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  1. #1726
    Astonishing Member Dataweaver's Avatar
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    Damian's excuse was a forced growth tank, which I have a great deal of difficulty seeing Cheshire having the means or interest in using on her daughter.

    Lian's excuse, currently, is Death Metal: the fractured continuity that everyone is aware of, and which is full of discontinuities. When and if they get around to straightening that out, their solution can be that Lian has always been older than Damian: she was born in, what, the late 70s, early 80s, publication-wise; Damian was conceived in a 198…7? 1986? story; I forget exactly which year it was, but I'm pretty sure it was early post-Crisis.

    Frankly, the single biggest headache to constructing a consistent timeline for the DCU lies in making the kids' ages make sense. My own inclination would be to start with the Robins, then figure out where everyone else fits around that.
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  2. #1727
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Well, my frame of reference would be Lian was born when Jason was Robin and still a teenager, and it's been relatively several years since then.

  3. #1728
    Extraordinary Member John Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    Wally has seen and talked to Starfire hundreds of times. At this point he shouldn't get gobsmacked by seeing her.

    It's not a big deal, it's just weird and unnecessary. You only get so much space to say what you want about characters in a teambook and that's a bad one to add to a checklist.
    Come to think of it, has he ever been shown attraction towards Starfire? I think he was fixated on Raven during the Wolfman/Perez run.

    The only example I can think of is the dream sequence in one of Messner-Loebs issue where he is surrounded by literally every female character he had met until that point.

  4. #1729
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Come to think of it, has he ever been shown attraction towards Starfire? I think he was fixated on Raven during the Wolfman/Perez run.

    The only example I can think of is the dream sequence in one of Messner-Loebs issue where he is surrounded by literally every female character he had met until that point.
    I mean, it wouldn't surprise me if he did at least once...

  5. #1730
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Come to think of it, has he ever been shown attraction towards Starfire? I think he was fixated on Raven during the Wolfman/Perez run.

    The only example I can think of is the dream sequence in one of Messner-Loebs issue where he is surrounded by literally every female character he had met until that point.
    I think he might've made some insensitive remarks during the Wolfman era to Starfire.

    He had a huge thing for Raven. The problem was he didn't know if it was real or not because Raven explicitly used her emotional magic on him to make him more infatuated with her so he'd join the team. As she feared he wouldn't otherwise. So ever since then basically any time him and Raven have any sort of heart to heart it comes down to Wally forgiving her but stating there's nothing there anymore because of the betrayal. He has a really melancholic relationship with her.
    Last edited by Dred; 11-29-2021 at 11:55 PM.

  6. #1731
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    I think he might've made some insensitive remarks during the Wolfman era to Starfire.

    He had a huge thing for Raven. The problem was he didn't know if it was real or not because Raven explicitly used her emotional magic on him to make him more infatuated with him so he'd join the team. As she feared he wouldn't otherwise. So ever since then basically any time him and Raven have any sort of heart to heart it comes down to Wally forgiving her but stating there's nothing there anymore because of the betrayal. He has a really melancholic relationship with her.
    The irony about this is that Wolfman ended up writing Wally out of the book anyway because he couldn't work around his powerset, making this plot point of Raven manipulating Wally completely wasted.

  7. #1732
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    Maybe he's just saying wow because the last time he saw Raven she was like 16 and now she's the same age as everyone else again, lol.
    Thing is, while she's back to being in the Dick/Wally/Donna/etc age group rather than the Tim/Bart/Cassie one, her character design hasn't changed back - so she's lost a foot in height somewhere along the way. (Honestly, very little survives of her Perez design bar elements of the costume).

    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    Damian's excuse was a forced growth tank, which I have a great deal of difficulty seeing Cheshire having the means or interest in using on her daughter.

    Lian's excuse, currently, is Death Metal: the fractured continuity that everyone is aware of, and which is full of discontinuities. When and if they get around to straightening that out, their solution can be that Lian has always been older than Damian: she was born in, what, the late 70s, early 80s, publication-wise; Damian was conceived in a 1987? 1986? story; I forget exactly which year it was, but I'm pretty sure it was early post-Crisis.

    Frankly, the single biggest headache to constructing a consistent timeline for the DCU lies in making the kids' ages make sense. My own inclination would be to start with the Robins, then figure out where everyone else fits around that.
    Maybe it's all connected to how the hell she's even alive - wasn't that a Walter West thing, where he was the same age as Wally but looked older because healing from a fatal injury aged him?

  8. #1733
    Extraordinary Member Badou's Avatar
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    So Dick and Wally might finally interact again in the new TTA issue, but they haven't talked or interacted on panel since the end of Abnett's first Titans run, right? Which was May or June of 2018. It's been 3 and a half years. Heroes in Crisis happened, Dick getting shot and the Ric stuff happened, Death Metal happened, Dick got his memories back and became Nightwing again, and even Wally "died" and came back and even became Flash again. Kind of crazy to think about how long it has been.

  9. #1734
    Incredible Member Hol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAWtoyoto 432 View Post
    The Teen Titans Academy situation is that making Wally going back to Rebirth suit will still view him as a murderer in front of the public eyes. But even in the classic Flash costume, he is still recognise as the Flash who get away with murder from the public.
    Yeah that didn't make sense to me. And also, I was hoping HIC would not be mentioned anymore.
    Read the current Flash run by Jeremy Adams! The first issue is #768. The best comic being published by DC these days. Hands down.

  10. #1735
    Three Legged Member married guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hol View Post
    Yeah that didn't make sense to me. And also, I was hoping HIC would not be mentioned anymore.
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  11. #1736
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    So Dick and Wally might finally interact again in the new TTA issue, but they haven't talked or interacted on panel since the end of Abnett's first Titans run, right? Which was May or June of 2018. It's been 3 and a half years. Heroes in Crisis happened, Dick getting shot and the Ric stuff happened, Death Metal happened, Dick got his memories back and became Nightwing again, and even Wally "died" and came back and even became Flash again. Kind of crazy to think about how long it has been.
    They're technically there together in Death Metal Last Stories, but they don't directly interact on page. The implication in that issue is every generation of Titans gets together, talks things out, and catches up before the end of the universe. So it's implied anything Dick and Wally would want to talk about would be covered there. Beast Boy implies they're reminiscing about old Titans stories off screen together.
    Last edited by Dred; 11-30-2021 at 12:05 AM.

  12. #1737
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    Taylor already more or less confirmed a Dick-Wally interaction in the foreseeable future.

    I hope it would be just the two of them and it won't turn into a Dick-Wally-Jon gathering.
    While I like Jon and I'm waiting for the Jon-Nightwing crossover, Wally and Dick really need some catching up to do.

  13. #1738
    Extraordinary Member Badou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    They're technically there together in Death Metal Last Stories, but they don't directly interact on page. The implication in that issue is every generation of Titans gets together, talks things out, and catches up before the end of the universe. So it's implied anything Dick and Wally would want to talk about would be covered there. Beast Boy implies they're reminiscing about old Titans stories off screen together.
    They actually had Dick leave when Wally showed up so Donna could get the spotlight with Wally's big return. Then at the end Dick was just with everyone in the group shot but he and Wally had no direct interaction. So I'm not expecting them to discuss Heroes in Crisis or Ric since those were so long ago now, and the implication is they have interacted off panel, but it is just interesting how people say they are "best friends" when they really barely interact.

  14. #1739
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    Quote Originally Posted by Badou View Post
    They actually had Dick leave when Wally showed up so Donna could get the spotlight with Wally's big return. Then at the end Dick was just with everyone in the group shot but he and Wally had no direct interaction. So I'm not expecting them to discuss Heroes in Crisis or Ric since those were so long ago now, and the implication is they have interacted off panel, but it is just interesting how people say they are "best friends" when they really barely interact.
    Wally not as available as other characters he tends to lead his own books and events. Dick was jerked around so much, it would be hard for them to properly crossover anyway. He was the only one of the fab five to truly succeed in a sense. Not to mention he is actually allowed to be married and have a family, and live (sorry Garth) . This happens to real life best friends as they get older. But I know when they do catch up it would be like old times for them.

  15. #1740
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Wally not as available as other characters he tends to lead his own books and events. Dick was jerked around so much, it would be hard for them to properly crossover anyway. He was the only one of the fab five to truly succeed in a sense. Not to mention he is actually allowed to be married and have a family, and live (sorry Garth) . This happens to real life best friends as they get older. But I know when they do catch up it would be like old times for them.
    I think Dick is probably as successful as Wally if we're looking at the fab five. While Wally became the main Flash for a long time, ever since Barry returned he became a legacy character that kind of competes with Barry on "the main flash" title and solo. It's a path that can make Wally sidelined or not have his own book for years while Barry is getting the spotlight.
    Dick definitely suffered a lot and became Ric for 2 years, but I think he had his own solo as either Nightwing, Batman or Grayson ever since 1995.

    Anyway, there really is no reason for the Titans not to also appear in each other books. As long as Wally isn't lost in the timestream he could definitely appear in Nightwing's book, and vice versa. Their books don't have to crossover, they could just appear in each other books occasionally.
    Actually, the Titans had 2 cameos in Nightwing since Taylor took over, but Wally was left out.

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