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  1. #61
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thirteen View Post
    I vaguely remember something in Claremont's X-MEN:THE END that referenced Dani dying and then rising up MORE powerful...

    https://uncannyxmen.net/characters/m...rnate-versions

    That was a great story -- and a cool interpretation of Dani wreaking havoc as a Valkyrie to destroy Neverland.

    Came across this article about the more recent Claremont anniversary issue: https://screenrant.com/mcu-xmen-hela...n-life-marvel/

    Here's the part about Dani at the article's conclusion -- nice to see her getting good pub:

    d1.jpg

    "Few writers have had an impact on Marvel Comics overall like the X-Men's savior Chris Claremont and with this simple story, he takes another of his characters [i.e., Danielle Moonstar] and elevates her greatness to new heights."
    Last edited by rf2044; 01-26-2021 at 10:39 AM.

  2. #62
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    So... a lot of us have been critical of the New Mutants movie that came out last year for a variety of reasons. There's a long list.

    One of the consistent criticisms I've heard is that it didn't accomplish either being a superhero movie OR the stated intention of being a horror movie -- especially because it was PG-13. This video talks about what went wrong with the script / horror approach, and it is interesting that Boone wanted it to be an R-rated horror movie, but got shot down by the studio until it was too late.

    Sounds like Fox Studios was dead set against a hardcore horror movie being applied to a group of kid protagonists -- and due to that, they forced Boone to tone it down significantly, resulting in a "blah" story from a horror standpoint. Fox totally changed their tune when the first "It" movie was such a smash commercial success, and then tried to retroactively influence Boone to make the movie scarier -- but by then principal shooting had been completed, the cast [and Boone] had moved on to other projects, and it wasn't feasible to go back and completely rework the story / reshoot a bunch of content.

    Too bad -- huge missed opportunity:

    https://www.joblo.com/movie-news/the...-to-this-movie
    Last edited by rf2044; 01-27-2021 at 10:12 AM.

  3. #63
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    Since the beginning of big budget comic book movies, many have suffered the same problem, and New Mutants was no different.

    They try to recreate the first big arc of a character/team. They ignore all the work the comic had to do to get there, and in some cases, give no regard to the medium's suspension of disbelief.

    With Daredevil with Ben, they tried to recreate fall from grace, shoving how many big moments into one movie?

    With Suicide Squad, they tried to recreate the battle with the Enchantress. But no one cared because we'd just met her, and the team.

    IMO, that's the issue with New Mutants. They took a story from 2 years into the series' run, and used it as an introduction. They ignored internal logic and added a conflicting genre in Illyana's magic/powers.

    Too much in too little time, IMO
    Last edited by The Cool Thatguy; 01-31-2021 at 01:30 PM.

  4. #64
    Extraordinary Member jwatson's Avatar
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    I couldn't find the New mutants appreciation thread. newmutants1.jpg
    Don't let anyone else hold the candle that lights the way to your future because only you can sustain the flame.

    My creator showcase thread ln cbr. http://https://community.cbr.com/showthread.php?150839-Art-Journey

    Number of People on my ignore list: 0

  5. #65
    Astonishing Member gambitxremy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf2044 View Post
    That was a great story -- and a cool interpretation of Dani wreaking havoc as a Valkyrie to destroy Neverland.

    Came across this article about the more recent Claremont anniversary issue: https://screenrant.com/mcu-xmen-hela...n-life-marvel/

    Here's the part about Dani at the article's conclusion -- nice to see her getting good pub:

    d1.jpg

    "Few writers have had an impact on Marvel Comics overall like the X-Men's savior Chris Claremont and with this simple story, he takes another of his characters [i.e., Danielle Moonstar] and elevates her greatness to new heights."
    I love this! It makes Dani important and in the same league as Jean and storm

  6. #66
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    It helps that Claremont generally stays in his own canon, even when he's in the 616 Timeline canon.

  7. #67
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    Curious what others think of the art in New Mutants volume 4. It's different -- can't decide whether I like it or not [and I'm leaning toward the latter].

  8. #68
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwatson View Post
    I couldn't find the New mutants appreciation thread. newmutants1.jpg
    @jwatson, that's a cool image. Original art from you, or something you found online? Either way, thanks for sharing!

  9. #69
    Spectacular Member TraneTrax's Avatar
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    Dani has a great showing in Return of the Valkyries #2. We see all the different facets of her psychic powers. AND we get to see her fight with a spear and it is glorious!

  10. #70
    Astonishing Member Thirteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TraneTrax View Post
    Dani has a great showing in Return of the Valkyries #2. We see all the different facets of her psychic powers. AND we get to see her fight with a spear and it is glorious!
    Thanks for the recommendation. Checked it out and Dani IS very well written in ROTV#2...by Jason Aaron, no less. Great that they remembered the other side of her psionic polarity: she's not only sensitive to FEAR, but also DESIRE.
    (Wish the art were better.)

  11. #71
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    I love how Claremont made her a Valkyrie way back in the NM Special Edition and decades later its a development that has stuck and kept her relevent beyond the X-books. I love that Marvel respects this and when its time for them to be used Dani isnt forgotten or left behind.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    I love how Claremont made her a Valkyrie way back in the NM Special Edition and decades later its a development that has stuck and kept her relevent beyond the X-books. I love that Marvel respects this and when its time for them to be used Dani isnt forgotten or left behind.
    Yeah. Imagine what things would be like if they had stayed with this instead of the inferno rubbish and it's aftermath.

  13. #73
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TraneTrax View Post
    Dani has a great showing in Return of the Valkyries #2. We see all the different facets of her psychic powers. AND we get to see her fight with a spear and it is glorious!
    Screenshot 2021-02-05 090223.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by Thirteen View Post
    Thanks for the recommendation. Checked it out and Dani IS very well written in ROTV#2...by Jason Aaron, no less. Great that they remembered the other side of her psionic polarity: she's not only sensitive to FEAR, but also DESIRE.
    (Wish the art were better.)
    Agreed -- it was a pretty cool interpretation of her powers - one that seems so often overlooked because of the application of her fear based powers in battle.


    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    I love how Claremont made her a Valkyrie way back in the NM Special Edition and decades later its a development that has stuck and kept her relevent beyond the X-books. I love that Marvel respects this and when its time for them to be used Dani isnt forgotten or left behind.
    So... what are her powers now? Obviously, Dani has her original powers back -- and her empathic abilities have ratcheted up [whereas before she wasn't aware of the fears / desires of her opponents before she manifested them as illusions, now she seems to be able to scan and interpret them]. She can still channel her neurokinetic arrows -- which can disrupt sentient beings and render them unconscious. She also still has her Valkyrie death sense and animal empathy.

    It also seems as though she can channel her illusion powers to create both armor and melee weapons of the type that Valkyries would use -- bows, spears, swords etc. And that while these can harm people / objects, they inflict even more damage to magical and / or psionic beings.

    Do I have that correct? Does she also have superhuman strength, or is that only when she's "powered up" in Valkyrie mode?
    Last edited by rf2044; 02-05-2021 at 09:59 AM.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf2044 View Post
    Screenshot 2021-02-05 090223.jpg



    Agreed -- it was a pretty cool interpretation of her powers - one that seems so often overlooked because of the application of her fear based powers in battle.




    So... what are her powers now? Obviously, Dani has her original powers back -- and her empathic abilities have ratcheted up [whereas before she wasn't aware of the fears / desires of her opponents before she manifested them as illusions, now she seems to be able to scan and interpret them]. She can still channel her neurokinetic arrows -- which can disrupt sentient beings and render them unconscious. She also still has her Valkyrie death sense and animal empathy.

    It also seems as though she can channel her illusion powers to create both armor and melee weapons of the type that Valkyries would use -- bows, spears, swords etc. And that while these can harm people / objects, they inflict even more damage to magical and / or psionic beings.

    Do I have that correct? Does she also have superhuman strength, or is that only when she's "powered up" in Valkyrie mode?
    Think that was a result of the package Hela gave her when Dani cut her deal with her so she could fight Ares

    https://comicnewbies.com/2017/04/16/...ook-down-ares/

  15. #75
    Spectacular Member rf2044's Avatar
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    Okay, so as a big Dani fan, I've been [slowly] going back and collecting stuff from her backstory across the various X-teams, including some figural plot lines in her background. I just got a comic from the original New Mutants run, which featured a Dani solo story after she'd left Xavier's school due to a disagreement with then-headmaster, Magneto.

    I saw this recommended as a Moonstar must-read by Darcie Little Badger, who wrote the Dani story for November's Indigenous Voices issue. Darcie listed this as one of her favorite Dani stories, so I tracked it down to give it a read.

    New Mutants volume 1, #41


    Spoiler Alert...



    The Good


    So, first of all -- this was a Dani featurette, where she was the focal point of the entire issue with no other New Mutant characters. The basic plot set-up is that after having a huge blowout with Magneto, Dani leaves the school and flies home to Colorado on Brightwind, which takes her several days, and she arrives right before a massive blizzard is about to hit the area. After her parents leave her alone at their ranch to rest / recuperate from her journey, Dani has a lot of introspection about whether her decision to leave Xavier's School was the right call, due to her role as team leader. Later, she goes to the town mall where she encounters her former best friend who has turned into a massive anti-Native American racist. Even so, she decides to come to his rescue when he gets stranded in an off-road car accident in the blizzard, and attempts to fight off Death incarnate using her Valkyrie abilities, but ultimately decides to let Death take her friend when Death points out that he's brain dead and in a coma.

    There was some "cute" Dani artwork [especially a scene where she's trying on different outfits at the mall], and her indomitable bravery [a foundational hallmark of her character down the road] was on full display. She was so bad ass, that she was even willing to risk her own life for an old "friend" who didn't deserve it and acted overtly hostile to her.

    Plus, Dani beats Death in a gunfight. Pretty cool.


    The Bad

    The strangest part of this issue from my perspective was the behavior of Dani's parents. First of all, they'd been gone from her life for years after being "absorbed" by the Demon Bear, only to be freed thanks in no small part to their daughter's heroism. When Dani shows up unexpectedly in this story, they haven't seen her in months, but there's a blizzard about to hit, so they say hello / goodbye, and then bail to go tend to livestock. They're similarly unavailable the majority of the rest of the issue; when Dani wakes up after spending her first night there, they've left her a note indicating that they're going to be gone all that day, too.

    I don't know -- maybe that's what ranch life is really like. But it just struck me as odd that they wouldn't be more excited to see their daughter, after such a long time. "Hey honey -- great to see you after this lengthy absence, but we've got to go, we'll be back tomorrow." Huh?

    In this story, the parents were mostly just plot devices, and their absence enabled Dani to go off and have the encounter with the story's antagonist, but it didn't jibe with what I'd expect, given how ostensibly close Dani was to her parents.

    I also found it amusing that they didn't bat an eye about their daughter showing up on a pegasus.

    A lot of the issue was just Dani monologuing in her head -- since there were no other characters she was interacting with. It's also important to note that this story took place close to the beginning of the New Mutants run [even though it was issue #41] -- so she was probably only something like 16 years old, not a semi-adult like she is now. But some of the dialogue was pretty trite and unsophisticated, even for a teenager.


    The Ugly

    This issue was published in July 1986, so basically 35 years ago, and comics have changed a lot. But some of the content was so over the top racist, it was hard to believe that this got published back when things were governed by the "comic book code" [there's also a scene where she uses her powers to pull her "friend's" greatest fantasy from his head, and it's to murder her with an ax]. Especially because comics were targeted back then more for kids, and weren't quite as sophisticated with themes as they've become in contemporary comics. I can't envision modern day Dani putting up with even one of those comments, let alone someone berating her with anti-Native slurs, without putting a fringed boot up somebody's a**.



    Overall, it was kind of surprising issue. If that was a snapshot in time culturally, things have sure changed a lot. But it was cool to revisit a time much "earlier" in Dani's canon, and revisiting what her character was like back then, at a point in time much earlier in her story arc.


    New_Mutants_Vol_1_41.jpg

    For anyone who's interested: https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/New_Mutants_Vol_1_41
    Last edited by rf2044; 02-18-2021 at 03:14 PM.

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