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  1. #211
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    Zatanna and Black Canary by Marcio Takara.



    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    So its been suggested that Rachel Zeglers character in Shaxam 2 is Zatanna and honestly I'm here for it.
    I'll be happy if it's true but I was hoping for Zee to get her own movie.

    IMO it would be better to have a separate universe for Zee, Constantine, Swamp thing and all other magical characters. Shazam fits better with the Superhero crowd. There was a time when Zee did as well but I think if DC is gonna build a magic universe it would be better to have Zee be more like the Vertigo characters by which I mean to have her powers be nerfed somehow.

    Zee ofcourse is not a "for mature readers" character like Constantine and Swamp thing but I think she can be turned into one.
    Last edited by Edwin30; 02-27-2021 at 12:30 PM.

  2. #212
    Extraordinary Member Robanker's Avatar
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    The Shazam sequel is as good a place as any for us to get our first film Zatanna. I'm down.

  3. #213
    Astonishing Member John Venus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius View Post
    Odd place for her to show but honestly, I think I'd take that over showing up in a JLD film.
    I mean, they are both magic, it could work. That's assuming the rumor is true. Is there anyone from Shazam franchise that hasn't appeared in the movie yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    She's only 19. Seems kind of young for movie Zatanna.
    It could be a younger take, like YJ. lol, maybe Billy develops a crush on her.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin30 View Post
    Zatanna and Black Canary by Marcio Takara.

    I'll be happy if it's true but I was hoping for Zee to get her own movie.

    IMO it would be better to have a separate universe for Zee, Constantine, Swamp thing and all other magical characters. Shazam fits better with the Superhero crowd. There was a time when Zee did as well but I think if DC is gonna build a magic universe it would be better to have Zee be more like the Vertigo characters by which I mean to have her powers be nerfed somehow.

    Zee ofcourse is not a "for mature readers" character like Constantine and Swamp thing but I think she can be turned into one.
    Assuming this is true, I hope it's a lead in to film. It works for me, since even in the comics the character was introduced in a cross over.

    Shazam is magic and there is more to magic than the just dark, spooky horror, aspect that Etrigan, Constantine and Swamp Thing embody.

    Zatanna was the one of the few characters that moved from the mature Vertigo titles to the regular DCU. I would like that element preserved. She should be just as likely to team up with Superman or Batman as she is to be standing next to Constantine facing some omnious threat as she is to be in San Francisco dealing with her own crap.

    Also, please, no more nerfing. I'm fine with no time traveling, telepathy or reality warping. Those are reasonable limits. But I'm sick of the 'oh no, it's too powerful for me'' moments which plague her and Jean Grey, as if writers can't wait to take her off the board so someone else could shine. Let her have her moment.

  4. #214
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edwin30 View Post
    Zatanna and Black Canary by Marcio Takara.

    I like how this captures the different style and personalities of the two women.

  5. #215
    Astonishing Member John Venus's Avatar
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    I just noticed that BC is carrying an axe.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    I mean, they are both magic, it could work. That's assuming the rumor is true. Is there anyone from Shazam franchise that hasn't appeared in the movie yet?

    It could be a younger take, like YJ. lol, maybe Billy develops a crush on her.

    Assuming this is true, I hope it's a lead in to film. It works for me, since even in the comics the character was introduced in a cross over.

    Shazam is magic and there is more to magic than the just dark, spooky horror, aspect that Etrigan, Constantine and Swamp Thing embody.

    Zatanna was the one of the few characters that moved from the mature Vertigo titles to the regular DCU. I would like that element preserved. She should be just as likely to team up with Superman or Batman as she is to be standing next to Constantine facing some omnious threat as she is to be in San Francisco dealing with her own crap.
    If Zatanna is introduced in Shazam 2, she'll probably be treated like Huntress in Harley Quinn & BOP movie. I don't want that.

    They'll most probably go for her most popular interpretation - the 2010 comic by Paul Dini because of the similar tones.

    My problem is that her 2010 interpretation, if you think about it, is basically Mr. Mxyzptlk. A character nobody takes seriously. They'll give her some small role - probably have her get gagged only for Shazam to save her.

    If they introduce Zatanna like that there is a chance that she might become unavailable for other projects of a mature tone like JLD.

    DC never really cared for their magical characters except for Swamp thing and Constantine but only because they were being written under Vertigo.

    The best thing to do would be adapt Zee into that Vertigo Universe where she can be among character that challenge her.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    Also, please, no more nerfing. I'm fine with no time traveling, telepathy or reality warping. Those are reasonable limits. But I'm sick of the 'oh no, it's too powerful for me'' moments which plague her and Jean Grey, as if writers can't wait to take her off the board so someone else could shine. Let her have her moment.

    It would be easier to explain my point through a video.

    Justice league Action


    This fight with Felix faust is a hundred times better than the one she had in the JLD movie even though she doesn't look as powerful as the JLD one. She looks a little above street level.(spiderman level).

    There is some kinda of trend among writers where the only interesting thing they write for the female character is to make her super powerful.

    Zatanna is not just a powerful sorcerer but she is also a stage magician. Her fight should reflect her gimmick. Deception, sleight of hand and theatrics make her stand out from the other mages and also make her look clever.
    Last edited by Edwin30; 02-28-2021 at 09:23 AM.

  7. #217
    Incredible Member starduck's Avatar
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    Honestly, I prefer the 2010 stage magician Zatanna to the JLD one who had no personality beyond being Constantine's girlfriend and her magic was uselss against literallly everything. Even the tynion version was pretty much just an exposition bot for Diana So if the rumors are true I'm glad they're introducing Zatanna through something that isn't jld

  8. #218
    Mighty Member LifeIsILL's Avatar
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    Can't believe Zatanna only had 1 ongoing series. The disrespect...

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by LifeIsILL View Post
    Can't believe Zatanna only had 1 ongoing series. The disrespect...
    Z can support great stories (well, to be fair, almost any character can, with the right writer), but she's very niche. Immensely powerful, but you can neutralize her with a handful of sneezing powder. She's got a neat millieu set up, but it's not as flexible as Barry Allen's or Carter Hall's. She's probably harder to write than some other characters.

    I have to wonder if Z's better for minis from time-to-time. I'd rather read a good Z story than watch somebody squeezing juice from a rock every month.

  10. #220
    Astonishing Member John Venus's Avatar
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    @Edwin30

    But Paul Dini ongoing was what really highlighted her talent in escape artistry, skill in sleight of hand and really showcased her talent outside of magic. Even the clip you linked to is drawing from what Dini established.

    I also don't think Vertigo or JLD has done her favors. Gaiman's Books of Magic had her endanger Tim Hunter by taking him to a magic bar filled with magic user and when they threaten Tim, Zee loses her nerve to take them on. All this so Constantine can make a big splashy entrance and look cool. For worse, this is the format that JLD follows. She's there as a glorified red shirt to prove how tough the magical threat so Constantine or someone else can come in and save the day. Even in JLD: Apokolips she is just there to die tragically to motivate Constantine, redeem him and prop him up so he could save the day. It's only recently under Ram V and Tynion she got some of her mojo back but there is still room for improvement.

    It's still a far cry from the woman, whom, in JLA: Incarnation, cast a world wide spell to free everyone from mind control (the effort nearly tore her in half) or during Conway's run was outright referred to as the second strongest JLA member after Superman because she was often the key to saving the day or in Seven Soldiers where she saved the world again mostly by herself.

    Also, I'm of the opinion that her connection to the greater DCU is what makes her better, not worse.

  11. #221
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    Do you believe that the success of Wandavision will help Zatanna get her own movie?

  12. #222
    Spectacular Member Captain Nostalgia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LifeIsILL View Post
    Can't believe Zatanna only had 1 ongoing series. The disrespect...
    In a market traditionally driven by young teenage boys...it's always been a rougher go for female characters.

    Black Canary still needs BOP to float and Zatanna JLD.

    Hopefully things will change, as I've always loved both characters.

  13. #223
    Astonishing Member Gaius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John Venus View Post
    @Edwin30

    But Paul Dini ongoing was what really highlighted her talent in escape artistry, skill in sleight of hand and really showcased her talent outside of magic. Even the clip you linked to is drawing from what Dini established.

    I also don't think Vertigo or JLD has done her favors. Gaiman's Books of Magic had her endanger Tim Hunter by taking him to a magic bar filled with magic user and when they threaten Tim, Zee loses her nerve to take them on. All this so Constantine can make a big splashy entrance and look cool. For worse, this is the format that JLD follows. She's there as a glorified red shirt to prove how tough the magical threat so Constantine or someone else can come in and save the day. Even in JLD: Apokolips she is just there to die tragically to motivate Constantine, redeem him and prop him up so he could save the day. It's only recently under Ram V and Tynion she got some of her mojo back but there is still room for improvement.

    It's still a far cry from the woman, whom, in JLA: Incarnation, cast a world wide spell to free everyone from mind control (the effort nearly tore her in half) or during Conway's run was outright referred to as the second strongest JLA member after Superman because she was often the key to saving the day or in Seven Soldiers where she saved the world again mostly by herself.

    Also, I'm of the opinion that her connection to the greater DCU is what makes her better, not worse.
    Yeah, Zee's the exception to my usual rule that I think most major DC characters could exist in their own universe but I think she's one of those character's who is more interesting when she exists in the larger universe.

    Though I guess this is mainly because not much has been done with her a solo act and like others said, she's fairly niche.

  14. #224
    Amazing Member Zee_Fan's Avatar
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    I have yet so see Shazam, so I'm not really sure how she'd fit there. I'd rather her get something that's more "hers" though than a cameo. And I always got the impression Shazam wasn't taken real seriously in the DC movie universe.

    It's been awhile since I've read them (which is a reminder to myself to re-read them) but from what I remember, Zee was pretty much in charge of the N52 JLD by the end of the run. She essentially saved existence. I don't need her to be that powerful, but I don't really want to see her playing second-fiddle to Constantine (like she did in the first half of the N52 JLD), WW or Batman. As glad as I was that she was ultimately the one who took down the Upside-Down Man, I still felt like the current JLD was too much dependence on WW at times.

  15. #225
    Astonishing Member Gaius's Avatar
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