The Avengers Appreciation 2021

[Anthony Shaw]

I actually liked the Bendis era, especially post Civil War. I was annoyed after the events of Disassembled, as favorites were just tossed aside. It was different seeing the team divided, with Osborn as the top cop. Having Steve Rogers & Thor gone during such a tumultuous period was interesting.

I prefer the Bendis era over the Hickman run. The Hickman run bored me so much that I have trades I have yet to read.

Despite being labeled a street team, the Cage line-ups were no weaker than previous rosters, especially during the silver age.

[Nomads1]

While not, for me, the worst of all Avengers runs, Bendis was the one that made me stop reading Avengers, after decades of it being my favorite Marvel book, through good and bad. We were just comming out of Austen's attrocious run (that, for me, was the worst of all, though much more typically Avengery than Bendis'), and we had a new up and comming writer, of whom I had heard good things over at Daredevil (which was a character I've very rarely followed), and whose first TPB of Ultimate Spider-Man I had read and found okay (nothing great, but an okay read. Spidey is another character I only follow occasionally, so I never went beyond the first TPB), together with David Finch, which was another up and commer at the time, so I was fairly excited to see where Marvel was going with that (and relieved that we were finally getting rid of Austen). Well, then came Avengers #500 and right out of the bat, with that moronic bragging talk of Hawkeye saying who he'd bag or not, I was WTF? But, fine, they were trying (and failing miserably in my eyes) to be hip, modern and cutting edge, edgy. Let's give it a chance. What came next, sold as the worst day in Avengers history, came as something written by someone who had never read an Avengers book, or as someone who had, and thought that no one else had, so he could pass other people's much better stories as his (The Destruction of Avengers Mansion - Under Siege and Acts of Vengeance - which he ripped off again in the Cabal, Scarlet Witch going bat-**** crazy and turning on the team - Darker Than Scarlet, a couple of pointless and throw away deaths - pick your choice - Swordsman, Mockingbird, Iron Man, Dr Druid, etc..., the Disbanding of the Team - Walt Simonson's short run, and he also came up with, IMHO, a much better odd Avengers tgeam to replace them). When I saw the adds for his New Avengers line-up, and I saw Spider-Man (which I was fine with) and Wolverine (which I was not) in it, I thought: Shameless money grabbing. And then Bendis started to brag, wait till you see the reason for Wolverine to be on the team, it'll totally make sense. And it didn't (so, his excuse was that WWII veteran Captain America and former weapons dealer known for his ruthlessness Tony Stark, aka Iron Man, would be too skimish to dirty their own hands in some jobs, and would want a killer like Wolverine around to do it, while they looked the other way and could come up smelling like roses. Yeah, That really makes sense... NOT). Still I gave it a shot. Untill the Avengers faced the terrible world-shaking threat of... NINJAS! And they had trouble dealing with them. More than once! The same guys who used to face Loki, Ultron, Immortus, Kang, The Masters of Evil, Thanos, The Zodiac Cartel, etc... That was it for me! I knew it wouldn't get better. Still, being a loyal fan, I stuck with it, The post-Civil War team was, IMHO, pathetically street-level, even with Doc Strange, who was soon crippled. The Post-Secret Invasion (which was nothing more than Bendis ripping off Alan Davis' X-Men run) team was, IMHO, the best Avengers team Bendis put together,(Cage, Ms. Marvel, Spider-Woman, Spider-Man, Cap Bucky, Mockingbird, Ronin, Wolverine and, occasionally, Iron Fist) and it had potential, but, once again, it was not exciting enough (and at that time it was already Norman and the Hood taking turns at the team, and pretty much nothing else). When the New Avengers defeated Nefaria, I repeat, COUNT NEFARIA, by firing bullets at him, and then have Wolverine scratch his face, and Ms Marvel deck him (when THOR, Vision, Wonder Man, She-Hulk, Iron-Man, and Ms Marvel herself, couldn't do it before), there was no doubt in my mind that Bendis would NEVER be able to write a good team book. So, when the book split and relaunched, definitly ending the uniqueness of being an Avenger, with Spider-Man and Wolverine on both teams (MONEY GRAB!!!!), I gave up and stopped reading the book. After that, I came and leaft a few times. Despite all it grandiosity, Hickman's run really didn't excite me. I liked Slott's run during Dark Reign, short as it was. Came back for Waid's, but I've always hated teens in the Avengers. They're supposed to be a team of pros. Liked Waid's better when they left, but, once again, too short. Started to read Aaron's, but it bored me to death, so I stopped reading after the second arc or so. Let's see who'll come next.

Peace

[Triniking1234]

Waid's recent run kept getting side-tracked by nonsense.

[Frontier]

I actually liked the Bendis era, especially post Civil War. I was annoyed after the events of Disassembled, as favorites were just tossed aside. It was different seeing the team divided, with Osborn as the top cop. Having Steve Rogers & Thor gone during such a tumultuous period was interesting.

I prefer the Bendis era over the Hickman run. The Hickman run bored me so much that I have trades I have yet to read.

Despite being labeled a street team, the Cage line-ups were no weaker than previous rosters, especially during the silver age.

I think it wasn't just the roster (that Bendis kept putting his favorite street-levelers onto) but the threats they were fighting too.

Waid's recent run kept getting side-tracked by nonsense.

Yeah, Waid's run kind of got slipped out from under him right as it was getting going.

[PetPigeon]

What is Avengers even right now? I picked up a few issues for this Phoenix story and,........wow.....it's bad. Even the art is tragic.

[gurkle]

The reason I think Bendis's Avengers run is better than Hickman's is that Hickman (and Aaron) wrote the Avengers as if they had no identity or lore as a team -- they were just a generic supergroup.

Bendis acknowledged that the Avengers had a history and a way of doing things, and the point of his run was that the old ways didn't work any more. There was usually someone on hand to point out that this isn't what the Avengers used to be like.

There's a lot not to like about Bendis's New Avengers, especially if you count "Avengers Disassembled" as part of it, but I think he did understand that the Avengers aren't just about the missions, they're about traditions.

[Frontier]

The reason I think Bendis's Avengers run is better than Hickman's is that Hickman (and Aaron) wrote the Avengers as if they had no identity or lore as a team -- they were just a generic supergroup.

Bendis acknowledged that the Avengers had a history and a way of doing things, and the point of his run was that the old ways didn't work any more. There was usually someone on hand to point out that this isn't what the Avengers used to be like.

There's a lot not to like about Bendis's New Avengers, especially if you count "Avengers Disassembled" as part of it, but I think he did understand that the Avengers aren't just about the missions, they're about traditions.

For Hickman the Avengers were just a means to an end for his Secret Wars storyline. They weren't even relevant to the resolution aside from Black Panther.

I think Bendis acknowledged Avengers history but that doesn't mean he necessarily used it well (and was more than open to ignoring it when it came to his stories/characterizations).

[Anthony Shaw]

I think it wasn't just the roster (that Bendis kept putting his favorite street-levelers onto) but the threats they were fighting too.

I see where you are coming from. As a fan of Norman Osborn, I enjoyed his push, and elevation as an Avengers level threat. It also served as reminder, to me, how important the classic Avengers were in keeping the world stable. I liked how events in the Bendis books were felt across various titles. Even the X-Men had to deal with fallout from Avengers related events. Never thought I'd see Osborn vs Stark, and especially Osborn vs Cyclops.

I love it when the Marvel Universe feels like the Marvel Universe.

I actually loved the Siege of Asgard, when the band finally came together, and put Osborn down.

[Jabare]

love it or hate it Bendis run was pretty legendary. He cemented Spider-Man and Wolverine as Avengers and crafted some of the iconic events in Marvel history.

-Civil War
-Secret Invasion
-Dark Reign
-Jessica Jones
-Miles Morales
-Ultimate Spider-Man
-House of M
-putting Sentry on the map
-the resurgence of 616 Luke Cage

Those are all his fingerprints and Marvel quickly turned around and reworked those ideas for film and TV. We can debate his methods and his approach but his books were selling like flapjacks for a good 10 years. Yeah he had other runs and I didn't read everything, so maybe I left out a few but this guy was a pillar of Marvel for a decade plus. Right now as thing stands this man is easily in the top 15 of most influential Marvel writers.

Will see how Naomi fairs at DC

[Shadowcat]

Bendis’ run was garbage. I stopped reading it because of him, despite me loving Luke and Spider-Woman.

[Anthony Shaw]

love it or hate it Bendis run was pretty legendary. He cemented Spider-Man and Wolverine as Avengers and crafted some of the iconic events in Marvel history.

-Civil War
-Secret Invasion
-Dark Reign
-Jessica Jones
-Miles Morales
-Ultimate Spider-Man
-House of M
-putting Sentry on the map
-the resurgence of 616 Luke Cage

Those are all his fingerprints and Marvel quickly turned around and reworked those ideas for film and TV. We can debate his methods and his approach but his books were selling like flapjacks for a good 10 years. Yeah he had other runs and I didn't read everything, so maybe I left out a few but this guy was a pillar of Marvel for a decade plus. Right now as thing stands this man is easily in the top 15 of most influential Marvel writers.

Will see how Naomi fairs at DC

I agree. My issue is that while Bendis has flaws, no one has yet to really set the course for the Marvel Universe since he left.

Sure, other writers are better, but he rode a wave of success yet to be really duplicated since his departure.

I keep hoping that a writer, or a team of writers come up with a plan to make the MU interesting again.

Perhaps Al Ewing will emerge as the top writer, but certainly not Jason Aaron.

[Nomads1]

Waid's recent run kept getting side-tracked by nonsense.

It's the new Marvel way. Hate him or love him (and I fall more in the former category), Bendis at least was calling the shots, which, in some way, was a plus for the Avengers. Ever since him, I don't think anyone has had the editorial support and leeway he enjoyed.

Peace

[GenericUsername]

Bendis' run made me quit reading Avengers for a while. It wasn't just what he did to my favorite character and the Avengers overall. I couldn't stand his approach to dialog.

[Triniking1234]

New Avengers came out when I was a teen and Bendis did stuff I liked up until Fear Itself.

[Frontier]

I see where you are coming from. As a fan of Norman Osborn, I enjoyed his push, and elevation as an Avengers level threat. It also served as reminder, to me, how important the classic Avengers were in keeping the world stable. I liked how events in the Bendis books were felt across various titles. Even the X-Men had to deal with fallout from Avengers related events. Never thought I'd see Osborn vs Stark, and especially Osborn vs Cyclops.

I love it when the Marvel Universe feels like the Marvel Universe.

I actually loved the Siege of Asgard, when the band finally came together, and put Osborn down.

He definitely drove the universe to a major degree with his run, for better or worse, although he couldn't keep Osborn going after Dark Reign.

I liked Siege up until the anti-climax of an ending (and the onset for the conflict was kind of dumb, admittedly).