cliches that it has never adhered to.

[Grinning Soul]

She has always been much more than that. In fact, I don't think she has ever been relegated to "just the girl that the protagonists fight over...the girlfriend of the leader...the head cheerleader that dates the quarterback." What I have noticed, however, amongst certain fans and detractors alike, are blatant attempts to overlook her actual history as relayed in the comic books and ignore how she has been and is currently regarded, i.e., as Xavier's first student, discoverer of Scott Summers, and a self-sacrificing founding member of the original X-Men, founder of the original X-Factor, and founder and co-leader of the current X-Men.

This irritates me to no end.

I know!

That's why I asked if they were actually serious.

I really dislike some of Duggan's portrayal of her. But Jean is kicking Nightmare's derrière by herself while Scott...



But he's the protagonist???

Am I that insane that I just can't understand how can people see it the other way around?

[Mercury]

I know!

That's why I asked if they were actually serious.

I really dislike some of Duggan's portrayal of her. But Jean is kicking Nightmare's derrière by herself while Scott...



But he's the protagonist???

Am I that insane that I just can't understand how can people see it the other way around?

Chiiile…I’m of the suspicion that some of these people actually want some of their warped narratives to be the reality. Sorry, they’re simply not.

[Grinning Soul]

Chiiile…I’m of the suspicion that some of these people actually want some of their warped narratives to be the reality. Sorry, they’re simply not.

I think the echo chamber inside their own heads is just impervious to reality.

A lot of the things in this Krakoa era are debatable. But some really aren't.

[mike7171]

I think he’s going to reference it. We’ll see.

i guess this is more like, if you are not upto speed with who Cassandra Nova is, these are the comics you want start with.

[Mercury]

I think the echo chamber inside their own heads is just impervious to reality.

A lot of the things in this Krakoa era are debatable. But some really aren't.

True. I also think that characters of Jean's stature and reputation naturally attract this level of derision and degradation. I mean, let's get real--and I apologize for this in advance because I know that you relate to him and he's one of your favorite characters--but Jean has always been infinitely more interesting and powerful than Scott Summers and--dare I say--Wolverine. Is it any wonder that they are both so attracted to her?

Let's keep it real.