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  1. #766
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danvidar View Post
    The Thor & Arthur Story: The Two Worthies wasn't by Aaron it was by Christopher Ruocchio & Steve McNiven, probably why I enjoyed it.

    Attachment 115927

    Attachment 115928
    Yes, this was the sole bright spot of the book. Nicely done by Ruocchio and McNiven's art was GORGEOUS. I was feeling a bit of Barry Windsor Smith vibe there.
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  2. #767
    Marvel's 1st Superhero Reviresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    This is how Avengers got to 750 isues:

    Volume 1: 1-402
    Volume 2: 1-13 (403-415)
    Volume 3: 1-84 (416-499)
    500-503
    New Avengers 1-64 (504-567)
    Volume 4: 1-34 (568-601)
    Volume 5: 1-44 (602-645)
    Volume 6: 0 issue
    ANAD Avengers 1-15 (646-660)
    Volume 7: 1-11 (661-671)
    672-690
    Volume 8: 1-17 (691-707)
    Avengers: No Road Home 1-10 (708-717)
    18-50 (718-750)

    Jason Aaron's run is better than Mark Waid's run and Rob Liefeld's Heroes Reborn issues. It is also better issues 376-402 of the first volume.
    Have to disagree on Waid's run. Liefeld ... you might have me there. But just barely.
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  3. #768
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Crazy ideas without any development or actual depth seems like Aaron's go-to these days. Like, they have their place in comic but it's getting to be a bit too much.
    Quote Originally Posted by Factor View Post
    And it seems like he REALLY didn't want to write classic She-Hulk. The moment she is finally fixed, she's written out of the book.
    And did Aaron forget Jane Foster used to be an Avenger back when she was Thor?
    Aaron's seemed like he had had it out for She-Hulk ever since he had Jane make fun of her name and that whole hamfisted WoR tie-in issue trying to explain why she kept that form.

    Jane may as well just replace Thor with Jane on the team because it's obvious who he cares about more.

  4. #769
    Extraordinary Member K7P5V's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reviresco View Post
    Have to disagree on Waid's run. Liefeld ... you might have me there. But just barely.
    Dunno about any of his recent runs... But, for what it's worth, I'll always enjoy Waid's brief run from the '90s (XD)


  5. #770
    Astonishing Member Nomads1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    Jason Aaron's run is better than Mark Waid's run and Rob Liefeld's Heroes Reborn issues. It is also better issues 376-402 of the first volume.
    Quote Originally Posted by Reviresco View Post
    Have to disagree on Waid's run. Liefeld ... you might have me there. But just barely.
    Yeah, I guess Liefeld's is the only one I can agree with here.

    Peace

  6. #771
    Astonishing Member Witchfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by K7P5V View Post
    Dunno about any of his recent runs... But, for what it's worth, I'll always enjoy Waid's brief run from the '90s (XD)

    Mark Waid has gotten the book cancelled three times as its writer.

  7. #772
    Mighty Member Captain Nash's Avatar
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    Thinking issue 750 may be a good dropping off point. I stuck with this run, through the good (very little of it), the bad, and the very bad, and I'm just feeling "meh" with the multiversal Master of Evil. Plus it's just more Jason Aaron. Kind of sad to do so after hopping on with Kurt Busiek's run and filling in the amazing (and some not so amazing) back stories from the 60s-90s in the meantime. But I've just felt it's very uninspired ever since this era began. But I couldn't quite bring myself to let it go. But I am feeling that way now. issue #750 is a nice banner stopping point as well.

  8. #773
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    An advanced review of Avengers 750:
    https://butwhythopodcast.com/2021/11...ers-issue-750/

    I agree with his summation of Aaron's Avengers:

    Aaron’s run on Avengers has been a bit of a mixed bag; while he’s turned out a couple of solid storylines such as “War of the Vampires” and Heroes Reborn, his grasp on the ensemble dynamics that usually go with the Avengers is less than stellar. He also throws a lot of big ideas at the audience, and while the Avengers do assemble to “face the threats that no single superhero could withstand” it feels overwhelming at times.
    I enjoyed Avengers 750. It tied up the last storyline while setting up big things down the line. And some of those ideas seemed very appealing to me. Multiversal Masters of Evil, the Council of Red, all the bits and pieces that Aaron has been placing throughout his run paid off here (or at the very least are leading to more development).

    As for Aaron's run, I always have some problems reading one of his issues the first time. Are characters supposed to act this way? Big ideas get tossed around so casually. Doesn't he realize how grand and omnipotent these forces are? Doesn't he realize the limits of some characters? All of those things are jarring. However, after reading the issue the second time around, I buy into what he's selling. It hovers around making sense. Afterwards, I get what he's trying to do and I enjoy his work. I'll be honest, I've reread his Moon Knight and Enter the Phoenix stories and actually dug them, after reading them a second time.

    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    Fair enough, but when I say "younger readers" I meant someone in their teens.

    I didn't care about canon at all (still don't) and found the earlier stuff boring. I mean for a typical teenager would you be attracted to the old guard Avengers or the New Avengers with Spider-Man and Wolverine?

    This may speak to Bendis' popularity with the big execs and why he gets all of the flagship titles - his talent to attract new younger readers.

    I was not at all interested in Avengers until I saw Spidey & Wolvie on the cover, because before that I was all about the X-Men, Spider-Man, and Batman.

    But I recognize why old heads would dislike his penchant of changing status quo (I'm still salty about Jon Kent)
    I get that bro. Again, I was of two minds. Spider-Man, Wolverine, Dr. Strange, there were certain taboos in Marvel Comics when it came to these characters. They were the loners or in their own pockets of the Marvel Universe. They never joined the Avengers because well, that's just how it was, right? Besides, Spidey and Wolverine were cool, but when you were fighting the Kree, the Masters of Evil, or a Celestial, you needed someone who could bring the firepower, like Vison, Sersi, Firebird, or Quasar. Sure, those characters may have been B or C-listers, but they were powerful B or C- listers.

    There was an issue of Thunderbolts that came out at the time that somewhat addressed this. Yes, you had Sentry on your team, but when he was neutralized, well, Speed Demon, Songbird, Radioactive Man, and Atlas could give Cap, Spider-Man, and Luke Cage a run for their money:



    Rereading the Bendis run though, woah, it felt good to see Spider-Man or Wolverine on the team. They brought personality. They also brought the credibility. Marvel's top heroes should have been with Earth's Mightiest Heroes. I agree with others who say that Bendis team fit the pattern of past Avengers teams, even when it didn't look like it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    I miss Avengers Mansion.
    Missed that too bro. Was there a privilege? Perhaps. But I always saw it as a type of grandeur. These heroes were the best and deserved the best. It always felt cool seeing the Avengers eating a breakfast prepared by Jarvis and then have Cap call a meeting. It paralleled what the X-Men did with the Xavier Institute back in Salem, NY.

    Avengers Tower or a hollowed out Celestial just haven't had the same effect on me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nomads1 View Post
    I wouldn't mind that, especially if it showcases many of the same members (Herc, Monica, Wanda, Vizh, Wonder Man, Voyager etc...) and has some of the same creators. No Surrender was, IMho, better than Far From Home, but I enjoyed both.

    Peace
    Loved that series. The underdogs were REALLY over their heads in that series. THey were surrounded with such urgency and like always somehow won in the end.
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  9. #774
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tien Long View Post
    Rereading the Bendis run though, woah, it felt good to see Spider-Man or Wolverine on the team. They brought personality. They also brought the credibility. Marvel's top heroes should have been with Earth's Mightiest Heroes. I agree with others who say that Bendis team fit the pattern of past Avengers teams, even when it didn't look like it.
    This is exactly what I thought at the time, like why would I want to read a team book with the "Earth's Mightiest Heroes" without the big guns.

    To me (at the time, when I was teen) it was like reading a JLA book without Superman & Batman - what was the point.

    Now of course big guns is subjective to different fans, but to me it was ol' web-head and the Canucklehead

  10. #775
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    The point is to read about other heroes instead of the two that are already popular and overused. That's why it's a Marvel universe, not just 2 dudes

  11. #776
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CosmiComic View Post
    The point is to read about other heroes instead of the two that are already popular and overused. That's why it's a Marvel universe, not just 2 dudes
    Tell a teenager," Here kid! Take this book has none of the heroes you like!"

    That's the POV I along with others had

  12. #777
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    Quote Originally Posted by charliehustle415 View Post
    Tell a teenager," Here kid! Take this book has none of the heroes you like!"

    That's the POV I along with others had
    That's fine but there's also trying new things. I don't want to just read the same 2 guys over again, especially when they're the most 'tropey' heroes

  13. #778
    Relaunched, not rebooted! SJNeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    Mark Waid has gotten the book cancelled three times as its writer.
    Lol, no. Waid's first "run" (vol. 1 #400-402) happened when Marvel was already canceling all of its flagship books to make way for the dreadful "Heroes Reborn"; Waid was brought it to wrap up a series that was already ending.

    Moving to modern times. Marvel doesn't technically cancel anything anymore when it comes to the big titles; they relaunch whenever a creative team has told their story, or editorial wants to take the book in a new direction.
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  14. #779
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    I’d just like to point that four of the characters Bendis wrecked because they weren’t popular enough are now among the most popular characters Marcel has that the public knows about. And as DC demonstrates, just because a character is popular doesn’t mean you need to shove him into as many books as you can and get something good out every time.

    And lastly the Canuck is overrated.

  15. #780
    see beauty in all things. charliehustle415's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saithor View Post
    I’d just like to point that four of the characters Bendis wrecked because they weren’t popular enough are now among the most popular characters Marcel has that the public knows about. And as DC demonstrates, just because a character is popular doesn’t mean you need to shove him into as many books as you can and get something good out every time.

    And lastly the Canuck is overrated.
    Maybe it's because of Bendis they are so popular

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