Mary Jane Watson-Parker Appreciation 2021

[Spiderfan001]

I would like to see a poll of Spider-Man:Blue being canon or not

That would be cool
But the entire point of canon is that it's continuity, doesn't matter if everyone wants it to be or no one does.

Like marvel, after Sins Past is retconned just make it canon.Whatever you do canon or not just say it man

Also why would anyone not want it to be canon, like it's Blue(on of the best stories ever) vs Sins Past(the worst story like ever).I mean even if they retcon SP which hopefully happens, Blue still has all advantages right?

I guess people who hate Gwen or who want MJ to be Peter's first?(Not saying both are same btw, I can't seem to frame it better.I'm saying one or the other or both for few) don't want it to be canon.

I feel there is no other reason to not have it be canon

[Frontier]

That would be cool
But the entire point of canon is that it's continuity, doesn't matter if everyone wants it to be or no one does.

Like marvel, after Sins Past is retconned just make it canon.Whatever you do canon or not just say it man

Also why would anyone not want it to be canon, like it's Blue(on of the best stories ever) vs Sins Past(the worst story like ever).I mean even if they retcon SP which hopefully happens, Blue still has all advantages right?

I guess people who hate Gwen or who want MJ to be Peter's first?(Not saying both are same btw, I can't seem to frame it better.I'm saying one or the other or both for few) don't want it to be canon.

I feel there is no other reason to not have it be canon

Well, admittedly my opinion of Spider-Man: Blue is somewhat colored because I feel like it's used to promote Peter and Gwen's relationship over MJ to some extent.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

I would like to see a poll of Spider-Man:Blue being canon or not

I don’t think it’s necessary.

Spider-Man Blue is set entirely in Peter’s reminiscing and going nostalgia crazy. It’s not a straight solid story.

So any inconsistencies just chalk it to Peter’s memories.

[Starrius]

Well, admittedly my opinion of Spider-Man: Blue is somewhat colored because I feel like it's used to promote Peter and Gwen's relationship over MJ to some extent.

I never thought it was canon for the same exact reasons that Spider-Tiger mentioned.
I do feel that it is used to promote Peter and Gwen's relationship over MJ extent too.
I have seen people use Spider-Man: Blue to support Gwen being Peter's one true love and not Mary Jane.


It's not about me wanting it to not be canon. I just never thought it was canon in the first place.
With how different it is, I never got the impression that it was ever canon.
It was just a graphic novel re-telling Peter and Gwen and flesh out their romantic past.
It seemed to pit Gwen and Mary Jane against each other.
The book had a bit more Mary Jane than Gwen.
Jeph Loeb wrote the graphic novel The Long Halloween that included Batman's past as Catwoman in and out of costumes, and I never thought that was canon.

I do wonder why graphic novel of Peter making an audio diary on Valentine's Day while married to Mary Jane was even written.


Spider-Fan made the claim that 50-60% believe that Spider-Man:Blue is canon, and so I was curious about having a poll.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Spider-Man Blue came out around 2002-2003 at a time when Peter and MJ in early JMS run were separate and yet the end of the book still has her shown as a strong supportive wife and the best scene in the book.

So whatever the motivations it doesn’t undercut MJ at all. There’s that line there where Peter says you can’t tell Gwen’s story without Mary Jane’s. So Gwen is presented on MJ’s shadow.

[Spiderfan001]

Well, admittedly my opinion of Spider-Man: Blue is somewhat colored because I feel like it's used to promote Peter and Gwen's relationship over MJ to some extent.

I strongly disagree.It has a great MJ in it, the entire point of blue is Gwen and Peter's relationship and how it affected Peter and MJ.It's not promoting one over the other, it's talking about the one that's done and how he's reminiscing.As I said, only people who don't want Gwen and her relationship w/Peter to have anything are the ones who want this to be not canon.The story itself is beautiful and has no downsides and doesn't take away from MJ and Peter's relation,just adds to Peter and Gwen's.Heck it even adds to MJ's character.

[Spiderfan001]

I don’t think it’s necessary.

Spider-Man Blue is set entirely in Peter’s reminiscing and going nostalgia crazy. It’s not a straight solid story.

So any inconsistencies just chalk it to Peter’s memories.

Yeah, but he can't imagine entire meetings so small stuff like the dress I can see but if Peter and Gwen did do it, he can't imagine that.

[Spiderfan001]

I never thought it was canon for the same exact reasons that Spider-Tiger mentioned.
I do feel that it is used to promote Peter and Gwen's relationship over MJ extent too.
I have seen people use Spider-Man: Blue to support Gwen being Peter's one true love and not Mary Jane.


It's not about me wanting it to not be canon. I just never thought it was canon in the first place.
With how different it is, I never got the impression that it was ever canon.
It was just a graphic novel re-telling Peter and Gwen and flesh out their romantic past.
It seemed to pit Gwen and Mary Jane against each other.
The book had a bit more Mary Jane than Gwen.
Jeph Loeb wrote the graphic novel The Long Halloween that included Batman's past as Catwoman in and out of costumes, and I never thought that was canon.

I do wonder why graphic novel of Peter making an audio diary on Valentine's Day while married to Mary Jane was even written.


Spider-Fan made the claim that 50-60% believe that Spider-Man:Blue is canon, and so I was curious about having a poll.

It's him reminiscing about the past, not promoting their relationship as better.
I mean Peter has said repeatedly that MJ is his true love, like how you gonna contest that.And Blue does nothing to contest this, heck it makes MJ even better.

You are dead wrong, Blue never did anything to pit them against one another.MJ was very mature and understanding.

It's not love, it's guilt and nostalgia.He thinks he failed her, there's no contest as you seem to think there is.MJ is clearly the one for him, like Gwen ain't coming back and she ain't his true love, never will be.She was his first serious relationship and his first(imo).

Yeah, the poll is a cool idea but it doesn't answer the canon question.I'll do one but I feel Sins Past, a big reason everyone hates Gwen may be retconned soon so I'll wait for Spencer's run to end and then make one if that's cool with you.

Again Blue does nothing to push MJ down, it even kinda makes her better.She isn't immature, she's calm and understanding.She grew up and is the one for peter, like the f*cking Devil took their marriage away and Dan Slott gave them a decade of bad writing(which is worse imo) and they still got back together.I mean it doesn't get much worse than this.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Yeah, but he can't imagine entire meetings so small stuff like the dress I can see but if Peter and Gwen did do it, he can't imagine that.

Yeah he can. He can fantasise and confuse that with his memory.

[Spiderfan001]

Yeah he can. He can fantasise and confuse that with his memory.

Bruh what?
He wasn't fantasizing, he was recalling memory.
He's not gonna think he met and slept with Gwen that night if he didn't.This was a re-telling, not him dreaming or wondering.
This isn't even a debate, you can argue it's non-canon(which I can see primarily because of SP) but saying that he was making such big stuff up in the contained story is just not true.He was looking back at memories, a dress could be switched but nothing like a meeting and his first time.

Not gonna talk about Blue here anymore, let's wait for the retconning stuff that may happen in Spencer's run and then like make it's own thread w/ poll.

[Revolutionary_Jack]

Bruh what?
He wasn't fantasizing, he was recalling memory.
He's not gonna think he met and slept with Gwen that night if he didn't.This was a re-telling, not him dreaming or wondering.
This isn't even a debate, you can argue it's non-canon(which I can see primarily because of SP) but saying that he was making such big stuff up in the contained story is just not true.He was looking back at memories, a dress could be switched but nothing like a meeting and his first time.

Not gonna talk about Blue here anymore, let's wait for the retconning stuff that may happen in Spencer's run and then like make it's own thread w/ poll.

1) We don’t actually see them get it on. People assume because the panel hints it.
2) It’s entirely common for people in real life, normal people, to confuse fantasies with reality in retelling of stories.

Peter has a history of giving into daydreams and so on.

[Spiderfan001]

1) We don’t actually see them get it on. People assume because the panel hints it.
2) It’s entirely common for people in real life, normal people, to confuse fantasies with reality in retelling of stories.

Peter has a history of giving into daydreams and so on.

1)"That night she had me, all of me".That seems a pretty big "hint".It's a comic, they don't show s*x a lot of times.
2)Bruh you're reaching, that can be said for any flashback in comics ever.Unless stated it was a daydream, it's not.
And small facts can change, not entire meetings entirely.

But it's stated he is daydreaming when such things happen and he's aware of it, there is no mention of day-dreaming in this.And this was an audio record he was making, there is no chance he was day-dreaming at all.

Also you invalidate them sleeping together by saying it's only hinted at(a pretty big, obvious and blatant hint at that) but you call it daydreaming which has no hints at all.I mean there is a clear bias in your judgement.

[Kevinroc]

Blue isn't canon because it would override Lee/Romita. Just think of it as an AU and you'll be fine.

[Spiderfan001]

Blue isn't canon because it would override Lee/Romita. Just think of it as an AU and you'll be fine.

I can agree with this, small inconsistencies but it's still inconsistencies.

Technically, all these comics are canon unless Marvel says so otherwise like with Dark Ages,etc. Stealth retcons are a thing.We have multiple bigger retcons than the small inconsistencies in this in retelling stories in canon comics.I don't understand why Blue is an exception to this, why can't it be a small retcon.

But saying that everything in Blue even as a contained story is daydreaming is just false.

[Jman27]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Marvel/comm...ything_in_the/

Except for Aunt May