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  1. #766
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    Doubtful. She's black in the live action movies, in the show, and in the latest animated feature. These are intentional decisions in the casting calls to make her ethnically different from how she is in comics. There's no reason for them to ever walk back on it and get bad press over white washing what the common audience expects is now a black character. We are much more likely to have comics Iris become black with the next reboot (however far ahead that may be) than her being changed back to white in external media.

    It doesn't really matter if she's popular or not. That's just what DC wants to do. They want to pretend to increase diversity by changing the race of supporting characters.
    We will see. But if DC wants to have diverse characters then they should create new ones instead of reacebending existing characters. I can tell you how many people were mad when they racebended Cyclone, Hawkman, Gordon and Catwoman because when a movie is announced the general audience will research the characters and complain when they see that they don't look like the characters. Racebending is also controversal.

  2. #767
    Astonishing Member John Venus's Avatar
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    Who cares if some people get angry on the internet?

    There are plenty of people happy to see themselves represented on screen and willing to pay to see them. Racebending hasn't sunk any show or movie only poor story telling has. This isn't the first time Catwoman has been played by a black actress. Plus we got DC's Festival of Heroes, Milestone Returns and in the near future, adaptations of Naomi, Static and Blue Beetle so it's not like DC isn't pushing existing minority characters either.

  3. #768
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I don't think they're chasing exact media synergy. Just probably depends on the property and what, say, a media adaption is going for.

    I mean, JSA:WW2 just used Barry so I'm not expecting Wally to pop up in animated films any time soon.
    A lot of what typed the other day was mostly late-night ramblings, and mostly speculation. I also agree that I don't think DC is trying to do a highly correlated media synergy with Wally being the main Flash again. I don't think Wally has an immediate future in other DC's properties other than Young Justice and appearances in video games, ala DC Legends and Lego DC Heroes.

    I'm mostly referring to the long term, what this could potentially mean for future adaptations that have yet to be thought up of.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    We can agree to disagree on this.

    Looking at the current pop culture landscape, I find these arguments claiming that Wally would not work in a big budget adaptation or the audience would not accept him or that his presence would create confusion to be both apocryphal and antiquated.
    This.

    I get the jade-ness of this whole situation, especially given how much the head brass of DC really wanted to just not acknowledge Wally for a very long time. I don't even think Wally will appear in anything live-action any time soon, but I won't deny the possibility of it. I think audiences can totally grasp the concept of different characters and/or actors who can play the same superhero, we've seen it before. We saw it within DC when Grant Gustin and Ezra Miller met in the Crisis on Infinite Earths TV crossover, and that didn't confuse people. People know the Snyder-Cut version of Justice League takes place in a different continuity as the main DCEU. Even if audiences do get confused on certain plot elements, when has that ever stop any property from making money. My parents have a hard time following a lot of superhero films, yet they still watch them because they're entertaining. How is not understanding multiple Flashes exist in a multiverse stopped any consumer from giving money away to DC?

    If the concern stems from what the higher-ups think or want, just know that the management of DC is always changing their minds. Not just in comics, but in other media. Producers went in hard on Zack Snyder at the start of the cinematic universe, and now they don't want to do anything with him (despite finally releasing the Snyder-Cut). Planned movies and comics are always getting shoved or canceled (goodbye Cyborg), ideas and plans for future installments are changed. Not only, but older management is also always replaced by younger people every so often. And every generation will bring in their own nostalgia, that's how we've gotten an influx 80s inspire properties. I have no doubt in my mind that the reason why Wally is so prominent again is that the newer management that took over last year was the generation that grew up with Wally (also Didio not being around also really helps).

    I do think the higher-ups at DC see the value of Wally as a brand outside of comics. I don't think he would have made any appearances in those video games, no matter how minor they were, or still have toys still being made of him if they didn't think they could make some money out of him. I also don't think DC would've made him the main Flash again if they didn't see how they could potentially profit from this in the long run, I just don't. It's probably not a concentrated attempt of synergy with other media, and I want to reiterate that I don't really believe we'll see anything tangible of Wally in other stuff (besides maybe Young Justice and/or potentially return of the classic DCAU) for at the very least a couple of years from now, but I won't rule out the possibility of it ever happening. I think Wally is too popular for that.

  4. #769
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    You need to differentiate the part of DC that makes comics and the part of DC that licenses out its IPs under WB to studios and manufacturers to make shows and toys and whatnot. Anything legitimately could happen in a post-Didio comics landscape. Everything outside the comics is where Wally will almost certainly stay permanently irrelevant. Us Wally fans got lucky with Young Justice purely because it showed him as Kid Flash and not EVER The Flash, and that show killed him off unceremoniously after a season of treating him like crap. Don't expect much more unless they really, somehow, do a DCAU reboot (very unlikely). Wouldn't surprise me if they did a DCAU reboot and made The Flash Barry, to be honest.
    Last edited by Dred; 05-14-2021 at 06:17 AM.

  5. #770
    Astonishing Member John Venus's Avatar
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    Animation production usually takes 2-3 years. I wouldn't expect Wally to show up until at least 2024 or thereabouts. He might return in Young Justice but that's a toss in the air. All of it depends on the success of DC's animated ventures. They need a big hit in order to attract attention to their smaller scale projects.

  6. #771
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    YJ will likely be the last we see of Wally West as we're generally familiar with him in external media, and even that is just purely as Kid Flash. We got lucky with DCAU Flash being Wally since it was influenced by comic creators (who, by and large, prefer Wally).

    Excluding the occasional one offs like a Kid Flash appearance in something like Teen Titans Go or whatever. Hard to really count those.

    It's kind of a catch 22: If the external Flash media stuff they do with Barry goes well, they'll just make more stuff with Barry. Likely adapting Wally stories to Barry like they do in the TV show. If it tanks and does poorly they're likely to just ignore the Flash franchise as a whole and stick to making Batman and teamup features and series.
    Last edited by Dred; 05-13-2021 at 03:56 PM.

  7. #772
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    It's a shame Miller's Justice League: Mortal never got made.
    We would have had our live action comic accurate Wally West Flash.
    And for the record, Megan Gale looked AMAZING as Wonder Woman.


    Damn it.
    "My name is Wally West. I'm the fastest man alive!"
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  8. #773
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veni View Post
    We will see. But if DC wants to have diverse characters then they should create new ones instead of reacebending existing characters. I can tell you how many people were mad when they racebended Cyclone, Hawkman, Gordon and Catwoman because when a movie is announced the general audience will research the characters and complain when they see that they don't look like the characters. Racebending is also controversal.
    who was mad about cyclone no one knows who she is
    E list characters people are unfamiliar with are perfect for racebending

  9. #774
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    who was mad about cyclone no one knows who she is
    E list characters people are unfamiliar with are perfect for racebending
    Quite a few people here, including myself were disappointed, including myself for one, were disappointed. I'll also say I find "E List, who cares" to be somewhat insulting towards existing fans of those characters, and the likewise towards the predicted rebuttal that "fans don't matter".

    Back on the subject of Wally, I'd like to remind people that Iris actually comes from the future and the West family in the present is her adopted family, and thus there's no reason her relatives all need to share the same race as her, even assuming they intend to keep racebending her in perpetuity. It's not impossible to have a white Wally with a black Iris.

  10. #775
    It sucks to be right BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    You need to differentiate the part of DC that makes comics and the part of DC that licenses out its IPs under WB to studios and manufacturers to make shows and toys and whatnot. Anything legitimately couldn't happen in a post-Didio comics landscape. Everything outside the comics is where Wally will almost certainly stay permanently irrelevant. Us Wally fans got lucky with Young Justice purely because it showed him as Kid Flash and not EVER The Flash, and that show killed him off unceremoniously after a season of treating him like crap. Don't expect much more unless they really, somehow, do a DCAU reboot (very unlikely). Wouldn't surprise me if they did a DCAU reboot and made The Flash Barry, to be honest.
    I used to think like you concerning internal shennanigans like that, but now I'm looking at those things in hindsight and, look:

    YJ saw the light of day wen Geoff Johns was this big name concerning adaptations. The same is true for SnyderVerse and most of CW. The insistence on dead momma Barry's origin is indication that the comic side and the cross-media side worked probably closer than what we believed.
    Wally started being sidelined on the tv show pretty much at the same time they realized he wasn't gonna stick as "Wally" in the comics.
    DC's social media atittude is COMPLETELLY different now towards fan favorite characters than it was during the Didio era. And tis is an RP department that also manages reaction to cross-media.

    What all that tells me is that regardless if Didio/Johns were calling the shots, being told what to do or neither, whoever made the decisions is either not there anymore or has changed their minds considerably.

    So, never say never. I wouldn't bet on a cross media Wally, but wouldn't be surprised by one either.
    ConnEr Kent flies. ConnOr Hawke has a bow. Batman's kid is named DamiAn.

    To do spoiler tags, use [ spoil ] at the start of the sentence and [ /spoil ] at the end, without the spaces. You're welcome!

  11. #776
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    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    I used to think like you concerning internal shennanigans like that, but now I'm looking at those things in hindsight and, look:

    • YJ saw the light of day wen Geoff Johns was this big name concerning adaptations. The same is true for SnyderVerse and most of CW. The insistence on dead momma Barry's origin is indication that the comic side and the cross-media side worked probably closer than what we believed.
    • Wally started being sidelined on the tv show pretty much at the same time they realized he wasn't gonna stick as "Wally" in the comics.
    DC's social media atittude is COMPLETELLY different now towards fan favorite characters than it was during the Didio era. And tis is an RP department that also manages reaction to cross-media.

    What all that tells me is that regardless if Didio/Johns were calling the shots, being told what to do or neither, whoever made the decisions is either not there anymore or has changed their minds considerably.
    I completely agree with those first two points. I know DC has different teams working on different branding, but there is a correlation between what happens in the comics and what gets makes it into external media.

    Can someone elaborate with the bolded. I follow DC Comics on Twitter, but I don't know how it's different now than it is then. I'm not surprised if it's different now in a post-Didio world, however, I'm just curious how it is now compared to what was then.

    So, never say never. I wouldn't bet on a cross media Wally, but wouldn't be surprised by one either.
    Again, I have the same opinion, though I lean more optimistic. We're probably very far-off from anything big-budgeted, but cameos in video games and maybe appearances in non-canon animated films I think aren't too much to think will happen.

  12. #777
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    Quote Originally Posted by transformers03 View Post
    Again, I have the same opinion, though I lean more optimistic. We're probably very far-off from anything big-budgeted, but cameos in video games and maybe appearances in non-canon animated films I think aren't too much to think will happen.
    Video games are different because the game developer need to keep ADDING NEW CHARACTERS so that more gamers could download their apps to support it. If they follow like the comic methods, then the game could not last more than 3 months and therefore shutting it down due to low download since they didn't add any new contents to keep the players around.

  13. #778
    Wally West Aficionado Spider-Ham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    It's a shame Miller's Justice League: Mortal never got made.
    We would have had our live action comic accurate Wally West Flash.
    And for the record, Megan Gale looked AMAZING as Wonder Woman.


    Damn it.
    JL Mortal is the only movie I need in my life. It would have been awesome.

  14. #779
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    Who knows how Mortal would've really gone if it ever got out of script outline.

    Quote Originally Posted by BohemiaDrinker View Post
    I used to think like you concerning internal shennanigans like that, but now I'm looking at those things in hindsight and, look:

    • YJ saw the light of day wen Geoff Johns was this big name concerning adaptations. The same is true for SnyderVerse and most of CW. The insistence on dead momma Barry's origin is indication that the comic side and the cross-media side worked probably closer than what we believed.
    • Wally started being sidelined on the tv show pretty much at the same time they realized he wasn't gonna stick as "Wally" in the comics.
    • DC's social media atittude is COMPLETELLY different now towards fan favorite characters than it was during the Didio era. And tis is an RP department that also manages reaction to cross-media.

    What all that tells me is that regardless if Didio/Johns were calling the shots, being told what to do or neither, whoever made the decisions is either not there anymore or has changed their minds considerably.

    So, never say never. I wouldn't bet on a cross media Wally, but wouldn't be surprised by one either.
    YJ had little to nothing to do with comic creators. They pinned Weisman for the show due to his popularity as a showrunner for animated series and Weisman did what he wanted.

    Which makes sense why they treated Wally so poorly since Weisman hates The Speed Force and, by any sort of deduction, would not care for Wally Flash comics.

    YJ kind of famously does its own things with some inspiration from popular stories, but little strict adherence.

    I assume the dead mom origin was for making Barry more convertible to external media, not the other way around. Batmanifying Barry is explicitly a decision you'd make to make him more easy to digest for a casual, non-comics audience.
    Last edited by Dred; 05-14-2021 at 06:27 AM.

  15. #780
    Astonishing Member Jekyll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Ham View Post
    JL Mortal is the only movie I need in my life. It would have been awesome.
    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    It's a shame Miller's Justice League: Mortal never got made.
    We would have had our live action comic accurate Wally West Flash.
    And for the record, Megan Gale looked AMAZING as Wonder Woman.


    Damn it.
    RELEASE THE MILLER CUT!!!!!!!
    AKA FlashFreak
    Favorite Characters:
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    MARVEL: Daredevil, Spider-Man (Peter Parker), Iron Fist, & Doctor Strange.

    Current Pulls: Daredevil, Amazing Spider-Man, Immortal Hulk, & The Flash.

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