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  1. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by GSman View Post
    Jace's sales is an interesting topic. When we did discover that there was going to be a replacement Batman, who would also be a POC, I'm sure a lot of people's kneejerk reactions were to reject the idea entirely and not even give it a chance,
    I thought it was a great idea at first, as I also thought there was a lot of untapped potential with the Signal and television Batwoman - going back to the ROOTS of why there is a Batman, to protect the vulnerable who face regular persecution from criminals. The thing I kept finding so odd was why there no clue whatsoever in "The Next Batman" during the Future State stories as to what the origin and/or motivation was... as motivation for the Batman is the core of the character. Then John Ridley wrote the (digital only) Second Son series, where we see Tim Fox as a hit-and-run murderer, etc., which I read and was "OK, you HAVE to be kidding me, right?" The "Next Batman" concept was a good concept, but the writing execution and origin has been a disaster. It led me to realize how far away from the public that DC Comics editors really are to think that such an "origin" would "work" for a costumed hero.

  2. #482
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Once the GP get word of Jace and that he exist they will not be able to get rid of him or diminish him
    I am not sure the origin is going to sell with the general public. I found it pretty astounding that anyone thought it would.
    I see it differently. I think the only reason it is not doing worse is because the public don't get what the origin story is yet.

  3. #483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fergus View Post
    Black Batman didn't get the media attention one would expect
    I think you have had a lot of positive attention for Batwoman and Batwing on television, and now Signal on webtoon.
    Those are the logical places to build from in the future, with publicly-liked, sympathetic characters. WB is going to understand this, even if DC does not.
    DC Comics has probably dodged a bullet with the lack of media attention on Jace Fox.
    If the Jace Fox origin story really got covered in the media, it would do a lot of damage to DC Comics' credibility.
    Honestly, I think what John Ridley taught DC with the Jace Fox origin story is that he can't be trusted with a DC intellectual property like Batman.
    The IP is more than a relatively small number (and dollar figures) of actual comics readers.

    The best damage control they can do now is have Jace Fox somehow get out of the picture, and Luke Fox takes over as Batwing.

  4. #484
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Donít underestimate Twitter
    145,000+ Tweets on Batman Day this past Saturday. I counted 13 for Jace.

  5. #485
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    Quote Originally Posted by BatsUSA View Post
    The "Next Batman" concept was a good concept,
    Really?

    I mean thing is, it is not a particularly new concept to have idea of having someone other than Bruce as Batman, we allready had Jean Paul Valley, Dick Grayson, Commissionair Gordon and Terry McGinnes as Batman. So a new Batman is on it's own not that exciting, he also needs bring something else to the table imo, and in Jace's case I don't really see that.

    I mean technically he isn't even the first POC Batman, that was Wayne Williams, and that guy had at least a clear origin story...

  6. #486
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    Really?

    I mean thing is, it is not a particularly new concept to have idea of having someone other than Bruce as Batman, we allready had Jean Paul Valley, Dick Grayson, Commissionair Gordon and Terry McGinnes as Batman. So a new Batman is on it's own not that exciting, he also needs bring something else to the table imo, and in Jace's case I don't really see that.

    I mean technically he isn't even the first POC Batman, that was Wayne Williams, and that guy had at least a clear origin story...
    We also had Damian as Batman in Batman 666 and DCeased, and he's also a POC character (Asian-Arab mix). Wonder why DC planned to make him the big bad villain of 5G. He could easily become Batman in a future setting, and it would defenetly be easier to believe than Jace Fox, who has zero connection to the Batman mythos.

  7. #487
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    Quote Originally Posted by BatsUSA View Post
    145,000+ Tweets on Batman Day this past Saturday. I counted 13 for Jace.
    Becuase GP doesn’t know him yet. Once they do he can’t leave.

  8. #488
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lal View Post
    We also had Damian as Batman in Batman 666 and DCeased, and he's also a POC character (Asian-Arab mix). Wonder why DC planned to make him the big bad villain of 5G. He could easily become Batman in a future setting, and it would defenetly be easier to believe than Jace Fox, who has zero connection to the Batman mythos.
    They probably think that Damian as Batman is boring and obvious concept and also this is inheritance through the literal family line, and apparently they do not like this option because of this, among other things. Though, I think they'll come to this at some point, at least some attempt will take place.
    Jace wasn't original plan, Luke was supposed to be a new Batman in 5G. Ridley decided to bring Jace after 5G was cancelled. Also, they brought Ridley because of black Batman concept, even after plans changed they couldn't just make him write something else.

  9. #489
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rac7d* View Post
    Becuase GP doesn’t know him yet. Once they do he can’t leave.
    It was all over the media, and literally no one cared. It was completely forgotten.
    There was much more general interest in Tim becoming queer.
    As long as Jace won't be in a movie or video game, literally no one will know or care.
    Bruce Wayne is the Batman the general public knows and cares for. Would the general public care if they replace Batwoman or Terry with a new character? Not really.
    Last edited by Lal; 09-20-2021 at 11:55 AM.

  10. #490
    Astonishing Member Fergus's Avatar
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    I also think that Luke should have been the Next Batman or even better invest the effort and resources that's been pumped into Jace into Luke.

    Develop and OG black mantle like Marvels BP don't go the Miles Route and then force him to compete with not just Bruce Batman but all the other Bat characters by having in be located in the same universe.

    For those saying that Dc can't walk back Black batman because twitter would rage.
    Twitter didn't rage when DC strapped a bomb to one of the few comics characters with a middle Eastern heritage.
    They didn't rage when Dc took the Batgirl mantle from an Asian disabled character to give it to a white character
    They didn't race when DC kicked out their most visible and best selling character of colour for a white replacement with lower sales figures.

    So again why do you think that Jace minority status is a safety net?

    Cass and Damian are very well known on twitter
    Cass and Damian were successful at the times when DC undermined /replaced them
    Cass and Damian are minorities.
    They weren't safe.

    So again why do you think it'd be different this time? Because Jace is Black not, Asian, Middle Eastern or disabled?

    While I prefer Luke I still want Jace to survive and the concept to be successful. Ideally DC would support both and both would/should thrive but this is DC.

    It's funny how @GSman said that miles was the most successful character of colour in the last 20 years. That was Damian Wayne by a long stretch up till Spiderverse dropped.

    Compare how DC handles Miles to how DC handles Damian.

    DC did all it could to undermine Damian even though the character was successful and had managed to crossover becoming successful in outside media as well
    Marvel supported Miles

    Damian survived in spite of DC's best efforts so I have little faith in DC. I don't think they are invested long term in jace

    I don't think they put much thought unto this next batman concept beyond lets make a Black Batman.

    They have nothing to get rid of the many obstacles that they know will impede Jace.
    They haven't done enough Promotions
    They haven't done enough to win existing fans over

    I just don't trust that DC knows how to promote their characters of colour. Not proactively anyway
    All their successful characters of colour have done so inspite of DC's shitty handling and treatrment.
    Last edited by Fergus; 09-20-2021 at 12:18 PM.

  11. #491
    Astonishing Member Fergus's Avatar
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    I forgot that is an Appreciation thread for the Fox Family.

    looking forward to Luke on Batwoman

  12. #492
    Ultimate Member Vordan's Avatar
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    Jace will stick around if they use him in outside media, and heíll fade away if they donít, thatís the long and short of it. If the CW or DCEU use him then he will keep getting appearances. If the video games use him, ditto. But on the comic side Bruce Wayne is simply too popular and profitable for a newcomer like Jace to really compete with him.

    Personally I do think heís going to show up in something sometime in the near future.
    For when my rants on the forums just arenít enough: https://thevindicativevordan.tumblr.com/

  13. #493
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    If the rumors are true, after Flash movie Keaton will be the Batman of DCEU, mentoring young heroes like Batgirl. That's might be a best chance for him. Of course, if they won't choose Terry or Damian, which is actually more likely at this point. Either that, or, I don't know, they might introduce him through Batwoman on CW, considering that Luke is already there and is a big part of the show.

  14. #494
    Incredible Member Superboy-Prime's Avatar
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    There's no chance Damian becomes Batman in live action.

  15. #495
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vordan View Post
    Jace will stick around if they use him in outside media, and he’ll fade away if they don’t, that’s the long and short of it. If the CW or DCEU use him then he will keep getting appearances. If the video games use him, ditto. But on the comic side Bruce Wayne is simply too popular and profitable for a newcomer like Jace to really compete with him.

    Personally I do think he’s going to show up in something sometime in the near future.
    I'm trying to think of where it would make sense to feature him save for a sudden HBOMax New Batman series announcement or something...

    I don't think he'd fit in Batwoman for a variety of reasons.

    Maybe Gotham Knights could add him at some point but then it still defeats the point to throw in Batman in a game about the protege's.

    Young Justice would probably make Dick Batman first.

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