Bruce Banner - The Hulk Appreciation 2021

[Vordan]

Didn’t Cates bring back Donald Blake and make him evil over in Thor? Lol I hope he’s not repeating himself already here.

[Intothevoid]

Didn’t Cates bring back Donald Blake and make him evil over in Thor? Lol I hope he’s not repeating himself already here.

I dunno if he is repeating himself here but reading that solicitations talking about a crazy scientsit am I the only one who immediately thought of this?

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You know when Aaron wrote Banner as a crazy scientist which resulted in one of the worst Hulk stories in modern times... I mean i know Cates worships Aaron but i am REALLY not looking forward to seeing Banner going "crazy" again for an arc or two and then going back to normal like nothing happened... which is exactly whats gonna happen again...

[CitizenXXX]

I think a mad scientist does not mean, um, literally "crazy".
Bruce is a scientist and he can do mad things, but that doesn't mean he's going to be a real mad maniac like in Aaron's run.

Or yes, he will really go crazy. Again. ****.

[Intothevoid]

Well there is a small chance he might not be crazy, it might mean something else but i am betting on him going all crazy on us, especially after Cates repeated multiple times that this Hulk run has the weirdest and craziest stuff he has ever written and i assume that's at least partially because his Banner will go off the rails.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I dunno if he is repeating himself here but reading that solicitations talking about a crazy scientsit am I the only one who immediately thought of this?

111.jpg

You know when Aaron wrote Banner as a crazy scientist which resulted in one of the worst Hulk stories in modern times... I mean i know Cates worships Aaron but i am REALLY not looking forward to seeing Banner going "crazy" again for an arc or two and then going back to normal like nothing happened... which is exactly whats gonna happen again...

The entirety of Cates' Thor refutes Aaron's on multiple levels, and yet people think he worships him because he was polite in an interview. Sigh...

[Cth]

Well, keep in mind what's happened during Ewing's run.

- Bruce's dad returned and tried to sacrifice him to some underworld entity
- Trauma of dying repeatedly
- Ex-wife split .. AGAIN (from his perspective)
- Mentally being ripped apart with one half being tortured in Hell

*IF* (big IF) this is a result of picking up Ewing's threads, maaaaaaaybe I can accept it short term. Long term, crazy Banner doesn't thrill me, unless it's on the pathway to the Maestro (which based on all the attempts to get to that point have been underwhelming). The only way I see Marvel going this route was *IF* they decided they want to go the Parallax route. Being angry, isolated from friends and people that can humanize him, only to run into trouble (it's inevitable he's going to end up with the Maker) I can see Bruce being tempted/influenced that way ultimately returning to Earth and another derivative World War Hulk crossover is destined to occur.

At what point to they realize a Hulk off world is the worst thing for Earth?

[Frontier]

I'll give it until the first three issues.

[Intothevoid]

The entirety of Cates' Thor refutes Aaron's on multiple levels, and yet people think he worships him because he was polite in an interview. Sigh...

Eh not really, he is still focusing too much on Mljonir and Thor being worthy and even the new solicitations for November talk about Thor chasing Mljonir... again... And he was more than just polite in an interview he credited Aaron for being responsible for him getting into comics and has even said that he hopes to be on his level in the next 5 years but he knows that Aaron by then will be on a whole new level... It's more than just a little polite.

[ChrisIII]

It of course can be argued that Bruce is not really sane in the first place, although not quite "evil" crazy.

Ewing did give us a bit of that in the Xemnu arc with Robert Banner, who was warped by Xemnu (also probably didn't help that the Leader was also in his head and posessed one of his alters).

[The Cool Thatguy]

Eh not really, he is still focusing too much on Mljonir and Thor being worthy and even the new solicitations for November talk about Thor chasing Mljonir... again... And he was more than just polite in an interview he credited Aaron for being responsible for him getting into comics and has even said that he hopes to be on his level in the next 5 years but he knows that Aaron by then will be on a whole new level... It's more than just a little polite.

The first issue, he wiped away Aaron's changes to Thor's appearance.

And while yes, he's doing an annoying, dragged out hammer arc, it's important to note that Cates' Thor isn't the least bit defined by his inability to be 'worthy'. He has his own self confidence, and he treats the changes of the hammer as concerning, but not defining.

Finally, his Thor is not a drunken frat boy. He's regal, powerful and intelligent.

Cates' work is far from perfect, mind. But his Thor is an indirect rebuke of Aaron's on multiple levels.

His words tow the company line. His writing...not so much.

[Intothevoid]

The first issue, he wiped away Aaron's changes to Thor's appearance.

And while yes, he's doing an annoying, dragged out hammer arc, it's important to note that Cates' Thor isn't the least bit defined by his inability to be 'worthy'. He has his own self confidence, and he treats the changes of the hammer as concerning, but not defining.

Finally, his Thor is not a drunken frat boy. He's regal, powerful and intelligent.

Cates' work is far from perfect, mind. But his Thor is an indirect rebuke of Aaron's on multiple levels.

His words tow the company line. His writing...not so much.

He restored Thors physical appearance, which was one of the least egregious things Aaron did to Thor.

Obviously he can't repeat the exact same theme but the fact that he is still doing the dumb hammer arcs even though people keep pleading with him to just move on as they are tired of it.

His Thor is an arrogant jerk, he himself has said that Thor to him is basically Superman but a jerk, which misses the entire point of Thor and is much closer to what Aaron also thought than what Thor actually is in the comics.

Here is the thing i don't really care what Cates thinks about Aaron or if he wants to replicate him or not, i hate that his stories try to mimic Aarons while also doing his own spin, i don't care to see Bruce Banner as a mad scientist, it's a stupid thing and people only do it because they wanna redo the Frankestein and his monster theme, ignoring the fact that it was a finite story where Frankenstein was not a hero while Banner has to go crazy and do messed up stuff but wake up tomorrow like he suddenly isn't crazy and he did nothing wrong, it doesn't work.

[McFarlane's Green Hulk]

Incredible Hulk #352
“Fervor”

Cover Date: February 1989
Sale Date: October 18th, 1988
Writer: Peter David
Artist: Jeff Purves
Inker: Terry Austin
Letterer: Joe Rosen
Colorist: Petra Scotese
Editor: Bobbie Chase
Guest Stars/Supporting Cast: Gorsham, Whully, Booly, Bohb, Jen,
Villain: The Grand Inquisitor
Synopsis: Open to a Coliseum phone operator taking another message from Marlo Chandler to “Mr. Fixit”. While she is assured that he’s very busy, in actuality, he’s fast asleep recounting the events in the world of K’ai a few short months ago. The following pages depicts the Grand Inquisitor preaching the gospel of the Hulk and warning his people of the “Anti-Hulk” and his now-gray appearance. Two rebels by the names of Bohb and Jen quietly slip away from the scene, with Bohb filling in the account of the holy sister who encountered the real Hulk in the forest. Back at Gorsham’s monastery, the wizards have dressed the gray brute into some regal clothing and insist that he will be worshipped by the people. The Hulk doesn’t care out that…he wants to be rid of Banner. Gorsham says he has kept his word, asking him if he feels his presence within him. Surprisingly, he doesn’t and offers a vague threat about it staying that way. Booly cannot believe that this gray brute is their savior, as he is different than before. Gorsham assures him that he is and once his usefulness is over, he’s gone. The group begins their pilgrimage across the land, making believers out of the disenchanted and making the Grand Inquisitor’s enforcers pay for their crimes. Meanwhile, Bohb and company are rounded up by the Inquisitor’s men and tortured. Bohb is killed and before the others can be, the Hulk arrives and takes down the Inquisitor. Hours later, as he dies, he repents and asks for the Hulk’s blessing. Later on, the Hulk has a change of heart and decides that he wants to stay on K’ai, but Gorsham reveals his true intentions and sends the Hulk back to Earth. Because of the volatile nature of previous spells from Earth and K’ai, the wizards exchange the brute for the adamantium statue that Alicia Masters had carved for him during his Presidential Pardon. The dream ends and we see a slumbering Bruce Banner instead of the Hulk as the narration boxes fill in the details about the Hulk’s trip back to Earth, his meeting with Berengetti.
Commentary: So the spell wears off by this issue’s end, and we get the return of Bruce Banner. The Hulk has been “Mr. Fixit” for a whole three months, not years. These two issues were Purves’ favorite to draw. He was really into fantasy-style art, and it shows in his renderings of Jarella’s world. Sadly, there hasn’t been any real follow-up to this particular story. There was that little adventure in the Captain Marvel series back in 2000, but it had nothing to do with Gorsham or what he had in store for the people. Haven't really noticed it until now, but the cover colors...ehhhhh...Inky is supposed to be a green-skinned humanoid. Think I'll hunt for a good B&W scan of this cover and try a new version in Photoshop. If I can find it...not a whole lot of good panels from this issue floating around.

[The Cool Thatguy]

He restored Thors physical appearance, which was one of the least egregious things Aaron did to Thor.

Obviously he can't repeat the exact same theme but the fact that he is still doing the dumb hammer arcs even though people keep pleading with him to just move on as they are tired of it.

His Thor is an arrogant jerk, he himself has said that Thor to him is basically Superman but a jerk, which misses the entire point of Thor and is much closer to what Aaron also thought than what Thor actually is in the comics.

Here is the thing i don't really care what Cates thinks about Aaron or if he wants to replicate him or not, i hate that his stories try to mimic Aarons while also doing his own spin, i don't care to see Bruce Banner as a mad scientist, it's a stupid thing and people only do it because they wanna redo the Frankestein and his monster theme, ignoring the fact that it was a finite story where Frankenstein was not a hero while Banner has to go crazy and do messed up stuff but wake up tomorrow like he suddenly isn't crazy and he did nothing wrong, it doesn't work.

Look, I'm not going to defend his story telling. Yes, the hammer arc is annoying and IMO, Cates can't execute a climax to save his life.

But again, judge him by his deeds. His 'jerk Thor' played a prank on Tony Stark, allowed Stark to smack him with the hammer and then allowed a rando civilian to tool around with his hammer.

And in another rebuke of Aaron, Cates both stated and demonstrated that Thor's power isn't limited to his hammer. A far cry from Aaron's Thor, who's hammer was powered by some vague cosmic storm.

Knowing what I know of Cates, I don't have much faith in his Hulk story. But the record should be set straight

[Intothevoid]

Look, I'm not going to defend his story telling. Yes, the hammer arc is annoying and IMO, Cates can't execute a climax to save his life.

But again, judge him by his deeds. His 'jerk Thor' played a prank on Tony Stark, allowed Stark to smack him with the hammer and then allowed a rando civilian to tool around with his hammer.

And in another rebuke of Aaron, Cates both stated and demonstrated that Thor's power isn't limited to his hammer. A far cry from Aaron's Thor, who's hammer was powered by some vague cosmic storm.

Knowing what I know of Cates, I don't have much faith in his Hulk story. But the record should be set straight

I mean we reach the same conclusion either way, there is little to no confidence in Cates writing a good Hulk story. However as long as it's full of braindead action and he doesn't do any character assassination(don't mean kill off character but screw up their characterization) and doesn't retcon anything i will be satisfied, that's the lowest bar i can set for him.

[The Cool Thatguy]

I mean we reach the same conclusion either way, there is little to no confidence in Cates writing a good Hulk story. However as long as it's full of braindead action and he doesn't do any character assassination(don't mean kill off character but screw up their characterization) and doesn't retcon anything i will be satisfied, that's the lowest bar i can set for him.

lol, yeah, after Ewing, Cates is gonna be a hard crash to the ground

I'm just tired of everyone saying 'Look at this interview, Cates loves Aaron!' when his writing runs counter to Aaron's in important and major ways