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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor-Ul View Post
    His mother waas irish, but his father was latino.
    Was he?
    Rayner doesn't sound much like a latino surname to me.
    Unless his mother (Kyle's granny) was latino, of course.
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by extra skater View Post
    Was he?
    Rayner doesn't sound much like a latino surname to me.
    Unless his mother (Kyle's granny) was latino, of course.
    Judd Winick revealed Kyle's dad was (I think) Mexican.
    His mother was Irish.
    It kinda came out of left field and has been pretty much ignored by all & sundry since.
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  3. #33
    Relaunched, not rebooted! SJNeal's Avatar
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    I remember it the other way around - mom was latina and dad was not - hence the last name...?

    However it's been 47 years since I've read Winick's run so I could be wrong.
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  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    Judd Winick revealed Kyle's dad was (I think) Mexican.
    His mother was Irish.
    It kinda came out of left field and has been pretty much ignored by all & sundry since.
    Thanks. Aaron Rayner, his father, innit?
    As I said, maybe Aaron either was of Mexican descent on his mother side or used his mother's family name instead of his father.
    Has he ever showed up?
    I remember Kyle's mother was a blond woman.
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by extra skater View Post
    Thanks. Aaron Rayner, his father, innit?
    As I said, maybe Aaron either was of Mexican descent on his mother side or used his mother's family name instead of his father.
    Has he ever showed up?
    I remember Kyle's mother was a blond woman.
    Aaron Rayner appeared a few times.
    At the end of the Hard Travelling Heroes crossover with GA (GA #110-111 & GL #76-77)
    We also saw him in GL #150 where we saw he wasn't the deadbeat dad we thought he was and he'd known Kyle was GL from the get-go and had been keeping track of his exploits.
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  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by married guy View Post
    Aaron Rayner appeared a few times.
    At the end of the Hard Travelling Heroes crossover with GA (GA #110-111 & GL #76-77)
    We also saw him in GL #150 where we saw he wasn't the deadbeat dad we thought he was and he'd known Kyle was GL from the get-go and had been keeping track of his exploits.
    Gon check my files later.
    Thanks.
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  7. #37
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    I actually really liked Winick's run on Green Lantern.
    He gave us Nero, Ion, kept the Kyle/John/Guy dynamic going.
    He also handled the Kyle/Jenni relationship really well too.
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  8. #38
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by extra skater View Post
    Was he?
    Rayner doesn't sound much like a latino surname to me.
    Unless his mother (Kyle's granny) was latino, of course.
    Judd Winick retconned Kyle's origin to make him mixed-raced Latino. Originally Ron Marz gave him the name "Rayner" to give him an Irish background, while the name "Kyle" came from Kyle Reese since Marz was apparently a huge Terminator nut. Kyle was always created as a Caucasian man with black hair. When Winick started writing the book, he retconned that Kyle's father Aaron Rayner was actually an alias for Gabriel Vasquez, a Mexican-American CIA agent. Hence Kyle is currently Irish-Mexican and obviously considered to be a person of color.
    Last edited by Johnny; 01-23-2021 at 07:24 AM.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Judd Winick retconned Kyle's origin to make him mixed-raced Latino. Originally Ron Marz gave him the name "Rayner" to give him an Irish background, while the name "Kyle" came from Kyle Reese since Marz was apparently a huge Terminator nut. Kyle was always created as a Caucasian man with black hair. When Winick started writing the book, he retconned that Kyle's father Aaron Rayner was actually an alias for Gabriel Vasquez, a Mexican-American CIA agent. Hence Kyle is currently Irish-Mexican and obviously considered to be a person of color.
    Thanks, Johnny!
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  10. #40
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    I miss a regular Kyle series. Got given 50 USD by my girlfriends parents over the holidays, going to use it to buy Circle of Fire

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Judd Winick retconned Kyle's origin to make him mixed-raced Latino. Originally Ron Marz gave him the name "Rayner" to give him an Irish background, while the name "Kyle" came from Kyle Reese since Marz was apparently a huge Terminator nut. Kyle was always created as a Caucasian man with black hair. When Winick started writing the book, he retconned that Kyle's father Aaron Rayner was actually an alias for Gabriel Vasquez, a Mexican-American CIA agent. Hence Kyle is currently Irish-Mexican and obviously considered to be a person of color.
    Which Justin Jordan retconned that out afterwards.

    I guess writers have different perspectives.

  12. #42
    Astonishing Member Sodam Yat's Avatar
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    I think Kyle Rayner is probably the second lantern outside of Hal Jordan having the largest supporting cast with new characters that were villains and civilians. So it was good that they didn't really try to borrow characters from Hal. I thought they invested in him really well.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Judd Winick retconned Kyle's origin to make him mixed-raced Latino. Originally Ron Marz gave him the name "Rayner" to give him an Irish background, while the name "Kyle" came from Kyle Reese since Marz was apparently a huge Terminator nut. Kyle was always created as a Caucasian man with black hair. When Winick started writing the book, he retconned that Kyle's father Aaron Rayner was actually an alias for Gabriel Vasquez, a Mexican-American CIA agent. Hence Kyle is currently Irish-Mexican and obviously considered to be a person of color.
    Where do you get "obviously" considered to be a person of color from? I bet if we took a poll, it would demonstrate that most GL readers (and almost certainly the broader population if taken into account) continue to think of Kyle Rayner as being a white guy.

  14. #44
    Extraordinary Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueRuggo View Post
    Where do you get "obviously" considered to be a person of color from? I bet if we took a poll, it would demonstrate that most GL readers (and almost certainly the broader population if taken into account) continue to think of Kyle Rayner as being a white guy.
    A character with a Mexican father is by definition a poc. Whether he "looks" that way or not, I suppose depends on how he is being drawn. If he's mixed-race then she he should look like he is as well.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    A character with a Mexican father is by definition a poc. Whether he "looks" that way or not, I suppose depends on how he is being drawn. If he's mixed-race then she he should look like he is as well.
    How is having a Mexican father "by definition" a POC. Race isn't just nationality. That's like saying Charlize Theron (who considers herself white) is by definition a POC because she's South African. What if Kyle's father was Argentinian instead of Mexican? Many Argentinians would scoff at being called a POC. I personally know someone who was born in Argentina to white Jewish immigrant parents who settled there years ago, where there is one of the largest Jewish populations in South America. He moved to the US at the age 5. He has blue eyes, brown hair, speaks with a natural American-English accent, and neither he nor his parents consider themselves to be POCs simply because they are Argentinian. They consider themselves white Hispanics because they are fluent in Spanish.

    Nationality is a potential factor of race, just as appearance can be, but neither is a final decider or definition of race. Race is multifactorial and is influenced by examples such as ethnicity, how you identified growing up, family and cultural values, experiences of being marginalized or maybe discriminated against, although not always. And yes, it is also to some extent influenced by how identifiable you are as a POC physically to others, which I would say Kyle is not. Therefore, I would not say Kyle Rayner is necessarily a POC.

    UPDATE: post was edited to include more description
    Last edited by BlueRuggo; 01-30-2021 at 01:40 PM.

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