Really late, but since it's still technically National Siblings Day somewhere...
Tumblr_l_518580448546342.jpg
Tumblr_l_518575488132281.jpg
Really late, but since it's still technically National Siblings Day somewhere...
Tumblr_l_518580448546342.jpg
Tumblr_l_518575488132281.jpg
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
Graduating her out from directly under Bruce's shadow isn't necessarily a bad move. Nightwing has Bludhaven. Depends on how it's done.
Coryanna didn't work so well, but that may have been a testing of the waters. If they came up with a good story reason to put her, Bette, Renee, and Jacob in a different city it could freshen things up. I seriously doubt that's what they're doing here though. I know you'll say why would she leave Gotham it's her home and all that, but various people move homes for a variety of reasons.
IMO since she rarely interacts with the rest of the Batfamily, apart from showing-up for the occasional cameo like she's just there for a magazine shoot, she might as well be in a different city anyway.
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
Change things-up, put them in a different environment, and introduce an alternative set of circumstances. A different city will have a different group of criminals and social structure to that of Gotham. It could be an opportunity to create a unique rogue's gallery for her, for one thing, and maybe even expand her support cast. It also largely erases the issue of 'why doesn't she just call in the Batfamily for backup', when things get out of hand.
As for the why, how about a why not. It could keep things from stagnating. Maybe she joins a team, and their headquarters aren't in Gotham, but the work they're doing is important. Gotham isn't the only city that needs protecting. And not all Batfamily members have to stay stationed in Gotham, nor do they all.
Why is that needed? Why do something as drastic as changing cities? If it's really so vital to shake things up for her (I disagree it is), then find an element of Gotham's crime world she's not gone up against. She's never dealt with the mob in any significant capacity, for instance.
Again, why? She technically does have a rogues gallery already, but part of what I like is that it doesn't really feel like a typical one. You mentioned hopefully "Graduating her out from directly under Bruce's shadow" (I strongly disagree that that hasn't already happened, but that's a different topic), but yet you want to make her more like Batman by doing this? I don't get that reasoning.It could be an opportunity to create a unique rogue's gallery for her, for one thing, and maybe even expand her support cast.
Has that ever been a question? At all? Have there ever been any situations where that would've applied? I can't think of any.It also largely erases the issue of 'why doesn't she just call in the Batfamily for backup', when things get out of hand.
I mean, that's not a reason. I don't understand why you think things are stagnating with her. She's not appearing regularly enough for things to stagnate. Every single one of her series has had a different premise, and she's never had one that's just a "typical" sort of series. How about doing one of those first before any of this moving cities nonsense? Not just change for change's sake.As for the why, how about a why not. It could keep things from stagnating.
Last edited by Caivu; 04-17-2021 at 08:54 PM.
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
Where are you even getting that interpretation from - I never said anything about making her more like Batman. If anything, taking her out of Gotham makes her less like Batman.
Nothing interesting is happening with her. Mostly she just shows-up for cameo's in Batfamily events to remind everyone she exists. And changing things up to make things interesting is a reason.
You don't agree, and that's fine, but that doesn't invalidate my opinion. But if you're going to be a jerk about it, Caivu, I'm not going to engage in this discussion with you any further. I could dismiss your ideas as "nonsense" too, but that would be rude.
You mentioned giving her a dedicated, official rogues gallery like most other superheroes, and most famously Batman, has. The fact that she doesn't have one (at least in such a strict sense) is something unique about her. It's part of how she bends away from many typical superhero tropes.
But it doesn't follow that therefore the answer is "move her to another city." There's no connection there, when the much simpler answer is "just use her in something in Gotham."Nothing interesting is happening with her. Mostly she just shows-up for cameo's in Batfamily events to remind everyone she exists.
I think we're talking about different things. I'm talking about in-story reasons, and there aren't any story reasons why her work would be stagnating. From a story standpoint, a character standpoint, how does this idea make any sense at all? Changing things just for the sake of changing them isn't a reason, because it's not based on anything concrete. That's what I'm looking for.And changing things up to make things interesting is a reason.
My apologies. But I'm just so tired of this sort of stuff in regards to Kate. I'm tired of seemingly everyone wanting to overcomplicate her for no other reason than "just because." Whether that be story, or character, anything. I've been seeing that stuff for years here and there, and it's annoying, because it's almost never based on anything substantial.You don't agree, and that's fine, but that doesn't invalidate my opinion. But if you're going to be a jerk about it, Caivu, I'm not going to engage in this discussion with you any further.
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
The one interesting villain she had was Alice, who is now redeemed/recovering (IMO they need to show more of what Beth is up to now). Personally I didn't think much of Safiya and the Knife, but perhaps they could be further developed. Wolf-Spider and Colony-Prime were also meh IMO. She needs some more interesting ones, rather than just renting the typical Batman/family baddies.
The last time I was genuinely excited about something they'd done with her was the 'Gotham City Monsters' mini, but that was a one-off it seems, and nothing new and dynamic has happened with her since. Sure, she gets to appear in Batfamily events, mostly as short cameo's, and she gets the occasional guest appearance or one-shot, but it's typical 'look-badass' stuff that does nothing interesting with the character. There's no long-game ongoing narrative, and we rarely see her life out-of-costume anymore, or for that matter her relationship with other characters outside of her hero persona. It's all look cool and punch things.
It's not "just because", it's that we want something to get excited about, instead of more of the same and just 'looking cool'. The ROC, the fight with Batman (the first time, but now that's been done to death) and the DEO blackmail - exciting stuff used to happen. I wasn't the biggest fan of the Tynion 'Tec run, but at least fun stories were happening there too, even if personally I hated what was done with Jacob. Plus, I wish they'd bring Bette back and have them as partners again.
Why, though? That just seems like it would flatten her out and make her like any other superhero. It's a good thing that she doesn't have a standard rogues gallery, because not only does that help her stand out, it puts more of the focus on her.
This is the exact problem I'm talking about. You want something new and different without any apparent regard for what it is or whether it makes sense for the story or the character. Just as long as it's new and shakes things up. That's what I'm saying when I use the phrase "just because," since it doesn't seem like there's anything of substance attached to it. If there is, then what is it? That's what I'm not understanding.It's not "just because", it's that we want something to get excited about, instead of more of the same and just 'looking cool'.
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
Because she needs excellent villains to bounce off of IMO. A dynamic narrative needs compelling villains, and some real struggle. Best way to do that is to make things personal.
Well, you're assuming a lot there about other people's motivations because of a lack of specificity. Character motivation, setting, story, and plot - that's what the writer's are for. Most fans aren't professional writers after all: so when people say they want something to happen, it's just that - they want something to happen, but they don't have any specific ideas because they want the writer's to do that part.
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)
I've taken to the line of thinking that outside of Rucka and J.H. William III - most writers seem to have it in for Jacob for whatever reason.
He was absent from both Andreyko and Bennett's runs, and a villain in Tynion's. I've also heard rumor that in the TV show he gets abducted and manipulated every other episode, and is now a drug addict. True or not: I'm not going to watch it to find out.
I guess the comic writer's think Kate having a loving and supporting father makes her less of a 'tragic-bat' or something.
For the DC Pride anthology I believe:
https://twitter.com/Trungles/status/1385372662428422147
This one, too:
https://twitter.com/Trungles/status/...498027520?s=19
Mega fan of: Helena Bertinelli (pre-52), Batwoman, Birds of Prey, Guardians of the Galaxy, Secret Six
Fan of: Batman, Cassandra Cain, Wonder Woman, Silk, Stephanie Brown, Captain America, Hellcat, Renee Montoya, Gotham Central, King Shark
Quasi-Fan of: Aquaman, Midnighter, Superman, Catwoman, Nightwing, Green Arrow, Squadron Supreme, Red Hood
Other likes: Low, Hush, Arkham Asylum: ASHoSE, Watchmen, A-Force, Bombshells, Grayson, Unfollow
Team Cap (both Rogers and Danvers)