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  1. #331
    Fantastic Member Harsh Lesson's Avatar
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    I'm not sure touching on his parents, or dedicating a film solely to his backstory is really necessary. The MCU could largely remain faithful to the one Grevioux gave him & it'd be a hit. For that, flash backs and second hand story telling should suffice.

    Also, to retouch on something I'd mentioned few pages back, when you consider that much of what's been published on the comic side over the last 15 years has been done with film adaptability in mind, in addition to Grevioux's background in the industry, it's not hard to believe that Adam was created with the MCU specifically in mind. The Ultimates, given their roster and story elements, seem a team tailored for MCU's next phases.

  2. #332
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    Quote Originally Posted by mace11 View Post
    I don't mind his parent/parents mention like in comics briefly(that adds relatability alreadly) like you said but his parents are not seen and it will be the same way for the mcu.

    Everything does not need to be seen from my viewpoint plus his origin story does not start with him and his parents like superman.
    I am glad that is different plus he already has other things that add layers of relatability.

    Now they could show his kids like the comics(he is the PARENT) and his wife another parent for his kids of the past and then him moving on to be with monica.
    So parents would be shown like the comics,adam and his wife are the parents for his kids like the comics and his parents are not needed to be seen but Mention.
    For the mcu they could mention or not.
    So let me understand this, is it for the sake of being different from the superman origin story why you don't want the parents to show up? Are you concerned that it will seem like Blue Marvel trying to be like superman too much?

    My take is quite different. I would actually include his father at the very least (maybe his mom died in child birth) through out his story. It gives Adams story an added layer of familiarity. His heart is where his family is, especially with 1 living parent.

  3. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harsh Lesson View Post
    I'm not sure touching on his parents, or dedicating a film solely to his backstory is really necessary. The MCU could largely remain faithful to the one Grevioux gave him & it'd be a hit. For that, flash backs and second hand story telling should suffice.

    Also, to retouch on something I'd mentioned few pages back, when you consider that much of what's been published on the comic side over the last 15 years has been done with film adaptability in mind, in addition to Grevioux's background in the industry, it's not hard to believe that Adam was created with the MCU specifically in mind. The Ultimates, given their roster and story elements, seem a team tailored for MCU's next phases.
    Adam's back story would be better suited to 6 or 7 episode series on Disney+ that would lead up to a movie. The idea, at least in my mind, is to have Adam be the flag ship character for the another phase. I would like to see the same push given that was given to captain marvel, given to Kevin. I'm for having him in an alternate universe that focuses on him before and cross over event occurs. Hence a limited Disney+ special. The source material could still be adapted but in different universe.
    Last edited by Carbon jiren; 03-31-2021 at 10:42 AM.

  4. #334
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon jiren View Post
    So let me understand this, is it for the sake of being different from the superman origin story why you don't want the parents to show up? Are you concerned that it will seem like Blue Marvel trying to be like superman too much?
    It's not only reason but there are other reasons i will not get into here.
    Anyway i prefer not see any of his parents.
    Maybe mention but not seen.
    That goes for most superheroes,more so superheroes/characters that have lived a long time who are old enough to be grandparents or great grandparnets etc..
    Last edited by mace11; 03-31-2021 at 11:07 AM.

  5. #335
    Cosmic Curmudgeon JudicatorPrime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harsh Lesson View Post
    On top of all this, how often do we truly see herald level characters let loose in team books? Hyperion and Gladiator barely did anything throughout the whole of Infinity, for example, other than job to Black Dwarf and Corvus Glaive.
    I would trade Blue Marvel knocking out Ultimate Hulk for Hickman's Hyperion knocking the snot out of the REAL Hulk and turning him back into Banner any day of the week. But you'll never see Adam do that to 616 Hulk. Ever.

    Most of Blue Marvel's "great" feats are really poor man's feats. They establish him in the top tier discussion, but they don't set him apart in the same fashion as a Thor or Sentry. For every feat that Adam has, far better have been done by other characters in Blue Marvel's power tier.

    Not that any story featuring Adam should be strictly about power level only.
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  6. #336
    Fantastic Member Harsh Lesson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudicatorPrime View Post
    I would trade Blue Marvel knocking out Ultimate Hulk for Hickman's Hyperion knocking the snot out of the REAL Hulk and turning him back into Banner any day of the week. But you'll never see Adam do that to 616 Hulk. Ever.
    Did you miss Savage Hulk versus Ultimate Hulk during Secret Wars?

    Most of Blue Marvel's "great" feats are really poor man's feats. They establish him in the top tier discussion, but they don't set him apart in the same fashion as a Thor or Sentry. For every feat that Adam has, far better have been done by other characters in Blue Marvel's power tier.

    Not that any story featuring Adam should be strictly about power level only.
    Poor man's feats like solo-ing Anti-Man & King Hyperion, carrying a meteor the size of Arkansas, one hit TKO'ing Sentry, reversing the effects of Proxima's spear on Monica before ultimately empowering her, being unfazed by a hydrogen bomb exploding in his hands, hawking down Nova, lifting the Enterprise Battleship, creating forcefields strong enough to house cosmic entities, empowering Captain Marvel to Binary, sub-atomic/molecular vision, etc?

    These are poor man's feats?

  7. #337
    Cosmic Curmudgeon JudicatorPrime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harsh Lesson View Post
    Did you miss Savage Hulk versus Ultimate Hulk during Secret Wars?
    Perhaps, but I didn't miss Power Princess dropping the Ultimate Hulk and carrying him off like he was curbside trash. So there's that.


    Poor man's feats like solo-ing Anti-Man...
    1960s Anti-Man as written by Grevioux was not the same Anti-Man as the more modern age Anti-Man. The modern age Anti-Man was only defeated by Adam by virtue of the link that they share to the anti-matter universe. Otherwise, for all intents and purposes the modern era Anti-Man was clearly more powerful than Adam...plus Sentry...plus all of the Avengers, including Ares, Captain Marvel (Carol) and Iron Man.


    ... & King Hyperion...
    I vaguely recall reading somewhere that KH had been diminished in power and prowess as well. I forget if that was at the hands of Juggernaut or some other powerhouse. Not sure if KH was being jobbed, or if we can officially close the book on the top end power that he had in the Ultraverse stories. Clearly that's no longer the case.


    ... carrying a meteor the size of Arkansas...
    Like I said, Adam's feats have been equaled or exceeded by others in his tier. Adam moving a meteor the mass of a small state is one thing. But one of the Hyperions moved an entire planet. Thor, both in myth and in the comics, lifted the Midgard Serpent, which is so massively large that it encircles the Earth. The difference between a grain of sand and a mountain.


    ...one hit TKO'ing Sentry...
    It wasn't a TKO, but a standing 8 count. Anyone who has ever seen a real boxing match will tell you that a man isn't out of the fight until he's out for the full count. Sentry did drop Adam, though. Blindside sucker punch or not, it counts. And Adam was out. The next time we see Adam, he's convalescing in the medical wing of Avengers HQ.


    ...reversing the effects of Proxima's spear on Monica before ultimately empowering her...
    You don't really want to get me started on all of the energy manipulative feats that Sentry, Silver Surfer, Quasar and others have managed, do you?


    ...being unfazed by a hydrogen bomb exploding in his hands...
    And yet in the last Doom series Adam is seen wearing a special suit for the "black hole" singularity, which turned out to be a worm hole. Do I have to pull the images of Adam Warlock traversing a Black Hole without any such accoutrements? Further, in another story Adam appears to be concerned about radiation, which I find peculiar, if not interesting. I realize there are different forms of radiation, but it does make you wonder if perhaps Adam used a protective force field when that atomic warhead detonated in his face.


    ... lifting the Enterprise Battleship...
    Yep, we covered that above. Planets weigh more than battleships. And was it the Hulk or Gladiator that ripped a star apart with his bare hands? Or maybe it was Sentry? I'm losing track. In any event, others in his class have greater strength feats.


    ... creating forcefields strong enough to house cosmic entities...
    Are we talking about the containment field Adam created to hold the residual spirit of the Shaper of Worlds? The problem with the Shaper is that it always had raw power, being an emergent Cosmic Cube, but it lacked imagination. One day I'll tell you a story about how I played a trick on one of the strongest players on my old college football team using a simple finger trap. He was strong enough to lift the front end of small car, but couldn't figure out how to free his fingers. That's how I see Adam and the field that he created to contain the Shaper of World's ghost. If I recall correctly, that force field imposed a bit of a strain on Adam.

    More to my point, Adam's force field feat was diminished by Anti-Man, who effortlessly imprisoned both Adam and Monica in a force field that neither could escape. When a man who has Adam's exact same powers -- but far less intelligence -- creates a field that Adam can't remedy, something is clearly wrong in our estimation of Adam's rung on the ladder.


    ... empowering Captain Marvel to Binary...
    Hyperion, Thor, Sentry, Firelord, Sersi, Silver Surfer, Quasar (any Quantum Band wielder), Captain Universe, Monica, Nova, Storm, a few Eternals -- really, just about any energy wielder in this class can do that. It's not really a feat. Think of Carol as a stick of dynamite. Well, a cosmic stick of dynamite. A veritable "white hole" of potential energy. She just needs a striker to ignite her fuse. Or maybe think of her as a stalled car that needs a jump. You don't need to hook jumper cables up to a Chernobyl-like event in order to get her engine running. A golf cart battery would do.

    But again circling back to my point, Adam's feats are usually readily equaled or exceeded. In this case, it's the latter. Adam uses his powers to spark Carol to Binary form. Whoopty do. Later in the series Anti-Man uses his powers to fire up Galactus. Galactus!!! Carol may be plenty powerful as Binary, but she's no Galactus. Anti-Man shelled out so much power that it completely reversed the effects of beings who occupy the top most tier of the cosmos. Adam? Oh, sorry, nope. He couldn't even close a worm hole and completely depleted his "negative" energy trying to do just that.


    These are poor man's feats?
    Relative to others in his supposed power tier, yes. And it's not close.

  8. #338
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    I'd forgotten how much I enjoyed Hickman's Hyperion, to be fair. Hickperion?

  9. #339
    Fantastic Member Harsh Lesson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudicatorPrime View Post
    Perhaps, but I didn't miss Power Princess dropping the Ultimate Hulk and carrying him off like he was curbside trash. So there's that.
    Does being downed by Squirrel Girl diminish Thanos, or is it more appropriate to focus on his standard showings, rather than outliers?

    1960s Anti-Man as written by Grevioux was not the same Anti-Man as the more modern age Anti-Man. The modern age Anti-Man was only defeated by Adam by virtue of the link that they share to the anti-matter universe. Otherwise, for all intents and purposes the modern era Anti-Man was clearly more powerful than Adam...plus Sentry...plus all of the Avengers, including Ares, Captain Marvel (Carol) and Iron Man.
    You can rationalize it however you want(minus your speculation over power-levels of course, we don't need that), Adam has solo'd Anti-Man on multiple occasions. In fact, his being the only one of Earth's hero capable of dealing with Conner was the catalyst for his returning to the cape.

    I vaguely recall reading somewhere that KH had been diminished in power and prowess as well. I forget if that was at the hands of Juggernaut or some other powerhouse. Not sure if KH was being jobbed, or if we can officially close the book on the top end power that he had in the Ultraverse stories. Clearly that's no longer the case.
    I don't know what you're referring to, feel free to correct us with some on panel evidence of your speculations. Until such time, Adam solo'd King Hyperion.

    Like I said, Adam's feats have been equaled or exceeded by others in his tier. Adam moving a meteor the mass of a small state is one thing. But one of the Hyperions moved an entire planet. Thor, both in myth and in the comics, lifted the Midgard Serpent, which is so massively large that it encircles the Earth. The difference between a grain of sand and a mountain.
    Thor & Hyperion obviously have a deeper pool of feats to draw from because they've been around since the 60's. Are you being intellectually dishonest on purpose?

    It wasn't a TKO, but a standing 8 count. Anyone who has ever seen a real boxing match will tell you that a man isn't out of the fight until he's out for the full count. Sentry did drop Adam, though. Blindside sucker punch or not, it counts. And Adam was out. The next time we see Adam, he's convalescing in the medical wing of Avengers HQ.
    He was removed from the battlefield, he was tko'd. He also couldn't deal with Anti-Man, who Adam solo'd.

    You don't really want to get me started on all of the energy manipulative feats that Sentry, Silver Surfer, Quasar and others have managed, do you?
    You can do whatever you like, but pointing to feats that occurred decades ago, from characters who've been around for 60 years or more, doesn't serve your argument for reasons that have already been explained, and shouldn't need repeated: Adam is only 13 years old.

    And yet in the last Doom series Adam is seen wearing a special suit for the "black hole" singularity, which turned out to be a worm hole. Do I have to pull the images of Adam Warlock traversing a Black Hole without any such accoutrements? Further, in another story Adam appears to be concerned about radiation, which I find peculiar, if not interesting. I realize there are different forms of radiation, but it does make you wonder if perhaps Adam used a protective force field when that atomic warhead detonated in his face.
    Again, you can spend your time however you like, doesn't change the fact that Adam tanked a hydrogen bomb.

    Yep, we covered that above. Planets weigh more than battleships. And was it the Hulk or Gladiator that ripped a star apart with his bare hands? Or maybe it was Sentry? I'm losing track. In any event, others in his class have greater strength feats.
    How does planets weighing more than a battleships diminish Adam's feat?

    If I were being as intellectually dishonest as you, I'd point to Gladiator getting stomped on multiple occasions by lower level characters, infamously against Black Dwarf(After Black Panther solo'd), despite being flaked by Ronan, Annihilus, & Kl'Rt. Or Hyperion being nearly killed by a low level mutant in his own mini series back in 2016, requiring the help of his temporary side-kick to survive.

    Are we talking about the containment field Adam created to hold the residual spirit of the Shaper of Worlds? The problem with the Shaper is that it always had raw power, being an emergent Cosmic Cube, but it lacked imagination. One day I'll tell you a story about how I played a trick on one of the strongest players on my old college football team using a simple finger trap. He was strong enough to lift the front end of small car, but couldn't figure out how to free his fingers. That's how I see Adam and the field that he created to contain the Shaper of World's ghost. If I recall correctly, that force field imposed a bit of a strain on Adam.

    More to my point, Adam's force field feat was diminished by Anti-Man, who effortlessly imprisoned both Adam and Monica in a force field that neither could escape. When a man who has Adam's exact same powers -- but far less intelligence -- creates a field that Adam can't remedy, something is clearly wrong in our estimation of Adam's rung on the ladder.
    More speculation & rationalizations to diminish Adam's on panel showings? Color me shocked.

    Hyperion, Thor, Sentry, Firelord, Sersi, Silver Surfer, Quasar (any Quantum Band wielder), Captain Universe, Monica, Nova, Storm, a few Eternals -- really, just about any energy wielder in this class can do that. It's not really a feat. Think of Carol as a stick of dynamite. Well, a cosmic stick of dynamite. A veritable "white hole" of potential energy. She just needs a striker to ignite her fuse. Or maybe think of her as a stalled car that needs a jump. You don't need to hook jumper cables up to a Chernobyl-like event in order to get her engine running. A golf cart battery would do.
    Baseless speculation to push your agenda.


    Relative to others in his supposed power tier, yes. And it's not close.
    I disagree, you're just whining.

  10. #340

  11. #341
    Astonishing Member dkrook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbon jiren View Post
    So let me understand this, is it for the sake of being different from the superman origin story why you don't want the parents to show up? Are you concerned that it will seem like Blue Marvel trying to be like superman too much?

    My take is quite different. I would actually include his father at the very least (maybe his mom died in child birth) through out his story. It gives Adams story an added layer of familiarity. His heart is where his family is, especially with 1 living parent.
    Now, it's totally fitted for MCU when you consider so many characters have the common thread subplot of father and son relationships. I for one wouldn't mind see this play out better on screen minus the disastrous results. Especially with the stereotyped dynamic of black men and dads on screen.

  12. #342
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    Dying to see the winner in this fight. It never happened anywhere, did it? Hyperion jacked in the Squadron and he's never run into Adam again as far as I can tell.

  13. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudicatorPrime View Post
    More to my point, Adam's force field feat was diminished by Anti-Man, who effortlessly imprisoned both Adam and Monica in a force field that neither could escape. When a man who has Adam's exact same powers -- but far less intelligence -- creates a field that Adam can't remedy, something is clearly wrong in our estimation of Adam's rung on the ladder.
    It was clear that anti-man was more powerful then ever because he had the power cosmic galactus gave him in the ultimates book with his own powers.
    That's why adam and monica could not break out or break out right away.
    Remember when blue marvel threw a punch at anti-man and he was able to dodge it so fast.
    Blue marvel said how are you doing this?
    It's because the galactus major power boost anti-man got and for some reason some are forgetting that.


    And yet in the last Doom series Adam is seen wearing a special suit for the "black hole" singularity, which turned out to be a worm hole. Do I have to pull the images of Adam Warlock traversing a Black Hole without any such accoutrements? Further, in another story Adam appears to be concerned about radiation, which I find peculiar, if not interesting. I realize there are different forms of radiation, but it does make you wonder if perhaps Adam used a protective force field when that atomic warhead detonated in his face.
    So far the only weakness blue marvel has is Neutronium.

    I guess he wore the suit because blue marvel has experience and did not know what type of black hole/later wormhole it was and what it would do.
    That's why he wore it.
    He did want any more suprises when it comes to radiation or anything else.
    It's called experience and he was using his brain.
    In fact it was his scientist daughter that told to him wear the space suit.

    It was caution etc..plus it help him with his powers to stop the wormhole from growing.
    So that suit was for varied purposes.
    It seems clear to me.
    Anyway he stop the blackhole(it was really a wormhole) in doom's book.
    That's another major feat i forgot to mention and it's ignored for some reason.

    By the way folks have been asking why hulk wears armor at times.
    He has had space suits himself with a helmet.

    10 OP Suits Of Armor Hulk Smashed (And 10 He Was Forced To Wear)

    https://www.cbr.com/hulk-armor/




    Yep, we covered that above. Planets weigh more than battleships. And was it the Hulk or Gladiator that ripped a star apart with his bare hands? Or maybe it was Sentry? I'm losing track. In any event, others in his class have greater strength feats.
    Someone correct me if i am wrong here but gladiator and hulk never ripped a star with their bare hands and that Gladiator talk was from his son i think.
    It is bragging, hyperbole etc..

    By the way Gladiator's lifting feat has only been lifting a building and blue marvel has done that and more when it come to lifting feats and we know both Of them could lift more.
    Keep in mind hyperion in his first 10 years did not even lift a building and talk about Gladiator ripping a star was in the 2000's and Gladiator was created in the late 1970's.
    Last edited by mace11; 04-13-2021 at 01:00 PM.

  14. #344
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    Speaking of thor.
    Here some talk about him.

    Can he breath in space?

    can he?
    Not so much breathe I think as hold his breath for a really long time.
    huh i thought he could seeing how asgard is in space unless there is a force field around them
    He has and hasnt. It has depended on the writer.
    Thor is always shown breathing in space. When they go into space with there respective teams Thor is shown flying in space unaided while his team is flying in an aircraft. Even in Avengers Assemble #5-7 he was doing it.
    Edited By Alligatian
    He can.....but apparently we have this then:




    In that next scan he mentions that he has to find earth before blacks out, I honestly don't know what was going on here:





    Then we also have this:

    #14 Spambot
    @alligatian: There are various writers who have made Thor unable to survive in space for long just as there are plenty of others who have him fly through space and do things like fight inside the sun. We as comic readers just have to accept the inconsistencies. Writers don't really care about such things.


    They even talk about below thor and underwater feats etc..
    https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forum...n-space-20322/

  15. #345
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    Don't forget this as well.


    @Melvin Genao Nice try buddy. The current WW has been shown to bounce bullets off her chest in 2 ocassions. and really? you wanna talk about low showings? well lets start that superman has been KO'd by an explosion of a GAS STATION. can you believe it?? A gas station. he also got one punched by CATWOMAN(yeah, it happened) and Guy Gardner ACCIDENTALLY one shotted him. one mistake could also be Supes last mistake. am i right? ����
    How Catwoman Just Managed to Defeat Three Flashes At Once
    https://www.cbr.com/catwoman-defeats...dsters-batman/


    and this
    THREAD: WHY DID MANY PEOPLE WHINE ABOUT THE BLACK PANTHER ARMBAR SURFER THING
    https://community.cbr.com/showthread...r-Surfer-thing

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