Mary Jane Watson-Parker Appreciation 2021

[Agent Z]

If you have to promote Gwen by slandering MJ and calling her names, as Emma Stone had to do at the time and afterwards, then I think fans of that character are within their rights to resent the "push" especially since the "push" is happening by people who refuse to accept the historical reasons why Gwen was so unpopular in the first place or refuse to align the new version with the original version of the character in the pages of Spider-Man.

Slott spreading memes with misogynistic slurs to a popular and beloved character as a way to attract attention was what got him that backlash. (And yeah it's misogynistic even if it's a woman who said it). And he's not taking responsibility...which again what was the character he was assigned to write?

It was a joke that she made on SNL. I highly doubt she even cares one iota about who is better between MJ or Gwen. If anything, the ire should be thrown at SNL for scripting that joke.

As for Gwen not being like her original incarnation, so what? Most long-running characters bear little to no similarity to their original depiction. This argument being used against Gwen is no better than anyone using MJ's original depiction as "proof" that she doesn't belong with Peter.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

It was a joke that she made on SNL. I highly doubt she even cares one iota about who is better between MJ or Gwen. If anything, the ire should be thrown at SNL for scripting that joke.

That's why I said "had to say" in my post.

[Agent Z]

That's why I said "had to say" in my post.

Again, it was a joke on SNL. I seriously doubt it was about promoting Gwen so much as a humorous, if crass nod to MJ.

As for slandering MJ, I've witnessed plenty of MJ fans doing just that to Gwen. And with far worse language than what Slott or Stone have done. I've seen very little backlash to that.

[Kevinroc]

It was a joke that she made on SNL. I highly doubt she even cares one iota about who is better between MJ or Gwen. If anything, the ire should be thrown at SNL for scripting that joke.

As for Gwen not being like her original incarnation, so what? Most long-running characters bear little to no similarity to their original depiction. This argument being used against Gwen is no better than anyone using MJ's original depiction as "proof" that she doesn't belong with Peter.

The joke is no grown person should actually care that much about this kind of thing.

It still uses highly misogynistic language and concepts such as slut shaming that a sizable portion of people have absolutely taken to heart.

So it's problematic at best, misogynistic at worst.

Why bring it up in 2021 as Slott did? What is the point? Slott said "Reminder" and tweeted the old SNL joke out, without adding a new punchline or anything.

[Kevinroc]

You can make the argument that Slott was trying to pull a Gail Simone-style troll. I could potentially buy that argument. Simone like to troll fanbases by saying goofy things like how Cyclops has heat vision or Gambit is a narc.

Slott's idea was to tweet Emma Stone saying Mary Jane is a skank on SNL from about a decade ago.

I shouldn't need to explain why this is highly problematic.

[Spider-Tiger]

Yeah, Slott's just trolling here. Tbh I never thought that he hated Mary Jane. He came across as being more lukewarm toward the character than anything else, and seemed to have more of an interest in novelty. He definitely gets a kick out of trolling the fans though.

Again, it was a joke on SNL. I seriously doubt it was about promoting Gwen so much as a humorous, if crass nod to MJ.

As for slandering MJ, I've witnessed plenty of MJ fans doing just that to Gwen. And with far worse language than what Slott or Stone have done. I've seen very little backlash to that.

You said this before...but what exactly are you referring to? Is it happening on this forum or elsewhere, and what is being said about Gwen?

Slott and Emma have a platform that the average fan doesn't so it makes sense to hold them to a different standard. I don't really recall anyone affiliated with Marvel slut shaming Gwen or calling her names. There has been some criticism of Gwen's character for sure (like from Gerry Conway, Roger Stern, etc.) , but I think there's a clear distinction between that and this.

[Chris0013]

I think people may be reading too much maliciousnous into the comment. I view it as being humorously catty and not to be taken as hateful.

SNL has a long history of stuff like that like the early season episode that had a Point/Counterpoint sketch with Jane Curtain and Dan Akroyd. Akroyd's rebuttal started with the line "Jane you ignorant (promiscuous woman)". I went ahead and censored that.

As well Eddie Murphy, Andrew Dice Clay and many other comedians use vulgarity to great affect in their routines. Don Rickles made a career out of insult comedy. And who doesn't like a good Roast?

I think the issue comes when someone is trying to be purposely hateful, demeaning or insulting with their comments.

[Spider-Tiger]

I don't think Emma meant any malice or hate by that joke at all. And I doubt the person that wrote it did. But I do think that it's problematic and irresponsible to use humor that perpetuates stereotypes (whether it be misogynistic or racist) especially in reference to brand like Spider-Man which reaches such a large young audience. Because, believe me, there are people that look at that and absolutely believe it, take it seriously, and repeat it in other contexts.

Slott, on the other hand, is most definitely trying to ruffle some feathers on his Twitter account.

[NC_Yankee]

Yeah, Slott's just trolling here. Tbh I never thought that he hated Mary Jane. He came across as being more lukewarm toward the character than anything else, and seemed to have more of an interest in novelty. He definitely gets a kick out of trolling the fans though.



You said this before...but what exactly are you referring to? Is it happening on this forum or elsewhere, and what is being said about Gwen?

Slott and Emma have a platform that the average fan doesn't so it makes sense to hold them to a different standard. I don't really recall anyone affiliated with Marvel slut shaming Gwen or calling her names. There has been some criticism of Gwen's character for sure (like from Gerry Conway, Roger Stern, etc.) , but I think there's a clear distinction between that and this.

I happen to agree with you. I do not see much criticism of Gwen at least at this site ( and the fans here are more hard core ( and usually more knowledgeable) then most). Even the stuff with Osborn, he takes a bigger hit then she ever did. Do some people bring up Sam Bullett? Of course, but even that is nothing compared to the bashing that MJ takes over Mysterio or the “Party Girl” stuff.

[Kevinroc]

I think people may be reading too much maliciousnous into the comment. I view it as being humorously catty and not to be taken as hateful.

SNL has a long history of stuff like that like the early season episode that had a Point/Counterpoint sketch with Jane Curtain and Dan Akroyd. Akroyd's rebuttal started with the line "Jane you ignorant (promiscuous woman)". I went ahead and censored that.

As well Eddie Murphy, Andrew Dice Clay and many other comedians use vulgarity to great affect in their routines. Don Rickles made a career out of insult comedy. And who doesn't like a good Roast?

I think the issue comes when someone is trying to be purposely hateful, demeaning or insulting with their comments.

Things change. Look at the first Raimi Spider-Man movie, where Peter insinuates his opponent is a gay man as an insult during their wrestling match. That kind of thing absolutely would not fly today.

[Chris0013]

Things change. Look at the first Raimi Spider-Man movie, where Peter insinuates his opponent is a gay man as an insult during their wrestling match. That kind of thing absolutely would not fly today.

And Blazing Saddles would never be made...and that is a shame.

[Kevinroc]

And Blazing Saddles would never be made...and that is a shame.

I'll state unequivocally that Peter losing the homophobia of the 2000s is a good thing. That bit is awkward in 2021.

[NC_Yankee]

Things change. Look at the first Raimi Spider-Man movie, where Peter insinuates his opponent is a gay man as an insult during their wrestling match. That kind of thing absolutely would not fly today.

It is pathetic that stuff cannot be shown today because some people are offended. In my humble opinion the two funniest films of all time are Trading Places and Animal House. Neither of which would be green lit today. Think of Trading Places with Beeks getting raped by a male gorilla. “One, gorilla, two gorillas, can’t you see their in love?” The eyes of Beeks is something else. I laugh every time I see it. Or Mortimer Duke using the N Word. That established what douches Mortimer and his brother Randolph were and without Valentine hearing it he is not chasing after Winthorp and saving his life ( and eventually they team up and make the Duke’s and ( especially) Beeks pay.

[CosmiComic]

It is pathetic that stuff cannot be shown today because some people are offended. In my humble opinion the two funniest films of all time are Trading Places and Animal House. Neither of which would be green lit today. Think of Trading Places with Beeks getting raped by a male gorilla. “One, gorilla, two gorillas, can’t you see their in love?” The eyes of Beeks is something else. I laugh every time I see it. Or Mortimer Duke using the N Word. That established what douches Mortimer and his brother Randolph were and without Valentine hearing it he is not chasing after Winthorp and saving his life ( and eventually they team up and make the Duke’s and ( especially) Beeks pay.

Are you being sarcastic?

[NC_Yankee]

Are you being sarcastic?

I guess those movies are not your cup of tea. To me they are classics like other politically incorrect movies like The Godfather and Scarface ( Pacino version).