Danny Rand: Iron Fist Appreciation 2021

[Tien Long]

I thought Pei was next in line to take up the mantle?

More than likely Danny is just going to randomly be the IF again with no explanation because Marvel keeps cancelling his runs over and over again.

Also, how many times does Danny lose the IF? It's getting kind of old.

He has lost it or it has been gimped in 4 of his story arcs now I think.

The one one the zombie ninjas, the one he goes to the island for the martial arts tournament, the one with the demon that posses Luke and now, he just lost it again.

Maybe this is a good direction. Have him not have any chi for a entire run or two in his next two story arcs. Either stick with it for awhile or stop doing it. Make up your mind Marvel.

I begrudingly agree. Pei is right there. What about her? And all of these recent stories involving Danny, just a lot of meandering.

[Tien Long]

I dig the leggings too. I often thought that instead of using Bruce Lee styled costuming in a uniform they should have used Shaolin styled clothing. Or even Jet Li's Wong Fei-Hung style updated in a modern way.

Attachment 113921

Or even something like Sanford Greene designed for fun or Danny:

Attachment 113922

Something besides just the reverse colored Bruce styled jump suit.

I'm liking the Sanford Green design. I'd like him to show more of his face really. The mask is cool, but I'd like to see something different.

[taozen]

I'm liking the Sanford Green design. I'd like him to show more of his face really. The mask is cool, but I'd like to see something different.

I hear you but I think that is just a bandana with a the IF dragon design. It doesn't cover his eyes.

[Reviresco]

I found this old interview about Iron Fist, and there were some great comments and insights from Ed Brubaker and Matt Fraction that I wish writers would remember.

https://web.archive.org/web/20110102...d.php?t=152812

Newsarama got in touch with Ed Brubaker, Matt Fraction, Duane Swierczynski, and Iron Fist editor Warren Simon to discuss the changing of the guard as well as a number of creative dynamics involved with the critically acclaimed Immortal Iron Fist series.

Newsarama: When the Immortal Iron Fist title was starting up--Ed and Matt, you guys basically came up with a modernized take on a somewhat 2-Dimensional character in terms of his history as a "buddy character" to Luke Cage and a somewhat muddied death/ rebirth at the hands of John Byrne in the late ‘80s and early ‘90s. Now that there is a definite source/ mythos to Iron Fist, what has become the challenge with handling the substance of the character to the two of you?

Ed Brubaker: I don't think Matt and I really did that much that changed Danny at all. We just looked at the good Iron Fist stuff and got to the core of it. I had always wanted to do Iron Fist, and had always thought that there were Iron Fists as long as there was Kun Lun, basically, and we just started from there and ran with it. Matt had some crazy ideas about mag-lev trains and what Danny should do with his company's money, and then we just started rolling forward getting as much into each issue as we could.

Matt Fraction: I don't think the challenge was any different at the end of our run than it was at the beginning—reduce the character down to his core components, and then crush him to see what happens. The problem was never Iron Fist, it was all the crap that wasn’t Iron Fist—does that make sense? All we did was try to remind people that, hey, Kung Fu Billionaire is a good idea for a comic character.

EB: I also think Matt and I both really wanted the book to feel more like an old Pulp-era thing and less like a superhero comic—more Shadow/Doc Savage inspired. And there are ties to that era, in that Iron Fist was inspired by an old Bill Everett character who was inspired in some ways by the Shadow.

Danny, though, was always well-established as a character. We just made him a bit cooler and more powerful, and gave him a bunch of new costumes because David Aja is a genius and wouldn't keep him in one outfit at a time.

NRAMA: Duane, how are you planning to add to the storied history of the Immortal Iron Fist or are you just going to work with some of the previous incarnations established in the Brubaker/ Fraction run for now?

Duane Swierczynski: What’s great about the Iron Fist universe that Ed and Matt set up is that it’s ever-expanding. It’s basically one big, weird, pulpy story machine, and I can’t tell you how thrilled I am to be handed the keys to the thing. I will be telling more stories about the existing incarnations of Iron Fist, but you’ll see a few new faces pop up, too—and in (hopefully) surprising time periods.

NRAMA: Should Danny Rand/ Iron Fist have a more predominant role in the Marvel Universe of the 21st century? In your minds, how does the Iron Fist stand out amongst other characters like Daredevil or Spider-Man who seem to reach a similar audience but have a more tenured stay in the Marvel Universe?

MF: Danny/IF should have a role that makes sense. Right now it makes perfect sense that he's plugged into the Avengers. Would it have made sense ten years ago? Not at all. Did it make sense when he was from an alien city fighting giant asparagus? Not so much.

And he stands out because there's no one else like him. He's an international, pan-generational hero. He's human, he's American, and yet so much of him is of another culture and another world.

EB: He stands out because he's a Kung-Fu billionaire from a mystical city in the Himalayas. It's really simple. He stands out the same way that Dr. Strange does. That's what's cool about Iron Fist. He's otherworldly in some ways, but street-level in others. You can literally do anything with him, and now we've opened the door to stories about the Iron Fists of the past, so there are a lot of different angles to approach the character from.

NRAMA: With the evolution of this character, do you think readers could see a new Iron Fist down the road or has Marvel barely scratched the surface of Rand as the Iron Fist?

EB: I hope Danny stays around for a while, but Iron Fists do tend to die young, for the most part, so I guess anything is possible.

MF: Well, since ours is the first time an Iron Fist book has had more than 15 issues, I think it's safe to say there's miles to go with Danny.

That said, Duane kills him off in #19. Spoilers!

NRAMA: Is the Iron Fist a better character when Luke Cage is present? Does the character need a foil to balance him out?

MF: I think they both need each other as foils, honestly. It's not a flaw of character, but rather they team up so beautifully and each enhances the other. I know it was probably a marketing decision to team the two big exploitation characters together but man, when it works, it really, really works. It's not about balance—it's about complimenting.

NRAMA: Matt and Ed, are there aspects of this character that you wished you could've explored further?

EB: I think we touched on almost all the stuff I wanted us to at the beginning. It took us a bit longer than I thought it would to do it, but then, I had no idea that the second storyline would involve a Kung Fu tournament. It was originally just going to be a Kun Lun rebellion story, but then we were talking and I was staring at my wife's Enter the Dragon poster, and things just started clicking, and I'm saying, what if there are 6 other cities and they have a tournament, and Matt's saying, and they each have different immortal champions with cool names and... and... and...

And suddenly there was all this other stuff that made the book so much more fun and new and interesting, and that tied directly into the tragic story of Orson Randall, the lost Iron Fist from WWI.

MF: I can't answer this without blowing our last issue, so let me just say that there's a particular relationship dynamic that takes a turn in #16 I would've loved to have written more.

NRAMA: Duane, how do you want to take what Ed and Matt have created and move it forward, yet bring your own unique creative voice to the project?

DS: I’m not so much worried about bringing my own voice to Iron Fist, because I feel like this book is already speaking my language (as it no doubt does with every other Iron Fist fan). It’s the place you go when you want a white hot dose of pulp action, epic adventure, and mystical freakiness. It’s what I love to read, and love to write.

NRAMA: What do the three of you think are some of the flaws of Rand/ Iron Fist that make him an archetypal character in the Marvel Universe?

EB: He's not of the world that he lives in, completely, and he has a mission that he knows will someday get him killed, most likely. And he was born out of tragedy, having watched his parents die when he was like 9 years old.

MF: He comes from a place of tremendous pain and loss-- which if you think about the revelations in Immortal Iron Fist #14, will become even more painful as they come to light. He's the permanent outsider, in both the worlds in which he walks. In K'un Lun, he's a white outworlder from another culture, and in NYC he's a spacey billionaire into Yin-Yang symbols and karate... and that's just the tip of the eccentricities. There's nowhere Danny has ever fit... except with the other misfits that made up the Heroes for Hire.

DS: Also—to build on what Ed said about Danny not being of this world—I think his weird childhood makes him like a big kid, even though he’s in his early 30s. This came into sharp relief in Ed and Matt’s first arc, when he’s interacting with Orson Randall, and it’s very cool gruff dad/clueless son kind of situation. There’s also a father-son thing going on with Jeryn, and a big brother/little brother thing with Luke Cage. Danny seems to have gathered around him a surrogate family to replace the one that was stolen from him.

NRAMA: Were there any stories that the two of you mulled over but simply didn't have the time to tell?

MF: I remembered an idea that Ed had last night that I think he should do as an Iron Fist graphic novel that Jon J. Muth should paint. It was going to be a stand-alone Tales Of The Iron Fist issue, but the idea is so good it really could be something special.

NRAMA: Duane, how does your first story arc start out? What can readers expect once you've taken over the book?

DS: Matt cues up something really devastating in Iron Fist #16, and my story picks up literally a second later. (And then, 10 years later.)

NRAMA: When working with properties owned by a company like Marvel, what do the three of you think is the most important factor when creative teams change like this?

MF: A good editor, which we had a thousand times over in Warren Simons. Because, look, at the start of the day, there were four people that cared about this book-- me, Ed, David, and Warren-- and only one of them worked every day at Marvel and could fight for it every day. And that guy was Warren. A book like this could've so easily been killed at #8 without someone taking the time and energy to protect it, nurture it, defend it, and champion it. To say nothing of organizing the thing and coordinating the amazing array of artists we've had. It's great to know that Duane and Travel are taking over, and god knows it'll be great, but that Warren's still editing the thing means it truly is in the hands of someone who loves it.

[Reviresco]

Matt Fraction: I don't think the challenge was any different at the end of our run than it was at the beginning—reduce the character down to his core components, and then crush him to see what happens. The problem was never Iron Fist, it was all the crap that wasn’t Iron Fist—does that make sense? All we did was try to remind people that, hey, Kung Fu Billionaire is a good idea for a comic character.

EB: I also think Matt and I both really wanted the book to feel more like an old Pulp-era thing and less like a superhero comic—more Shadow/Doc Savage inspired. And there are ties to that era, in that Iron Fist was inspired by an old Bill Everett character who was inspired in some ways by the Shadow.

Danny, though, was always well-established as a character. We just made him a bit cooler and more powerful, and gave him a bunch of new costumes because David Aja is a genius and wouldn't keep him in one outfit at a time.



EB: He stands out because he's a Kung-Fu billionaire from a mystical city in the Himalayas. It's really simple. He stands out the same way that Dr. Strange does. That's what's cool about Iron Fist. He's otherworldly in some ways, but street-level in others. You can literally do anything with him, and now we've opened the door to stories about the Iron Fists of the past, so there are a lot of different angles to approach the character from.



DS: I’m not so much worried about bringing my own voice to Iron Fist, because I feel like this book is already speaking my language (as it no doubt does with every other Iron Fist fan). It’s the place you go when you want a white hot dose of pulp action, epic adventure, and mystical freakiness. It’s what I love to read, and love to write.

NRAMA: What do the three of you think are some of the flaws of Rand/ Iron Fist that make him an archetypal character in the Marvel Universe?

EB: He's not of the world that he lives in, completely, and he has a mission that he knows will someday get him killed, most likely. And he was born out of tragedy, having watched his parents die when he was like 9 years old.

MF: He comes from a place of tremendous pain and loss-- which if you think about the revelations in Immortal Iron Fist #14, will become even more painful as they come to light. He's the permanent outsider, in both the worlds in which he walks. In K'un Lun, he's a white outworlder from another culture, and in NYC he's a spacey billionaire into Yin-Yang symbols and karate... and that's just the tip of the eccentricities. There's nowhere Danny has ever fit... except with the other misfits that made up the Heroes for Hire.




MF: A good editor, which we had a thousand times over in Warren Simons. Because, look, at the start of the day, there were four people that cared about this book-- me, Ed, David, and Warren-- and only one of them worked every day at Marvel and could fight for it every day. And that guy was Warren. A book like this could've so easily been killed at #8 without someone taking the time and energy to protect it, nurture it, defend it, and champion it. To say nothing of organizing the thing and coordinating the amazing array of artists we've had. It's great to know that Duane and Travel are taking over, and god knows it'll be great, but that Warren's still editing the thing means it truly is in the hands of someone who loves it.

I've always suspected an editor who LOVED the character / book was a big deal for a book, so it's good to see that validated. These were the parts that really jumped out at me. I think the comment about being an outsider everywhere explains why Danny works as Iron Fist, despite the white savior trope.

[taozen]

I've always suspected an editor who LOVED the character / book was a big deal for a book, so it's good to see that validated. These were the parts that really jumped out at me. I think the comment about being an outsider everywhere explains why Danny works as Iron Fist, despite the white savior trope.

I always saw Danny the same way. I mean he basically grew up in a mystical martial arts city that basically shunned technology. I saw him as a bit odd in the eyes of regular people and in the beginning of his return making a lot of mistakes socially but would give others a different perspective due to his growing up in K'un-Lun. He was an outsider there and even when he returns to New York. He's the type of character whose truly at one practicing and studying martial arts, meditating, growing things, etc.

[Tien Long]

I've always suspected an editor who LOVED the character / book was a big deal for a book, so it's good to see that validated. These were the parts that really jumped out at me. I think the comment about being an outsider everywhere explains why Danny works as Iron Fist, despite the white savior trope.

I always saw Danny the same way. I mean he basically grew up in a mystical martial arts city that basically shunned technology. I saw him as a bit odd in the eyes of regular people and in the beginning of his return making a lot of mistakes socially but would give others a different perspective due to his growing up in K'un-Lun. He was an outsider there and even when he returns to New York. He's the type of character whose truly at one practicing and studying martial arts, meditating, growing things, etc.

Good points. And thanks for the reminders of Danny being the outsider. Reading those old interviews, I had forgotten how simple and to the point "billionaire Kung Fu playboy" and "....wait, wha-" Danny Rand could be. Now, I've spoken many times about how I can accept Kaare Andrews' take on Danny. But I remember scenes like these when Danny was at peace:



Just a person finding themselves through martial arts and meditation.

[Tien Long]

Heard about this film. Perfectly honest, think it could use some work. In multiple areas. But, the premise seems very faithful to Iron Fist lore. I'll admit, seeing Iron Fist charge up that iron fist, that was pretty cool.

[Digifiend]

Sayonara...

[BlackClaw]

Sayonara...

For now at least.

[The Cool Thatguy]

For now at least.

They really need to stop repeating this plot

[Tien Long]

Sayonara...

We had been discussing this possibility for a while. There is an expectation that there has been enough preparation. Seeing that Marvel is going through with this, however, well, I get a lump in my throat. Is Marvel really going through with this? Danny is no longer Iron Fist? Will it go to someone else? What about Danny? All those questions are there.

I read that a full announcement will be made tomorrow. We'll see how it goes.

[DigiCom]

The real question is... who's hand is that in the upper right?

[Reviresco]

The real question is... who's hand is that in the upper right?

And in the window?


Can't say I'm thrilled at this storyline. But it will be good to see Iron Fist again.

[Spiderfan001]

I think it's going to cement his not being Iron Fist anymore, sadly.W/ Shang Chi, the failure of his TV show and Marvel's fear of accusations of cultural appropriation in today's climate, etc. they won't have him be back in this.

Missing the Fraction run